Poll: Should a separate forum be created for discussing grading issues?

[fantastic_four]

Whenever I spend a few days or a week away from these forums, I usually come home to find 1,000 to 2,000 new messages have been posted. I usually like to read any posts that have to do with either grading or restoration, so I usually end up spending 3-5 hours filtering through posts looking for those related to that topic.

 

I have a feeling the CGC graders have the same problem. For a while in mid-2002, when the number of new posts per day in the "Comics General" forum was well under 100, Borock and Plitch appeared to read and post there rather frequently. Since the post volume has become somewhat overwhelmingly large, I rarely see them post. I'm thinking that the grading issues that we'd like for them to see the most should go into their own forum for two reasons:

• To make it easier to find them
• So that they don't "fall off the end of the board," i.e. get buried under a pile of 150 posts about Rickdogg's or Bugaboo's latest ramblings (not that those ramblings aren't kinda fun to read! )

I'm thinking that Architect should create a separate forum titled something along the lines of "Grading Issues," or perhaps "Grading and Restoration Issues." What do you think? If you have alternate ideas for a forum name, please reply with those. Now here's the poll:

 

 

 

[drbanner]

Yes. BTW - where did you get the grading guide - a comic store, a bookstore chain (B&N?), or elsewhere? My local store doesn't appear to have received it this week...

[FlyingDonut]

The Official Overstreet Comic Book Grading Guide on Amazon.

[drbanner]

Yeah, but it says "Availability: Not yet published"

 

[Bugaboo-migration]

get buried under a pile of 150 posts about Rickdogg's or Bugaboo's latest ramblings.

Ramblings?..........Ramblings?..........I'll have you know Sir..........those are not ramblings.........they are rantings........and they happen to be very educational to those people in here who study the art form of proper ranting.

 

BTW......I voted to add a seperate forum for you (the second one)........I think it's a good idea too.

[CosmicBob]

I think it should just be "Grading Issues" because we'd be dicsussing issues as they related to grading and restoration is only part of the criteria for grading. A forum with "Restoration" in the title might cause confusion in that someone might think we would be talking about restoration and how to spot it or how to do it.

 

But, either way, it would be nice to have a seperate forum.

[ArnoldTBlumberg]

I think it's going to be out in comic shops and through Previews this week, around the 18th I believe. But it won't be available in the mass market bookstore edition through Random House (likely the one that's available through Amazon) until January.

 

Right now, it's turning up in the hands of those lucky select few who have received comp copies for their invaluable contributions to the production of the Guide, but rest assured it will be out there for everyone shortly.

 

 

[PovertyRow]

I think it should just be "Grading Issues" because we'd be dicsussing issues as they related to grading and restoration is only part of the criteria for grading. A forum with "Restoration" in the title might cause confusion in that someone might think we would be talking about restoration and how to spot it or how to do it.

 

I chose just Grading Issues for the same reason. Restoration would be a factor in grading, but to specify Restoration would probably cause most new Restoration topics to be oput there. Since Grading tends to take the largest volume here, Restoration would probably be lost in the bulk.

 

[fantastic_four]

Restoration would be a factor in grading, but to specify Restoration would probably cause most new Restoration topics to be oput there

That's exactly what I would like--for restoration topics to be posted there. That's why I voted for "Grading and Restoration Issues" as a name.

 

If restoration threads didn't go into this proposed new forum, where would they go? Right now they're split between Comics General and the Golden Age forums. I fear that if a forum is simply titled "Grading Issues," then they'll be split between three forums instead of the two they currently are.

 

When I first joined this board back in March, the hope of getting into discussions about restoration was the primary reason I posted. Information about restoration and restoration detection is sorely lacking. I have yet to talk to a national dealer who hasn't gotten burned by it. Any collector who buys an unslabbed comic worth more than $200 is taking a risk of getting a restored book. Widespread info about detecting and understanding restoration is so far overdue and so fundamentally needed by the collecting community that it gives me a headache thinking about it! If you talk to stamp collectors, you'll find that the maturity of that hobby, which has been around for 100+ years, has led to restoration and restoration detection becoming a topic that many stamp store owners can discuss. Just try going to your local comic shop to talk about comic book restoration; you'll most often get blank stares and/or puzzled looks, and very little help that will get you productively hunting out the work of the greedy slight restorers out there. When I went looking for black lights in my local area, where did I find them? Well, there are 12 comic shops in my area and two stamp stores; none of the comic shops had a clue, but the stamp stores had several RayTech lamps to choose from and more that they offered to order me from their catalog.

 

Architect can only manage a limited number of forums; that's why I grouped restoration and grading together as explicit parts of the title. To make sure posts ended up in the right place, especially given the importance of information about restoration to vintage collectors--not to mention dealers! I can count the number of dealers that I'd trust to accurately assess restoration on one hand. And some of the people I wouldn't count on that hand have even done a bit of restoration work themselves! Slight work can be really tough to catch. Grading can be learned in a few years...but where do you learn enough about restoration to not get burned at shows? There is virtually no source for this information that is helpful anywhere beyond an introductory level.

