Sketch Covers vs Original Art Debate

[Baron]

Does anyone have a thread that you can point me to or a list of all the variant blank sketch covers issues that the major publishers have put out to date?

[Par2ch]

[alphatrion1]

dan you alien, what is the last cover next to the defenders?

[Par2ch]

Its not a cover, its the bottom of Ghost Rider #1

[Ares]

Its not a cover, its the bottom of Ghost Rider #1

I thought it was the cover to iceman fighting wendigo in a snowstorm

[devilsrain]

The debate should never have been between published OA and sketch covers.

 

It should be between OA and sketch covers. And even though theyre both OA the sketch covers or backboards have more of an appeal (at least to me) in that they can be authenticated by CGC

 

I can get Castrillo right now to recreate that wolverine page and you wouldnt know the difference.

 

If you prefer authenticated CGC sketch covers and drawings on backing boards to published original art, then by all means pursue that avenue. But don't somehow try to convince yourself that you're playing in the same sandbox with the thousands of original comic art collectors out there. Ten years from now, sketch covers will be in the bargain bin with the rest of the manufactured collectibles, and original comic book art will still be what it is now.

 

Its been a while since I visited this area of the CGC forums. Let me address this post.

 

I do prefer CGC sketch covers to published art and will continue to pursue that avenue.

 

I wasn't trying to convince myself I already accomplished that.

 

You have no idea what will happen in ten years. Sketch covers in the bargain bin eh? You are going to sit there and tell me a sketch by a legend like Joe Simon will be in the bargain bin? Put the crack pipe down.

 

Out of spite I might commission some of those precious published OA covers and release them into the field. But but but how will you know if they are real?

 

 

 

[AKA Rick]

Original Published Art are more inline with the vast majority of what the collectors in the hobby want and are willing to spend money on, therefore is more suitable for the investor.

 

Original Sketch Cover art is more inline with the hobby collectors and fans, who sometimes plays the role of "Art Director" (Where else can you find a rendering of "Buffy the Vampire Slayer VS Vampirella" or "Iron-Man VS Darth Vader") to get something created for them, which has individual and personal attachment.

 

Some commissions of of such unique appeal or are beautiful renderings by relatively unknown artists who will never become mainstream popular, but that's okay if you plan on keeping the artwork and appreciating it in that sprit.

 

Whereas with original published artwork, there's fans of a series and of characters, so sub-par renderings or artwork by relatively unknown artists whose careers have come and gone still have a greater chance of commanding greater demand and price value based on the legacy and status of being a published piece over a "man made" collectible such as a commission, be it a sketch card, a sketch cover, re-creation or on any format.

 

Herb Trimpe has done countless commissioned recreations of the Incredible Hulk #181 cover, on various mediums, and none will ever come close to the demand or value of the original artwork to the published OA of Hulk #181. Keep in mind, the commissioned pieces may be authenticated, and they are indeed hand drawn and one of a kind (so the scarcity factor is a level playing field of that 1 of 1), but the simple demand for the original published art is simply greater and people are willing to pay more, and a lot more for that. Again, that's from an economic and maybe greedy/investor mentality.

 

I know a guy who kept telling me, for the price it costs to get a John Byrne published "Uncanny X-Men" page, I could get John Byrne commission several X-Men cover recreations, pin-ups or art direct a piece with my favorite characters and that would still cost a fraction of what an original published page would cost. I think the published art carries more nostalgia, and prestige to a lot of collectors.

 

If I had $100,000 to invest in sketch covers OR to invest in original published artwork, and I got to choose what artists to get, from a fan's perspective, maybe the sketch covers will provide the quantity (and possibly even quality in rendering) some are looking for, but if i'm looking at it from an investment standpoint and something that in 10 years is going to be evaluated and sold for profit, my money is on the published art over the sketch covers as my personal opinion.

 

Look at the Todd McFarlane artwork sold via Heritage. I doubt any sketch cover or commission would ever come close to the $250k-500k+ those pieces of original art commanded. I'm not sure how much the original art cost back in 1990, but I'm sure whatever it was, 20 years later, today, the return on investment is greater than imagined. Of course that's the needle in a haystack, exception to the rule, since for every 1990's McFarlane, there's a 1990's dreg artist whose work is barely worth the paper it's printed on.

[Dr. Balls]

The debate should never have been between published OA and sketch covers.

 

It should be between OA and sketch covers. And even though theyre both OA the sketch covers or backboards have more of an appeal (at least to me) in that they can be authenticated by CGC

 

I can get Castrillo right now to recreate that wolverine page and you wouldnt know the difference.

