Facilitator questions for discussion

[Transplant]

It's amazing how many problems in business come down to organizational skills. Given the nature of the service, it's astounding to me that a facilitator would not be able to provide an invoice number or be able to provide a status update as to any particular book at any point in time. I would consider it a must just for liability purposes. How would I, as a facilitator, know that I have fulfilled my duty to my customer unless I know where the books are or when they went back to the client and were received? Seems like a pretty core function that the facilitator is providing.

 

Part of the problem with losing track of the book is that both the facilitator and the customer are left wondering if the service was completed at all. Further, neither has any real idea as to when to expect the transaction to be completed. If I were the facilitator, it would probably be more frustrating to me but I can sympathize with customers who've handed off these books only to never know what's going on.

 

 

[Ziazmere]

It's amazing how many problems in business come down to organizational skills. Given the nature of the service, it's astounding to me that a facilitator would not be able to provide an invoice number or be able to provide a status update as to any particular book at any point in time. I would consider it a must just for liability purposes. How would I, as a facilitator, know that I have fulfilled my duty to my customer unless I know where the books are or when they went back to the client and were received? Seems like a pretty core function that the facilitator is providing.

 

Part of the problem with losing track of the book is that both the facilitator and the customer are left wondering if the service was completed at all. Further, neither has any real idea as to when to expect the transaction to be completed. If I were the facilitator, it would probably be more frustrating to me but I can sympathize with customers who've handed off these books only to never know what's going on.

 

 

+1 (thumbs u

[Dark Prime 0]

 

You missed the entire point of my post, but i'm not surprised.

what am i saposse to understand, you just kept saying it "shouldn't happen"

 

you keep saying 1 thing over and over, your not stateing a point your makeing a statement and presenting that as a point......you seem to have a hard on that DWC is the bad guy for everything no matter what the situation is, not even enteraining the fact the it might possibliy be the other side who is at fault.....you know 3 sides to every story (their side, the other side, & the middle which is the truth)

 

there are meny things in the world that "shouldn't happen" but hey guess what THEY DO, i could provide a whole list if you'd like

 

the way it seems is it "shouldn't happen" is bc people are machines and everything is always done correctly and god forbid something goes wrong

 

bc you know people make mistakes every so often......that seems to be what your missing

 

has DWC made some mistakes with my orders. yes, have they corrected thoes mistakes. yes.........hell i think i even had a misstep with rich once or twice and it always got corrected as well

 

do i have a wittness i would never use again.....yes, thank god they left the boards right after i got my books from them

 

that customer is always right is BS imo.......if i make/made a mistake as a customer i own up to it, i've even called myslef an insufficiently_thoughtful_person (and much worse) on the phone to CS reps bc it was my fault for not understanding or i snaped on the phone and then they proved me wrong

[MedicAR]

You opened your self up to all answers by asking open ended question!

 

Really you asked those 3 questions with no spiteful or malicious intent! Tell the truth, its not hard.

 

Z,

 

I'm not taking sides here, so please don't take it that way.

 

It's time to let DWC and CGC handle this privately. I completely understand your frustration. I had similar problems sometime back with a facilitator/Witness and couldn't get what I considered to be a straight answer. I tried and tried. I hinted at it in threads, I came out and said it in threads, and finally even started threads about it. In the end the exact same thing happened then that is happening now. we wound up with three factions, those with me, those with the Witness, and there was the majority that just wanted it all to go away.

 

That third group is growing by the day now, as it was then.

 

The long and short of it is this, at this point no good will come of further posting about it. You're too entrenched to see DWC's side. DWC is trying to cover themselves and keep business coming in. You've both managed to give and get a pretty good black eye. Now is the time to let it go, at least publicly.

 

I'm not saying to give up, by all means you should get your books back or books equal to them, signed or not. I know not having them signed sucks to say the least, but a big part of this hobby is the risk of not getting things done. I am pretty sure I can say that anyone I have ever sent books to has had a minimum of one failure to get a signature. It's rarely (if ever) their fault. The creator doesn't show, lines are too long, creator cuts the appearance short...whatever. The point is that it happens.

 

I have had books lost in the system, too. I shouldn't happen, but it does. Accidents happen and there are a million and one different ways that they can happen. No one bats 1000, that is life. Considering the volume I saw DWC handle in 3/4 of a day in Dallas, I understand that there will be the occasional screw up. I have even had problems very similar to yours with DWC. It took a lot of time and a lot more patience, but I did get everything back in hand and all signed. The same deal with the other Witness I had problems with and made very public, I did finally get them all back after between 8-10 months (I've made a point to forget).

 

I know there is a lot of money in this, whether you're collecting for fun, as I am, or if you're trying to flip the books and make money. It gets frustrating and even scary at times, especially with rare or expensive books. Just remember that there are people on the other end of the phone or email and they don't want you to be disappointed any more than you want to be. They may not be acting fast enough for you, but I have no doubt that they are trying.

