Will artist's signature on comic book detract from final grade

[BrianC]

I have a comic book I would like to have graded. It is New Mutants #87. However it has Liefeld’s signature on it in silver sharpie. I am guessing the comic will grade a 9.0 - 9.2. If so, will the signature detract from the final grade?

[USArmyParatrooper]

If the book has a signature on the front and is of a low grade it will receive a Blue, Universal label and the signature will affect the grade of the book (depending on the size, how much it disrupts the cover etc.). If the signature is on the interior of the book only, then it will receive a Blue Universal label regardless of grade and the signature will affect the grade of the book (less than if it were on the cover, however).

 

In your case I believe you would be looking at a Green "qualified" label without a numeric downgrade.

[BrianC]

thank you.

[TupennyConan]

I love threads challenging the SS crowd. It's fun.

[USArmyParatrooper]

thank you.

 

BTW. welcome to the board.

 

Since you're new I just want to make sure you know the significance of a the Green "Qualified" CGC label. It means the comic has a "problem" (for lack of a better term), such as a coupon that's been cut out or in your case an unwitnessed signature. It adversely affects the value.

 

It will say, " "Rob Liefeld" written on the cover in ink" or if it's ineligible, "Name written on the cover in ink"

[conditionfreak]

So.... A persons name written in ink on the cover of a book, that was witnessed being signed by a CGC "witness", is not counted as a drop in grade.

 

But....A book with "Billy Wright" or "Edgar Church" written on the cover, IS downgraded for the signature?

 

I get it....

 

No wait....

 

I don't get it.

[seanfingh]

So.... A persons name written in ink on the cover of a book, that was witnessed being signed by a CGC "witness", is not counted as a drop in grade.

 

But....A book with "Billy Wright" or "Edgar Church" written on the cover, IS downgraded for the signature?

 

I get it....

 

No wait....

 

I don't get it.

 

The Yellow label is a Qualified grade, not a Universal grade. It provides for the grade of the comic without any consideration for the signature.

[USArmyParatrooper]

So.... A persons name written in ink on the cover of a book, that was witnessed being signed by a CGC "witness", is not counted as a drop in grade.

 

But....A book with "Billy Wright" or "Edgar Church" written on the cover, IS downgraded for the signature?

 

I get it....

 

No wait....

 

I don't get it.

 

[USArmyParatrooper]

So.... A persons name written in ink on the cover of a book, that was witnessed being signed by a CGC "witness", is not counted as a drop in grade.

 

But....A book with "Billy Wright" or "Edgar Church" written on the cover, IS downgraded for the signature?

 

I get it....

 

No wait....

 

I don't get it.

 

The Yellow label is a Qualified grade, not a Universal grade. It provides for the grade of the comic without any consideration for the signature.

 

Does CGC use the term, "Qualified" for yellow labels? Your explanation seems a bit confusing since Green labels are referred to as Qualified grades.

 

The yellow label is simply CGC authenticating that a particular person signed and/or put their artwork on a comic - while assessing the grade on the integrity of the comic itself (I know you know this, it wasn't for your benefit). But even that becomes a grey area, because they will downgrade the comic if the signature get smudged.

[conditionfreak]

So.... A persons name written in ink on the cover of a book, that was witnessed being signed by a CGC "witness", is not counted as a drop in grade.

 

But....A book with "Billy Wright" or "Edgar Church" written on the cover, IS downgraded for the signature?

 

I get it....

 

No wait....

 

I don't get it.

 

The Yellow label is a Qualified grade, not a Universal grade. It provides for the grade of the comic without any consideration for the signature.

 

Thanks for that info, but I already knew that of course.

 

My point was is that CGC SS 10.0's exist. The writing, if witnessed by a CGC "witness", does not affect the grade what-so-ever. But if I witnessed Stan Lee sign one of my books. His signature does deduct from the overall grade. Right?

