Doug Schmell cashing in his vaulted massive collecion. Poll: Is this the top?

[The Less Blob]

678 books= guess 2.5 Mil??? or am I low....

 

5million

but none from me

 

sounds like my "needs a $3 million nest egg" to retire (and maybe pay off debts) theory might be right as after paying heritage and the IRS he might clear 2.5-3 million on this.

 

not bad for a crummy lawyer. i think i need to start my own practice!

[lou_fine]

Well the books are listed and the scans are up, and I've gotta wipe the drool off of my keyboard.

 

For instance:

 

 

 

wow.

 

I've never seen a copy nicer than 9.0 in person.

 

 

Roy;

 

Have you ever consider the possibility that this so-called beautiful copy is the exact same 9.0 copy which you saw oh so many years ago.

 

After all, with the number of times that Doug puts his books through the comic book meat grinder and his preferred customer status with CGC, anything at all is possible.

[lou_fine]

But some of the things your wrote are factual....

 

Points 2 and 4 will be true.

 

 

I would label those as suppositions. (thumbs u

 

Correct. 5 is a fact, however, accomplished by Mr Ewert. Whether DS has more of those items is supposition.

 

I believe that quite a number of ultra high grade copies were trimmed and are in collectors hands. Perhaps the technique is still being used?

 

However, I also believe that Most aren't aware that they were trimmed.

 

That's my paranoia acting up.

 

I believe it's called an obvious and correct assumption! (thumbs u

 

The ship has sailed on this particular issue years ago.

 

If you are an uber high grade SA or BA collector and don't want to have anything at all to do with either pressing or micro-trimming, then you may as well leave immediately as you are most definitely in the wrong place.

 

Nobody can really tell the difference assuming the work was done properly, and who really cares anyways, as it's really nothing more than maximization of potential in today's marketplace.

[Gotham Kid]

[

I'm not apologizing for Doug. I'm just of the opinion that its senseless to question his reasoning for consigning his books to Heritage. I also find it slightly ridiculous that there is such extreme hostility toward the books themselves (with people refusing to bid on, or even watch, the auction) because of the character history of the consignor. These books are arguably the finest examples in existence. Once sold and resold, should the books be avoided and ignored because Doug once owned them? Should we ignore every book previously sold on Pedigree's site because they were once sold through Doug's company? It just makes no sense. This is a hobby about collecting funny books, and some of the comments in this thread just seem to miss the mark.

 

Not surprised to see you jump into this fight...you seem to like it when the odds are in your favor...Sardo's comments are well said... (thumbs u

 

I will agree that Sardo's comments are well said

 

+1

[COI]

But some of the things your wrote are factual....

 

Points 2 and 4 will be true.

 

 

I would label those as suppositions. (thumbs u

 

Correct. 5 is a fact, however, accomplished by Mr Ewert. Whether DS has more of those items is supposition.

 

I believe that quite a number of ultra high grade copies were trimmed and are in collectors hands. Perhaps the technique is still being used?

 

However, I also believe that Most aren't aware that they were trimmed.

 

That's my paranoia acting up.

I share that same paranoia, brother.

 

Yep.

[COI]

But some of the things your wrote are factual....

 

Points 2 and 4 will be true.

 

 

I would label those as suppositions. (thumbs u

 

Correct. 5 is a fact, however, accomplished by Mr Ewert. Whether DS has more of those items is supposition.

 

I believe that quite a number of ultra high grade copies were trimmed and are in collectors hands. Perhaps the technique is still being used?

 

However, I also believe that Most aren't aware that they were trimmed.

 

That's my paranoia acting up.

 

I believe it's called an obvious and correct assumption! (thumbs u

 

The ship has sailed on this particular issue years ago.

 

If you are an uber high grade SA or BA collector and don't want to have anything at all to do with either pressing or micro-trimming, then you may as well leave immediately as you are most definitely in the wrong place.

