Heritage Sells Batman #1 9.2 for $850k in private transaction

[Superman2006]

I could be mistaken but back when the 9.0 sold on CLink, wasn't there a backstory about one of the 9.0s having been an 8.5 previously? I don't recall if it was this copy or another one...

[bluechip]

I think the white spot makes it clear that it's the same book.

 

Interesting.

 

Try asking the average person if they would expect that a high value comic book would be "certified" and guaranteed at one grade only to show up later with a higher grade.

 

No way does the average civilian think that. Just like there's no way an average civilian would think that a dot of yellow ink in that white spot would mean the book is worth 870 thousand less.

 

The biggest bubble-threat of the hobby is not that prices are getting uber high, but that some aspects of the "insider knowledge" of what makes a comic valuable are built on foundations of counter-intuitive reasoning.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[markseifert]

I could be mistaken but back when the 9.0 sold on CLink, wasn't there a backstory about one of the 9.0s having been an 8.5 previously? I don't recall if it was this copy or another one...

 

This book has been discussed a number of times here over the years. In 2004, Stephen Fishler said this about it:

 

Well, it seems that this book has really stepped up in the world. This is the copy that was graded VF- at the 1994 Christies auction. If memory serves, it sold for $28,000

It is a very nice copy.

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=509837#Post509837

 

That said, if you go back and look at the original threads, many people were pretty high on this copy and generally regard it as one of the best Bat #1's out there. Crowzilla, who is also someone who has seen a ton of good books, called it one of the best 3 copies of the book out there.

[lou_fine]

Yup, it looks like the same book to me (you can see the erased S to the right of Batman's cape on each book, which pretty much seals it).

 

If this was a true and original 9.2 graded copy of Batman #1, I actually wouldn't have any problems at all with the $850K price that it sold for. Especially in light of the TOS #39 sale for $375K and the Action #1 sale for almost $2.3 million dollars.

 

After all, you have to take into fact that this would have been the highest graded copy out there. In addition, it is also thought that virtually all peidgree copies of Batman #1 have some kind of noticeable defect or possible work done to the book. So, a pure true 9.2 copy of Batman #1 could possibly be one of the nicest copies in existence.

 

Now that it's been clearly identified as a reworked lower graded copy of Batman #1, YES............it's most definitely overpriced. Of course, in today's CGC driven market, the final price is determined moreso by the CGC label than the underlying book itself.

 

 

[jimjum12]

The figure is impressive, but mostly considering what comics have sold for in the past.

 

Considering what other popular culture collectibles have sold for, and what it is (best available batman 1 comic with first appearance of joker and catwoman), the price is not especially unbelievable.

 

And, considering prices achieved for OTHER comics recently, which would take considerably more explanation or justification as to why it's worth that much, the price is even more understandable.

 

 

....I see it this way too. It's not like an FF 1 where there could still be a dozen near flawless copies floating around unslabbed. Ialways felt that Batman 1 with the first Joker and Catwoman was undervalued.....now it isn't. Still a mighty robust price...sobering. GOD BLESS...

 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus) (thumbs u

[Bat-Man]

I think the white spot makes it clear that it's the same book.

 

 

+1, wow.

[Timely]

I think this book used to be an 8.5 years back before it was a 9.0, so it's been bumped up twice.

[Junkdrawer]

I think this book used to be an 8.5 years back before it was a 9.0, so it's been bumped up twice.

Pressed too

[rob_react]

(back! I've been busy - one reason why - man do I need help with catching up on prices over the past 6 months)

 

Does this sale certify that Marvel Comics #1 has slid another notch down the totem pole? Can anyone imagine any copy other than the Church copy selling for anything even remotely approaching this price? I know Batman #1 is (more) common (than other Golden Age keys), but it's a significant #1 and features TWO first appearances of characters that are ingrained into the popular culture so much more deeply than anything directly related to Marvel #1.

 

(and yes, I'm ignoring the pressing discussion - the horse has left the barn - and that ... impediment to proper discussion offshoot.)

[Cat-Man_America]

(back! I've been busy - one reason why - man do I need help with catching up on prices over the past 6 months)

 

Does this sale certify that Marvel Comics #1 has slid another notch down the totem pole? Can anyone imagine any copy other than the Church copy selling for anything even remotely approaching this price? I know Batman #1 is (more) common (than other Golden Age keys), but it's a significant #1 and features TWO first appearances of characters that are ingrained into the popular culture so much more deeply than anything directly related to Marvel #1.