 

I won't even ask if a Stan Lee cockroach drawing deducts from the overall grade of a book, if it is witnessed by a CGC witness. Of course it would not. It would be considered a "sketch". No matter how ugly, or the reason for it (maybe to cover up a bad signature or sketch?).

 

Oh the inhumanity.

 

[BrianC]

I just wish back in 2003 that I had bought the one without the signature. There were two New Mutants #87. One without a signature and one with a signature. the sig copy was $19.99 and I think the without sig was about the same price. O well. Live and learn.

[USArmyParatrooper]

 

Thanks for that info, but I already knew that of course.

 

My point was is that CGC SS 10.0's exist. The writing, if witnessed by a CGC "witness", does not affect the grade what-so-ever. But if I witnessed Stan Lee sign one of my books. His signature does deduct from the overall grade. Right?

 

I won't even ask if a Stan Lee cockroach drawing deducts from the overall grade of a book, if it is witnessed by a CGC witness. Of course it would not. It would be considered a "sketch". No matter how ugly, or the reason for it (maybe to cover up a bad signature or sketch?).

 

Oh the inhumanity.

 

Possibly. It will either affect the grade or it will receive a Green qualified label. I don't see why you disagree with them doing this though.

 

As for how ugly the sketch is, that's in the eye of the beholder. I would hope CGC wouldn't be giving their subjective opinions on the quality of art. They assign the comic a technical grade, and the rest of us can decide for ourselves how we feel about the art work.

[conditionfreak]

I disagree because writing on any part of a comic book, is a flaw. Intential or otherwise. Witnessed or otherwise. How can a comic book with scribble on the front cover (or a sketch), receive that same grade of the exact same book without wcribbling?

 

How come the repair of a bad signature or sketch, by sketching over it. Is not considered color touch?

 

Just making conversation. Not trying to change the world. We know that some have tried (and perhaps successfully), covering up some color touch with a signature or sketch. That should technically be restoration. Right?

 

But it is all about the revenue. For CGC and "us".

 

Always, always, follow the money.

[USArmyParatrooper]

I disagree because writing on any part of a comic book, is a flaw. Intential or otherwise. Witnessed or otherwise. How can a comic book with scribble on the front cover (or a sketch), receive that same grade of the exact same book without wcribbling?

 

How come the repair of a bad signature or sketch, by sketching over it. Is not considered color touch?

 

Just making conversation. Not trying to change the world. We know that some have tried (and perhaps successfully), covering up some color touch with a signature or sketch. That should technically be restoration. Right?

 

But it is all about the revenue. For CGC and "us".

 

Always, always, follow the money.

 

To you it's a flaw, and I see what you're saying. On technical merit there is writing on the comic just the same, whether it was Joe the Plumber or Jesus Christ himself who signed it.

 

But I think what CGC does now makes a lot more sense than saying, "We've witnessed and affirm that Alan Moore signed this copy of Swamp Thing 20. And BTW, since Alan Moore desecrated the comic we're lowering it from a 9.8 to a 9.2"

 

They verify the signature is real. They give the technical grade on the comic itself. They leave those types of perspectives up us to decide for ourselves.

 

 

[dupont2005]

I disagree because writing on any part of a comic book, is a flaw. Intential or otherwise. Witnessed or otherwise. How can a comic book with scribble on the front cover (or a sketch), receive that same grade of the exact same book without wcribbling?

 

How come the repair of a bad signature or sketch, by sketching over it. Is not considered color touch?

 

Just making conversation. Not trying to change the world. We know that some have tried (and perhaps successfully), covering up some color touch with a signature or sketch. That should technically be restoration. Right?

 

But it is all about the revenue. For CGC and "us".

 

Always, always, follow the money.

How do you feel about sketch covers? Covers that were intentionally left blank to display original art?

[conditionfreak]

I feel they can and should be what they are currently used for.

 

But they are a different breed of comic book cover. They should not be given a technical grade on structure. They should just be certified as having been witnessed as being done by so and so on such and such date.