 

Nobody can really tell the difference assuming the work was done properly, and who really cares anyways, as it's really nothing more than maximization of potential in today's marketplace.

 

Yep.

[esquirecomics]

These books are incredibly special. Doug is a very friendly guy and I enjoy talking comics with him. He paid a high price for his past transgressions and does not deserve to be permanently ostracized from this community because his sanctions in the legal profession are a matter of public record. Enjoy these books, this auction, and the great things that have been happening in our hobby.

 

Actually, if he'd learned from his legal transgressions and not continued being a shyster in the comics arena, there'd be a lot more sympathy for him.

 

I'm not apologizing for Doug. I'm just of the opinion that its senseless to question his reasoning for consigning his books to Heritage. I also find it slightly ridiculous that there is such extreme hostility toward the books themselves (with people refusing to bid on, or even watch, the auction) because of the character history of the consignor. These books are arguably the finest examples in existence. Once sold and resold, should the books be avoided and ignored because Doug once owned them? Should we ignore every book previously sold on Pedigree's site because they were once sold through Doug's company? It just makes no sense. This is a hobby about collecting funny books, and some of the comments in this thread just seem to miss the mark.

 

I have to respectfully disagree with you on some of what you wrote my good friend and esteemed colleague. I am not making this about Doug per se at all but rather commenting generally regarding the premise of your sentiment.

 

When there is a seller who has a particular history surrounding them that is negative, whether because of something they might have done or suspected of having done, or just simply because they have a negative attitude that people don't like, there is absolutely no reason why prospective buyers should not steer clear of the books/items they are selling.

 

It is not about hostility towards the specific books, but about who derives the benefit from the actual sale. Once the books get past that particular owner there is no reason to believe the books will be considered tainted (assuming the history of what might have been physically done to the books is something a buyer is not concerned about).

 

There are a number of dealers/sellers I will never purchase from (again, I am not making any comment about Doug) given their history of fraud or suspected fraud or just simply because I think they are a jerk. My issue is not with the book, but with the person whose profits I do not want to contribute to. If I do not take such a stand on principle at least, then why bother having any type of ethics or standards to strive for.

 

In any event, you're still my bud.

[chunkybutt]

These books are incredibly special. Doug is a very friendly guy and I enjoy talking comics with him. He paid a high price for his past transgressions and does not deserve to be permanently ostracized from this community because his sanctions in the legal profession are a matter of public record. Enjoy these books, this auction, and the great things that have been happening in our hobby.

 

Actually, if he'd learned from his legal transgressions and not continued being a shyster in the comics arena, there'd be a lot more sympathy for him.

 

I'm not apologizing for Doug. I'm just of the opinion that its senseless to question his reasoning for consigning his books to Heritage. I also find it slightly ridiculous that there is such extreme hostility toward the books themselves (with people refusing to bid on, or even watch, the auction) because of the character history of the consignor. These books are arguably the finest examples in existence. Once sold and resold, should the books be avoided and ignored because Doug once owned them? Should we ignore every book previously sold on Pedigree's site because they were once sold through Doug's company? It just makes no sense. This is a hobby about collecting funny books, and some of the comments in this thread just seem to miss the mark.

 

I have to respectfully disagree with you on some of what you wrote my good friend and esteemed colleague. I am not making this about Doug per se at all but rather commenting generally regarding the premise of your sentiment.

 

When there is a seller who has a particular history surrounding them that is negative, whether because of something they might have done or suspected of having done, or just simply because they have a negative attitude that people don't like, there is absolutely no reason why prospective buyers should not steer clear of the books/items they are selling.

 

It is not about hostility towards the specific books, but about who derives the benefit from the actual sale. Once the books get past that particular owner there is no reason to believe the books will be considered tainted (assuming the history of what might have been physically done to the books is something a buyer is not concerned about).