If you prefer authenticated CGC sketch covers and drawings on backing boards to published original art, then by all means pursue that avenue. But don't somehow try to convince yourself that you're playing in the same sandbox with the thousands of original comic art collectors out there. Ten years from now, sketch covers will be in the bargain bin with the rest of the manufactured collectibles, and original comic book art will still be what it is now.

 

Spoken like a collector who doesn't have any original art pages of Bishop's sister Shard, drawn by a well-known 90's artist who gave up comics to draw sequential art in Hollywood. By your calculations, those pages should have maintained their value 15 years after I bought them. Perhaps if you could find someone who even knew who Shard was - maybe.

 

Saying *all* original art is still going to be valuable a decade from now just because it's published is inaccurate. There's just too much of it, and if an artist doesn't succeed or is regarded as noteworthy - that OA is devalued once the subject, character or comic is out of vogue. Just ask people who own Silver Sable OA. It's a gamble, just like everything else labeled as 'collectible'.

 

It's pretty ignorant to say that any original artwork will be patently put into the bargain bin, simply because it's in a format you aren't interested in. Unless you're collecting original Picassos - you're not really in a position of chastising someone for collecting one kind of artwork over another.

[Webhead1981]

Original Published Art are more inline with the vast majority of what the collectors in the hobby want and are willing to spend money on, therefore is more suitable for the investor.

 

Original Sketch Cover art is more inline with the hobby collectors and fans, who sometimes plays the role of "Art Director" (Where else can you find a rendering of "Buffy the Vampire Slayer VS Vampirella" or "Iron-Man VS Darth Vader") to get something created for them, which has individual and personal attachment.

 

Some commissions of of such unique appeal or are beautiful renderings by relatively unknown artists who will never become mainstream popular, but that's okay if you plan on keeping the artwork and appreciating it in that sprit.

 

Whereas with original published artwork, there's fans of a series and of characters, so sub-par renderings or artwork by relatively unknown artists whose careers have come and gone still have a greater chance of commanding greater demand and price value based on the legacy and status of being a published piece over a "man made" collectible such as a commission, be it a sketch card, a sketch cover, re-creation or on any format.

 

Herb Trimpe has done countless commissioned recreations of the Incredible Hulk #181 cover, on various mediums, and none will ever come close to the demand or value of the original artwork to the published OA of Hulk #181. Keep in mind, the commissioned pieces may be authenticated, and they are indeed hand drawn and one of a kind (so the scarcity factor is a level playing field of that 1 of 1), but the simple demand for the original published art is simply greater and people are willing to pay more, and a lot more for that. Again, that's from an economic and maybe greedy/investor mentality.

 

I know a guy who kept telling me, for the price it costs to get a John Byrne published "Uncanny X-Men" page, I could get John Byrne commission several X-Men cover recreations, pin-ups or art direct a piece with my favorite characters and that would still cost a fraction of what an original published page would cost. I think the published art carries more nostalgia, and prestige to a lot of collectors.

 

If I had $100,000 to invest in sketch covers OR to invest in original published artwork, and I got to choose what artists to get, from a fan's perspective, maybe the sketch covers will provide the quantity (and possibly even quality in rendering) some are looking for, but if i'm looking at it from an investment standpoint and something that in 10 years is going to be evaluated and sold for profit, my money is on the published art over the sketch covers as my personal opinion.

 

Look at the Todd McFarlane artwork sold via Heritage. I doubt any sketch cover or commission would ever come close to the $250k-500k+ those pieces of original art commanded. I'm not sure how much the original art cost back in 1990, but I'm sure whatever it was, 20 years later, today, the return on investment is greater than imagined. Of course that's the needle in a haystack, exception to the rule, since for every 1990's McFarlane, there's a 1990's dreg artist whose work is barely worth the paper it's printed on.

 

This is a very well put post. I really do agree with most of i. Mainly that original art of published pages like the recent McFarlane art is for investors, and sketch covers are for the fans who want to own a less expensive original piece of art from one of their favorite artist. Personally original published art interest me very little. Sketch covers on the other hand is something unique, that was created for you by a Pro, while it may not increase in any substantial value like original art, the personalization of it is what is important to a long time fan like myself.

[DrWatson]

LOOKS LIKE ART to me

Actually, the guy who has comicartfans.com has helped to create a site to display graded books and graded sketch covers; www.myslabbedcomics.com, as they don't really belong on comicartfans.com, in my opinion.

[Webhead1981]

LOOKS LIKE ART to me

Actually, the guy who has comicartfans.com has helped to create a site to display graded books and graded sketch covers; www.myslabbedcomics.com, as they don't really belong on comicartfans.com, in my opinion.

 

As I don't believe in slabbing modern comics, I'll continue to post my ungraded sketch covers in my CAF gallery.