 

(and yes, I'm ignoring the pressing discussion - the horse has left the barn - and that ... impediment to proper discussion offshoot.)

 

 

Perhaps, but only until Marvel Films goes into production with a blockbuster summer flick featuring Sub-Mariner. If they go back to the early origins of the character like was done with the Cap movie it will be a whole new ball game for Marvel Comics #1.

 

It would be a win/win for MM collectors if Marvels film production team decided to incorperate the origin of the original Human Torch into it and build the plot around the epic fire vs water battle between the two.

 

 

The point I'm trying to make about the film industry actually underscores your point. All things tend to run in cycles, including the popularty of comic characters. I believe the film industry fuels collector speculator interest on some level. That's why so much BIG investor capital comes into play for high grade books around blockbuster comic character movies, especially when they do good box office.

 

Who knows where the Batman franchise as a character will be value-wise in a few years, after the Dark Knight trilogy is no longer on everyone's radar.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[nearmint]

 

Who knows where the Batman franchise as a character will be value-wise in a few years, after the Dark Knight trilogy is no longer on everyone's radar.

 

 

WB has no plans to rush out another Batman Movie once Chris Nolan has completed The Dark Knight Rises. Instead, the heads in power are looking at something to do with TV.

 

The idea comes from the successful tv transitions of SmallVille and Sherlock Holmes--the Hartswood Films/BBC Television show of the same name starring Benedict Cumberbatch that screened recently.

 

So, WB is looking at putting together a live action Batman TV series. The Head Executive in charge (name removed to protect source) who has overseen the development and production of such notable hits as: "Two and a Half Men", "The Mentalist", "ER", "The West Wing", "Without A Trace" and "Friends", has been given the task. He would like to keep it in line with the Nolan movies. No word on any stories or -script, but he wants a real world feel with young adult audiences in mind".

 

It has also been mentioned that this is a way to re-introduce The Joker as a completely new version and not step on Heath’s memory/version, as WB knows this is a sensitive subject. They believe that the Joker alone will garner ratings through the roof and are already planning on a closed set with extremely tight security to prevent any leaked footage.

 

The Actor they have mentioned as a "type" to play Batman/Bruce Wayne is Karl Urban. Karl plays Dr. McCoy in the new Star Trek franchise.

[bluechip]

(back! I've been busy - one reason why - man do I need help with catching up on prices over the past 6 months)

 

Does this sale certify that Marvel Comics #1 has slid another notch down the totem pole? Can anyone imagine any copy other than the Church copy selling for anything even remotely approaching this price? I know Batman #1 is (more) common (than other Golden Age keys), but it's a significant #1 and features TWO first appearances of characters that are ingrained into the popular culture so much more deeply than anything directly related to Marvel #1.

 

(and yes, I'm ignoring the pressing discussion - the horse has left the barn - and that ... impediment to proper discussion offshoot.)

 

 

Perhaps, but only until Marvel Films goes into production with a blockbuster summer flick featuring Sub-Mariner. If they go back to the early origins of the character like was done with the Cap movie it will be a whole new ball game for Marvel Comics #1.

 

It would be a win/win for MM collectors if Marvels film production team decided to incorperate the origin of the original Human Torch into it and build the plot around the epic fire vs water battle between the two.

 

 

The point I'm trying to make about the film industry actually underscores your point. All things tend to run in cycles, including the popularty of comic characters. I believe the film industry fuels collector speculator interest on some level. That's why so much BIG investor capital comes into play for high grade books around blockbuster comic character movies, especially when they do good box office.

 

Who knows where the Batman franchise as a character will be value-wise in a few years, after the Dark Knight trilogy is no longer on everyone's radar.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Collector interest doesn't automatically go off the radar once a franchise goes on a hiatus from blockbuster films or in-your-face phenom of the moment. And people don't always buy a character-based collectible because they're speculating. They like them because they remember the character fondly. People buying Superman comics today are fondly remembering various iterations of the character, and more likely they love having action 1 because they're fans of the 79-80s films (seen in theaters or at anytime afterward).

 

Batman fans today include comic fans, fans of the 1960s series, the Tim Burton films and the cartoons, as well as the current series of films.