 

What does the grade of such a comic book mean? Why have a grade at all. Is a Neal Adams sketched blank cover graded at 9.8, better than a Neal Adams sketched cover graded at 9.0?

 

Wouldn't it be all about the sketch, and the grade basically means nothing at all? If is a piece of krap, it will be obvious. If it is not, then it should be all about how nice the sketch looks and that it is certified as having actually been done by Adams himself.

[DiceX]

There is nothing you can do that will deface a Rob Liefeld book.

 

 

[Green]

So.... A persons name written in ink on the cover of a book, that was witnessed being signed by a CGC "witness", is not counted as a drop in grade.

 

But....A book with "Billy Wright" or "Edgar Church" written on the cover, IS downgraded for the signature?

 

I get it....

 

No wait....

 

I don't get it.

 

The Yellow label is a Qualified grade, not a Universal grade. It provides for the grade of the comic without any consideration for the signature.

 

Thanks for that info, but I already knew that of course.

 

My point was is that CGC SS 10.0's exist. The writing, if witnessed by a CGC "witness", does not affect the grade what-so-ever. But if I witnessed Stan Lee sign one of my books. His signature does deduct from the overall grade. Right?

 

If both are in a qualified label, neither will affect the grade on the label.

I won't even ask if a Stan Lee cockroach drawing deducts from the overall grade of a book, if it is witnessed by a CGC witness. Of course it would not. It would be considered a "sketch". No matter how ugly, or the reason for it (maybe to cover up a bad signature or sketch?).

 

Oh the inhumanity.

Incorrect. The 9.6 cockraoch spidey was a 9.8 and the submitter was told that the 'sketch' had affected the final grade. (likely because it was obvious it was a scribbled out sig)

[seanfingh]

 

Does CGC use the term, "Qualified" for yellow labels? Your explanation seems a bit confusing since Green labels are referred to as Qualified grades.

 

 

Yes, they do. In their written materials and on the website.

[conditionfreak]

So.... A persons name written in ink on the cover of a book, that was witnessed being signed by a CGC "witness", is not counted as a drop in grade.

 

But....A book with "Billy Wright" or "Edgar Church" written on the cover, IS downgraded for the signature?

 

I get it....

 

No wait....

 

I don't get it.

 

The Yellow label is a Qualified grade, not a Universal grade. It provides for the grade of the comic without any consideration for the signature.

 

Thanks for that info, but I already knew that of course.

 

My point was is that CGC SS 10.0's exist. The writing, if witnessed by a CGC "witness", does not affect the grade what-so-ever. But if I witnessed Stan Lee sign one of my books. His signature does deduct from the overall grade. Right?

 

If both are in a qualified label, neither will affect the grade on the label.

I won't even ask if a Stan Lee cockroach drawing deducts from the overall grade of a book, if it is witnessed by a CGC witness. Of course it would not. It would be considered a "sketch". No matter how ugly, or the reason for it (maybe to cover up a bad signature or sketch?).

 

Oh the inhumanity.

Incorrect. The 9.6 cockraoch spidey was a 9.8 and the submitter was told that the 'sketch' had affected the final grade. (likely because it was obvious it was a scribbled out sig)

 

hmmm....debating from the other side. How did CGC know that Lees intention was to draw a cockroach over the top of a signature, or not? Artistic expression and all. Seems just as valid a drawing as anything else. Not much different from drawing a sketch over artwork already on a books cover. If Adams sketches on a cover he drew, what's the difference?

 

I guess a judgement call.

 

But dropping a book from a 9.8 to a 9.6, for a mistake/mishap like that, is not much of a drop at all. Should have been a 7.0/7.5, IMO. That is the chance everyone who gets a high grade book signed takes.

 

I have many CGC SS books, but I have become soured about the concept over time. Seems to me to be ruining perfectly good high grade books, with writing that often can not even be read or deciphered, without the label telling you who signed it.

 

Oh well. I'm just one guy. It will not change anytime soon. Although it does make cracking them out to read, a very difficult choice.