 

If a professional artist creates it, it is art no matter what the surface he/she creates their work on. In my view.

[mister_not_so_nice]

LOOKS LIKE ART to me

Actually, the guy who has comicartfans.com has helped to create a site to display graded books and graded sketch covers; www.myslabbedcomics.com, as they don't really belong on comicartfans.com, in my opinion.

 

Drawings in a sketchbook, or on any manner of material are fine on CAF, but a sketch cover slab is not?

I am REALLY interested in the reasoning behind this.

 

I would hardly consider a blank comic that an artist has taken the time to do his art on in the same category as a normal graded book.

[Trev]

I will share a story from San Diego that just reinforced it for me. There was one artist that I really wanted to get some art from -- I was thinking something on a sketch cover or a commission. I had bought all these blank covers over the years, but only a few were done. Meanwhile, my OA collection had grown.

 

Anyway, his price was like 40% more than I had seen before (it was SDCC, after all), AND that was for a head only. He wasn't doing busts, 3/4 figure, or anything else. And if you wanted heavy detail, it was $100 more. Guys were throwing sketch covers at him left and right.

 

After a couple of minutes, I say to him 'did you happen to bring any OA?' Why, yes, he did. He pulls it out from under his table and I pick out an awesome page with like 8 different characters, backgrounds, 'heavy' detail, of what have become some of his most famous creations plus two classic characters, AND it had been published. $50 more than his detailed head sketch commission.

 

NO BRAINER. I left with a page of OA.

 

Sketch covers for me are best done by up and coming artists or guys in artist's alley with self published or small press stuff whose art strikes you. There is low risk/high reward in that scenario.

 

Established artists -- I think there is better value in OA. Commission rates have rise too quickly for them.

[Imodium]

I collect both and enjoy doing such. If I cant afford OA from a certian artist but can get started with a sketch on a blank. Bingo at least I have something from that artist then nothing...as my collection grows or my taste for a certian artist then I will make that leap to OA...and step away from the blanks. So for me the blanks got me started into OA in the first place...its my "gateway drug" (thumbs u

[Dr. Balls]

After a couple of minutes, I say to him 'did you happen to bring any OA?' Why, yes, he did. He pulls it out from under his table and I pick out an awesome page with like 8 different characters, backgrounds, 'heavy' detail, of what have become some of his most famous creations plus two classic characters, AND it had been published. $50 more than his detailed head sketch commission.

 

This is all well and good when you actually can go to conventions - the problem being for collectors (such as myself) who are 800+ miles away from conventions, and have to plan small vacations to go to them. My only option is to buy someone elses' commission or OA, and 99% of the time it's at a markup.

 

Being that this is the Boards - a lot of collectors here live in a bubble, thinking that everyone has the same type of access to everything comics, when they do not. Sketch covers provide another alternate form of collecting art, and in some cases - can be quite masterful in their smaller format, and sometimes more affordable than their OA counterparts.

 

I think the same principals to buying OA apply to sketch covers. Buying a specimen that exemplifies the artists' style, quality, detail, craftsmanship and subject matter is still going to be a good art investment.

[Pirate]

if you have internet, you have access. I don't think I have purchased one page of OA at a convention in person. Most artists or their reps are accessible via the internet. If you can get a sketch cover set up, you can find out what OA they have. Of course dealers mark up, but many have good payment terms or will trade for just about anything.

 

When sketch covers are resold on ebay and the boards, how many times is the seller breaking even or claiming a loss on it?

 

I think the initial sketch cover thing was that people thought they were a much better deal than a full commission or page of OA. Artists have gotten smart, who wouldn't want to draw a small picture and get the same price as they would for an 11x17?

[comix4fun]

After a couple of minutes, I say to him 'did you happen to bring any OA?' Why, yes, he did. He pulls it out from under his table and I pick out an awesome page with like 8 different characters, backgrounds, 'heavy' detail, of what have become some of his most famous creations plus two classic characters, AND it had been published. $50 more than his detailed head sketch commission.

 

This is all well and good when you actually can go to conventions - the problem being for collectors (such as myself) who are 800+ miles away from conventions, and have to plan small vacations to go to them. My only option is to buy someone elses' commission or OA, and 99% of the time it's at a markup.

 

Being that this is the Boards - a lot of collectors here live in a bubble, thinking that everyone has the same type of access to everything comics, when they do not. Sketch covers provide another alternate form of collecting art, and in some cases - can be quite masterful in their smaller format, and sometimes more affordable than their OA counterparts.

 

I think the same principals to buying OA apply to sketch covers. Buying a specimen that exemplifies the artists' style, quality, detail, craftsmanship and subject matter is still going to be a good art investment.

 

 

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