 

There are a number of dealers/sellers I will never purchase from (again, I am not making any comment about Doug) given their history of fraud or suspected fraud or just simply because I think they are a jerk. My issue is not with the book, but with the person whose profits I do not want to contribute to. If I do not take such a stand on principle at least, then why bother having any type of ethics or standards to strive for.

 

In any event, you're still my bud.

 

WHOA!!!!!

 

This comics general buddy. We will not tolerate respectful, thought out, calm arguments from anyone.

You may not voice your opinion again, until your pitch fork is raised and your torch is lit. Also, you forgot a emotion filled attack at ones character and a failed attempt at a coy comment that you think only yourself and the elite few will catch and find humor in.

 

I am offended by the class and respect your opinon had on me.

[comics_ross]

The argument about to buy or not to buy from Doug Schmell reminds me for a theme from the Golden Age section about incident some time ago where Silver Acre (an UK dealer) agreed to a price on a Batman 1 and then backed out of the agreement when another buyer cut in and offered more money for the book. Many of the collectors decided not to buy from Silver Acre for the future (I am one of them), because they do not want to support unhonest dealer...

[Gotham Kid]

The argument about to buy or not to buy from Doug Schmell reminds me for a theme from the Golden Age section about incident some time ago where Silver Acre (an UK dealer) agreed to a price on a Batman 1 and then backed out of the agreement when another buyer cut in and offered more money for the book. Many of the collectors decided not to buy from Silver Acre for the future (I am one of them), because they do not want to support unhonest dealer...

 

I have dealt with SilverAcre (Darryl) in the past ...never any issues. This lamentful episode I did not know of

[chrisco37]

The argument about to buy or not to buy from Doug Schmell reminds me for a theme from the Golden Age section about incident some time ago where Silver Acre (an UK dealer) agreed to a price on a Batman 1 and then backed out of the agreement when another buyer cut in and offered more money for the book. Many of the collectors decided not to buy from Silver Acre for the future (I am one of them), because they do not want to support unhonest dealer...

 

I have dealt with SilverAcre (Darryl) in the past ...never any issues. This lamentful episode I did not know of

 

That's not the only story...

[Gotham Kid]

The argument about to buy or not to buy from Doug Schmell reminds me for a theme from the Golden Age section about incident some time ago where Silver Acre (an UK dealer) agreed to a price on a Batman 1 and then backed out of the agreement when another buyer cut in and offered more money for the book. Many of the collectors decided not to buy from Silver Acre for the future (I am one of them), because they do not want to support unhonest dealer...

 

I have dealt with SilverAcre (Darryl) in the past ...never any issues. This lamentful episode I did not know of

 

That's not the only story...

 

 

time to use that search function...

[ciorac]

These books are incredibly special. Doug is a very friendly guy and I enjoy talking comics with him. He paid a high price for his past transgressions and does not deserve to be permanently ostracized from this community because his sanctions in the legal profession are a matter of public record. Enjoy these books, this auction, and the great things that have been happening in our hobby.

 

Actually, if he'd learned from his legal transgressions and not continued being a shyster in the comics arena, there'd be a lot more sympathy for him.

 

I'm not apologizing for Doug. I'm just of the opinion that its senseless to question his reasoning for consigning his books to Heritage. I also find it slightly ridiculous that there is such extreme hostility toward the books themselves (with people refusing to bid on, or even watch, the auction) because of the character history of the consignor. These books are arguably the finest examples in existence. Once sold and resold, should the books be avoided and ignored because Doug once owned them? Should we ignore every book previously sold on Pedigree's site because they were once sold through Doug's company? It just makes no sense. This is a hobby about collecting funny books, and some of the comments in this thread just seem to miss the mark.

 

It makes plenty of sense.

 

Any financial gain on these books will go directly to Doug...not the 84 year old grandmother who unwittingly financed them.

 

Boycott them now...bid on them later.

 

Ideally I would agree, but there's no way any of these books will actually sell cheaply, based on principle.