 

I know you understand what I'm talking about with regards to restoration, poverty...how much did that class I think I remember you mentioning cost to attend?

[CosmicBob]

Widespread info about detecting and understanding restoration is so far overdue and so fundamentally needed by the collecting community that it gives me a headache thinking about it!

 

That's quite true, but I think those are seperate issues from grading. They're very important in an of themselves and should be discussed more in depth. I think they should have their own forum, so I would vote for two new forums, "Grading Issues" and "Restoration".

[PovertyRow]

Move SF1D9\STDMGMT to new volume on the filer for space considerations.

 

In retrospect I may have mis-interpreted the intent of the Grading Issues forum. If it is to discuss grading concepts, how to etc, then I agree that restoration would be a good thing to include. Especially since a knolwedge if restoration detection is important in learning to accurately grade. Is that what you're thinking. FF? If so, then count me in.

 

If this Grading folder is going to be filled mainly with the "What grade do you think this is?" and "This was CGC graded - guess what they gave it." , I would like to not see Restoration put in there.

 

So I guess I need some clarification as to the content you have in mind.

 

I didn't take a class in restoration. I spent time in a restorer's studio, getting instruction, practicing techniques and working on my own books under their guidance.

[Architecht]

Actually, I'd lean more towards creating a separate forum for ebay auctions you think are weird, how much should I pay for this, I just bought this did I get ripped, who is a good dealer to use, how would you grade this book that I want to sell, etc. etc.

 

Perhaps call it

General Commerce, or

The Business Side, or

Buying and Selling

 

Arch

[blowout]

"Actually, I'd lean more towards creating a separate forum for ebay auctions you think are weird, how much should I pay for this, I just bought this did I get ripped, who is a good dealer to use, how would you grade this book that I want to sell, etc. etc."

 

i don't think this type of category would free up the comics general forum in the way james is suggesting. a forum to cover all the things you just mentioned would have to be called something like..........lets see..........'comics general'

 

i think the idea for a creation of 'grading issues and restoration' is an excellent idea, chalk me up as all in favour.

 

[lighthouse]

I think it's going to be out in comic shops and through Previews this week, around the 18th I believe.

 

Just to let you know... It is NOT shipping through Diamond this week. So hopefully it will be in next week's shipments... I know a lot of people are really looking forward to see it...

[ArnoldTBlumberg]

Well, just shows what I know. I just write 'em, I don't ship 'em.

[lighthouse]

I think a forum for grading issues / questions would be a good idea.

 

Personally, I really enjoy the threads with grading quizzes, and the discussions of acceptable flaws and restoration have been quite informative. I agree with FF that these threads tend to get buried under the cracksmoking-seller discussions...

 

Unlike coins and cards, we are dealing with dozens of surfaces and edges on each item, and the grading is inherently more complicated. Having a forum for those discussions sounds like a great idea.

[fantastic_four]

Yea I wouldn't mind grading quizzes getting mixed in there either. They're an exercise in grading consistency. I just wish people would do them well; if they don't have detailed defect descriptions listed with the scan, it's a shoot in the dark.

 

PovertyRow -- Your last description of my idea for a new forum is right on. However, ultimately, it doesn't really matter what my concept for a forum called "Grading Issues" or "Grading and Restoration Issues" would be; once it's named and set up, people stick whatever they want in there. All you can do is name and describe it the best way possible. Any topic loosely related to grading would be fair game unless you create several much more specific forums.

 

Architect -- Murph suggested creating an "EBay related stuff" forum a few months ago (search for a thread called "EBay related stuff"), but the thread got mauled by discussions about notch_top and the "coming out party" for the anonymous poster who was soon to become Methuselah. That type of forum would certainly free up the "Comics General" forum a lot. The "Comics General" forum is definitely overcrowded; I'm in the habit now of only clicking on the forum only when I know I have a free hour or two to spare, since once you go into a forum the counters for new messages go away on threads whether you actually go into those threads or not. Too many new posts, not enough time!

[tb]

Great idea! I personally enjoy the cracksmoking prepubescent fartjokes and German-bashing; it is painful to watch grading quizzes and restoration discussions wash the noiz-2-signal down the tubes.

 

[The_Man_Of_Steel]

IMO, the current setup is fine. You can divide this board up into 100 catagories, but that's not going to stop people from posting topics or posts that are more realated to another forum. IMO, there are a good deal of threads in this forum that would be better suited in other existing forums. IMO, the better solution would be for each of us to take responsibility of where we post our topics. But the truth is, neither of our solutions is a "full proof" way of keeping topics/posts "on-topic". Maybe the "Hooked on Phonics" course would help you to read faster.

[The_Man_Of_Steel]

If you want to see a board that is OVERLY broken down, just go to the WizardWorld.com messageboard. I can think of a forum (try and find the "whatever" forum) that I didn't even know existed until I had been posting there for at least a month! The WizardWorld messageboard has been an UNmoderated messageboard for some time now, and it's also a very dead messageboard. I rubbed a little pie in their face recently though, when I posted an article about the corruption of 800America.com which will eventually lead to the closing down of WizardWorld. I couldn't help it though, I had my reasons.