 

Things fall out when they've been gone so long it's been a couple of generations, or even more, since they've had the star treatment in any medium. And that only happens when people aren't interested in the character enough to warrant new projects. So worry about Batman if and when your kids or grandkids mention his name to their own kids riding their hoverboards and their kids say "who's that"

 

[sfcityduck]

The press release states:

 

"The copy, certified Near Mint minus 9.2 with off-white pages, was sold on behalf of a private collector and purchased by an investor partnership."

 

I'm not exactly sure what is meant by an "investor partnership." That could just be a bit of puffery to indicate that a couple of collectors or store owners pooled their funds to buy this copy as a speculative investment. Or it could be some Perino type. Or it could be that a sophisticated investor decided to create a limited partnership for the purpose investing in comic books -- e.g. a comic book fund.

 

Viewing this from an attorney perspective, if this "investor partnership" really does represent new money into the collecting community, then the potential for complications rise tremendously. Especially, if this is some sort of limited partnership fund. A general partner will owe his limited partners certain duties, and he might be very disturbed to hear that the immediate reaction to a press release about his purchase of a $850K comic book on a public message board frequented by prominent collectors is:

 

(1) The book used to be graded VF, then 8.5, then 9.0, and only recently was upgraded to 9.2, especially if this information was not disclosed by the seller;

 

(2) The book is viewed by a number of folks here as overgraded; and

 

(3) The price paid is considered too high.

 

If the buyer is disturbed enough, he might be exploring his options, including undwinding the transaction or pursuing legal remedies, and there may well be some depending on the facts of the transaction.

[rob_react]

The more I look at Marvel #1, the more I see Whiz #2.

[nearmint]

 

(2) The book is viewed by a number of folks here as overgraded; and

 

 

I don't see a single post in this thread that expresses that opinion. Not yet, anyway.

[sfcityduck]

 

(2) The book is viewed by a number of folks here as overgraded; and

 

 

I don't see a single post in this thread that expresses that opinion. Not yet, anyway.

 

I think you can draw that implication from a number of posts on this thread.

[nearmint]

 

(2) The book is viewed by a number of folks here as overgraded; and

 

 

I don't see a single post in this thread that expresses that opinion. Not yet, anyway.

 

I think you can draw that implication from a number of posts on this thread.

 

I think YOU draw that implication. I would not.

[sfcityduck]

 

(2) The book is viewed by a number of folks here as overgraded; and

 

 

I don't see a single post in this thread that expresses that opinion. Not yet, anyway.

 

I think you can draw that implication from a number of posts on this thread.

 

I think YOU draw that implication. I would not.

 

You may not make the same inferences I do, but it sure seems to me that the posts can reasonably be seen to making some implications based on their comments about the grading history of the book.

 

But, that's not really my point so no need for us to bicker about trivia.

 

My point is only that if I bought the book, the comments on this thread might be causing me some concern. And if I was running a limited partnership of folks new to the market investing via some sort of fund, I might be especially concerned if the factual history of the book was not disclosed or misrepresented and I owed fiduciary duties to my partners.

[rob_react]

The press release states:

 

"The copy, certified Near Mint minus 9.2 with off-white pages, was sold on behalf of a private collector and purchased by an investor partnership."

 

I'm not exactly sure what is meant by an "investor partnership." That could just be a bit of puffery to indicate that a couple of collectors or store owners pooled their funds to buy this copy as a speculative investment. Or it could be some Perino type. Or it could be that a sophisticated investor decided to create a limited partnership for the purpose investing in comic books -- e.g. a comic book fund.

 

Viewing this from an attorney perspective, if this "investor partnership" really does represent new money into the collecting community, then the potential for complications rise tremendously. Especially, if this is some sort of limited partnership fund. A general partner will owe his limited partners certain duties, and he might be very disturbed to hear that the immediate reaction to a press release about his purchase of a $850K comic book on a public message board frequented by prominent collectors is:

 

(1) The book used to be graded VF, then 8.5, then 9.0, and only recently was upgraded to 9.2, especially if this information was not disclosed by the seller;

 

(2) The book is viewed by a number of folks here as overgraded; and

 

(3) The price paid is considered too high.

 

If the buyer is disturbed enough, he might be exploring his options, including undwinding the transaction or pursuing legal remedies, and there may well be some depending on the facts of the transaction.

 

For what it's worth, every book here is overgraded and every price is too high. The first part is trickier, of course, but... that's the rules of engagement now., The label says 9.2, it's a 9.2 no matter how "pure" a grade it is.

[adamstrange]

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