 

Ultimately, he paid a steep price for his transgressions, and presumably, the people who he cheated were made whole through the proper legal channels. He does own the books; he financed them with his disbarment

 

But what about the profits he has made, and will likely soon make? If someone steals 100k from another person, invests it, is caught and pays the 100k back, but made a profit on the ill gotten gains (which the thief keeps), is the victim whole?

 

Seems to me there needs to be an additional punitive aspect

[namisgr]

If there's criminal theft, clear. If there's co-mingling of funds leading to disbarment without criminal charges, it's less clear. Everyone can make their own decision on the matter.

[Sardo Numspar]

These books are incredibly special. Doug is a very friendly guy and I enjoy talking comics with him. He paid a high price for his past transgressions and does not deserve to be permanently ostracized from this community because his sanctions in the legal profession are a matter of public record. Enjoy these books, this auction, and the great things that have been happening in our hobby.

 

Actually, if he'd learned from his legal transgressions and not continued being a shyster in the comics arena, there'd be a lot more sympathy for him.

 

I'm not apologizing for Doug. I'm just of the opinion that its senseless to question his reasoning for consigning his books to Heritage. I also find it slightly ridiculous that there is such extreme hostility toward the books themselves (with people refusing to bid on, or even watch, the auction) because of the character history of the consignor. These books are arguably the finest examples in existence. Once sold and resold, should the books be avoided and ignored because Doug once owned them? Should we ignore every book previously sold on Pedigree's site because they were once sold through Doug's company? It just makes no sense. This is a hobby about collecting funny books, and some of the comments in this thread just seem to miss the mark.

 

It makes plenty of sense.

 

Any financial gain on these books will go directly to Doug...not the 84 year old grandmother who unwittingly financed them.

 

Boycott them now...bid on them later.

 

Ideally I would agree, but there's no way any of these books will actually sell cheaply, based on principle.

 

Ultimately, he paid a steep price for his transgressions, and presumably, the people who he cheated were made whole through the proper legal channels. He does own the books; he financed them with his disbarment

 

But what about the profits he has made, and will likely soon make? If someone steals 100k from another person, invests it, is caught and pays the 100k back, but made a profit on the ill gotten gains (which the thief keeps), is the victim whole?

 

Seems to me there needs to be an additional punitive aspect

 

From us Bill? Are we all so perfect? I just don't agree that it's my place to impose additional punitive sanctions on Doug for his past by ignoring the books he has put up for auction.

[Sardo Numspar]

These books are incredibly special. Doug is a very friendly guy and I enjoy talking comics with him. He paid a high price for his past transgressions and does not deserve to be permanently ostracized from this community because his sanctions in the legal profession are a matter of public record. Enjoy these books, this auction, and the great things that have been happening in our hobby.

 

Actually, if he'd learned from his legal transgressions and not continued being a shyster in the comics arena, there'd be a lot more sympathy for him.

 

I'm not apologizing for Doug. I'm just of the opinion that its senseless to question his reasoning for consigning his books to Heritage. I also find it slightly ridiculous that there is such extreme hostility toward the books themselves (with people refusing to bid on, or even watch, the auction) because of the character history of the consignor. These books are arguably the finest examples in existence. Once sold and resold, should the books be avoided and ignored because Doug once owned them? Should we ignore every book previously sold on Pedigree's site because they were once sold through Doug's company? It just makes no sense. This is a hobby about collecting funny books, and some of the comments in this thread just seem to miss the mark.

 

I have to respectfully disagree with you on some of what you wrote my good friend and esteemed colleague. I am not making this about Doug per se at all but rather commenting generally regarding the premise of your sentiment.

 

When there is a seller who has a particular history surrounding them that is negative, whether because of something they might have done or suspected of having done, or just simply because they have a negative attitude that people don't like, there is absolutely no reason why prospective buyers should not steer clear of the books/items they are selling.

 

It is not about hostility towards the specific books, but about who derives the benefit from the actual sale. Once the books get past that particular owner there is no reason to believe the books will be considered tainted (assuming the history of what might have been physically done to the books is something a buyer is not concerned about).

 

There are a number of dealers/sellers I will never purchase from (again, I am not making any comment about Doug) given their history of fraud or suspected fraud or just simply because I think they are a jerk. My issue is not with the book, but with the person whose profits I do not want to contribute to. If I do not take such a stand on principle at least, then why bother having any type of ethics or standards to strive for.

 

In any event, you're still my bud.

 

Mark, I don't believe (and I hope nobody here believes) that a person lacks ethics merely because they choose to bid on these books with knowledge of the consignor's past. And yes, we are still buds and I owe you a phone call.

[nmtg9]

The argument about to buy or not to buy from Doug Schmell reminds me for a theme from the Golden Age section about incident some time ago where Silver Acre (an UK dealer) agreed to a price on a Batman 1 and then backed out of the agreement when another buyer cut in and offered more money for the book. Many of the collectors decided not to buy from Silver Acre for the future (I am one of them), because they do not want to support unhonest dealer...

 

I have dealt with SilverAcre (Darryl) in the past ...never any issues. This lamentful episode I did not know of

 

That's not the only story...

 

there are plenty of stories to read up on Daryl and silver acre!

 

Not the most ethical seller in the world.

 

When I sold my/my Dad's collection to him in 1995 he offered what he said was all the money he had on him. then he took out a huge amount and counted out the money he offered me. I know I agreed to the sale but I was in financial need and he was the only one offering me anything. Buyer beware/seller beware!

[skypinkblu]

These books are incredibly special. Doug is a very friendly guy and I enjoy talking comics with him. He paid a high price for his past transgressions and does not deserve to be permanently ostracized from this community because his sanctions in the legal profession are a matter of public record. Enjoy these books, this auction, and the great things that have been happening in our hobby.

 

Actually, if he'd learned from his legal transgressions and not continued being a shyster in the comics arena, there'd be a lot more sympathy for him.

 

I'm not apologizing for Doug. I'm just of the opinion that its senseless to question his reasoning for consigning his books to Heritage. I also find it slightly ridiculous that there is such extreme hostility toward the books themselves (with people refusing to bid on, or even watch, the auction) because of the character history of the consignor. These books are arguably the finest examples in existence. Once sold and resold, should the books be avoided and ignored because Doug once owned them? Should we ignore every book previously sold on Pedigree's site because they were once sold through Doug's company? It just makes no sense. This is a hobby about collecting funny books, and some of the comments in this thread just seem to miss the mark.

 

I have to respectfully disagree with you on some of what you wrote my good friend and esteemed colleague. I am not making this about Doug per se at all but rather commenting generally regarding the premise of your sentiment.

 

When there is a seller who has a particular history surrounding them that is negative, whether because of something they might have done or suspected of having done, or just simply because they have a negative attitude that people don't like, there is absolutely no reason why prospective buyers should not steer clear of the books/items they are selling.

 

It is not about hostility towards the specific books, but about who derives the benefit from the actual sale. Once the books get past that particular owner there is no reason to believe the books will be considered tainted (assuming the history of what might have been physically done to the books is something a buyer is not concerned about).

 

There are a number of dealers/sellers I will never purchase from (again, I am not making any comment about Doug) given their history of fraud or suspected fraud or just simply because I think they are a jerk. My issue is not with the book, but with the person whose profits I do not want to contribute to. If I do not take such a stand on principle at least, then why bother having any type of ethics or standards to strive for.

 

In any event, you're still my bud.

 

Mark, I don't believe (and I hope nobody here believes) that a person lacks ethics merely because they choose to bid on these books with knowledge of the consignor's past. And yes, we are still buds and I owe you a phone call.

 

When Nicholas Cage sold his books, people wanted them because of the history. I can see the other side here, people not wanting these because of the history. It's not like we are hurting the books themselves, they are inanimate objects (as much as some of us try to ignore that).

 

Personally, even if they were GA, I would not bid on them, because I'm not looking to enrich the owner.. If the owner had bent over backwards to pay society back somehow...I might have a different attitude, but my one experience with the guy, was seeing him try to take advantage of a friend. I saw this in person, and it was recent.

[paperheart]

Exactly, the stress might cause spine ticks.

 

Doug's books being auctioned off of Heritage will sell high. When the new owners try to re-sell, they will sell lower. My prediction

 

Well, this is already pretty much a given as everybody knows by now that the Heritage hype machine will always maximize the dollars realized on their featured collection auctions.

 

This was quite evident with their recent Billy Wright books which generally could not hit the same dollars on the second go round. This has happened time amd time again with the big hyped collections from Heritage.

 

why are people surprised that after paying top $ when you turn around and try to flip them within months you are gonna get your azz handed to you? this isn't HA's fault.

[Sardo Numspar]

These books are incredibly special. Doug is a very friendly guy and I enjoy talking comics with him. He paid a high price for his past transgressions and does not deserve to be permanently ostracized from this community because his sanctions in the legal profession are a matter of public record. Enjoy these books, this auction, and the great things that have been happening in our hobby.

 

Actually, if he'd learned from his legal transgressions and not continued being a shyster in the comics arena, there'd be a lot more sympathy for him.

 

I'm not apologizing for Doug. I'm just of the opinion that its senseless to question his reasoning for consigning his books to Heritage. I also find it slightly ridiculous that there is such extreme hostility toward the books themselves (with people refusing to bid on, or even watch, the auction) because of the character history of the consignor. These books are arguably the finest examples in existence. Once sold and resold, should the books be avoided and ignored because Doug once owned them? Should we ignore every book previously sold on Pedigree's site because they were once sold through Doug's company? It just makes no sense. This is a hobby about collecting funny books, and some of the comments in this thread just seem to miss the mark.

 

I have to respectfully disagree with you on some of what you wrote my good friend and esteemed colleague. I am not making this about Doug per se at all but rather commenting generally regarding the premise of your sentiment.

 

When there is a seller who has a particular history surrounding them that is negative, whether because of something they might have done or suspected of having done, or just simply because they have a negative attitude that people don't like, there is absolutely no reason why prospective buyers should not steer clear of the books/items they are selling.

 

It is not about hostility towards the specific books, but about who derives the benefit from the actual sale. Once the books get past that particular owner there is no reason to believe the books will be considered tainted (assuming the history of what might have been physically done to the books is something a buyer is not concerned about).

 

There are a number of dealers/sellers I will never purchase from (again, I am not making any comment about Doug) given their history of fraud or suspected fraud or just simply because I think they are a jerk. My issue is not with the book, but with the person whose profits I do not want to contribute to. If I do not take such a stand on principle at least, then why bother having any type of ethics or standards to strive for.

 

In any event, you're still my bud.

 

Mark, I don't believe (and I hope nobody here believes) that a person lacks ethics merely because they choose to bid on these books with knowledge of the consignor's past. And yes, we are still buds and I owe you a phone call.

 

When Nicholas Cage sold his books, people wanted them because of the history. I can see the other side here, people not wanting these because of the history. It's not like we are hurting the books themselves, they are inanimate objects (as much as some of us try to ignore that).

 

Personally, even if they were GA, I would not bid on them, because I'm not looking to enrich the owner.. If the owner had bent over backwards to pay society back somehow...I might have a different attitude, but my one experience with the guy, was seeing him try to take advantage of a friend. I saw this in person, and it was recent.

 

Sharon, I just personally think owner stigma alone goes to far in deciding whether to pursue a specific book, but I do hear and respect what you are saying.