 

Non of this is to diminish your claim or frustration. I'm just saying it's time to move on publicly.

 

 

[seanfingh]

 

CGC has its policies in place for dealing with these types of situations. My understanding is that once CGC looks into it and says that there is nothing more they can do, the Boards are fair game. Once it gets to that, I would not stop until the situation is corrected. Everyone telling you that it needs to "become private" after is starts getting aired out is full of it.

 

I had in excess of $2000 tied up in my 1st three large submissions. Summer of 2007. I finally got the last of my slabbed books in Dec of 2009. To this day, I still don't have the books that didn't get signed.

 

I specifically didn't air any of this on the Boards because of my relationship with the facilitator and because i didn't want to give the program a black eye. I still question whether it was the right decision or not. It likely was not. There was no impetus for anyone to deal expediently with my problem, and certainly no way to warn others of the potential pitfalls.

 

This facilitator was not DesertWind, nor is it anyone that is currently accepting subs from the public. It didn't drive me away from the program because when i caught the Yellow Fever, I caught it bad. There were plenty of other witnesses that did a great job for me going forward. But it is really tough to have 50+ books and hundreds-thousands of dollars tied up in limbo.

 

A person can only take so much BS before it becomes a fight or flight response.

[Pirate]

 

You missed the entire point of my post, but i'm not surprised.

what am i saposse to understand, you just kept saying it "shouldn't happen"

 

you keep saying 1 thing over and over, your not stateing a point your makeing a statement and presenting that as a point......you seem to have a hard on that DWC is the bad guy for everything no matter what the situation is, not even enteraining the fact the it might possibliy be the other side who is at fault.....you know 3 sides to every story (their side, the other side, & the middle which is the truth)

 

there are meny things in the world that "shouldn't happen" but hey guess what THEY DO, i could provide a whole list if you'd like

 

the way it seems is it "shouldn't happen" is bc people are machines and everything is always done correctly and god forbid something goes wrong

 

bc you know people make mistakes every so often......that seems to be what your missing

 

has DWC made some mistakes with my orders. yes, have they corrected thoes mistakes. yes.........hell i think i even had a misstep with rich once or twice and it always got corrected as well

 

do i have a wittness i would never use again.....yes, thank god they left the boards right after i got my books from them

 

that customer is always right is BS imo.......if i make/made a mistake as a customer i own up to it, i've even called myslef an insufficiently_thoughtful_person (and much worse) on the phone to CS reps bc it was my fault for not understanding or i snaped on the phone and then they proved me wrong

 

at this point if you don't get it, you just don't get it.

[revat]

 

You missed the entire point of my post, but i'm not surprised.

what am i saposse to understand, you just kept saying it "shouldn't happen"

 

you keep saying 1 thing over and over, your not stateing a point your makeing a statement and presenting that as a point......you seem to have a hard on that DWC is the bad guy for everything no matter what the situation is, not even enteraining the fact the it might possibliy be the other side who is at fault.....you know 3 sides to every story (their side, the other side, & the middle which is the truth)

 

there are meny things in the world that "shouldn't happen" but hey guess what THEY DO, i could provide a whole list if you'd like

 

the way it seems is it "shouldn't happen" is bc people are machines and everything is always done correctly and god forbid something goes wrong

 

bc you know people make mistakes every so often......that seems to be what your missing

 

has DWC made some mistakes with my orders. yes, have they corrected thoes mistakes. yes.........hell i think i even had a misstep with rich once or twice and it always got corrected as well

 

do i have a wittness i would never use again.....yes, thank god they left the boards right after i got my books from them

 

that customer is always right is BS imo.......if i make/made a mistake as a customer i own up to it, i've even called myslef an insufficiently_thoughtful_person (and much worse) on the phone to CS reps bc it was my fault for not understanding or i snaped on the phone and then they proved me wrong

 

at this point if you don't get it, you just don't get it.

 

I'm not sure if you're being ironic and tacitly agreeing, or there is some other cleverly subtle point to be had, or if you vehemently disagree... but I'm not sure I get your point either. I originally thought I understood what you were saying and thought I disagreed with it, but now very honestly and with all respect, can you please reiterate your point?

[Skynwalker]

Three questions for the boards. I do believe a useful discussion can ensue.

 

1) Does a facilitator have the right to not ship books to customer when there is an undisputed balance due that far exceeds the value of the few books to be shipped? FYI - CGC’s answer is yes.

 

Absolutely. Especially once the signed books have returned from CGC. If there's money still owed at that point, the facilitator has every right to hold some or all of the books as they see fit until the balance is paid.

 

2) If the customer is so unhappy with the service or grade, does the facilitator have the right to replace the book in question with a raw or graded book of equal or greater condition and refund any money paid (or in some cases just not charge the fee)? Essentially reversing the transaction completely. (Additional fact, website states signatures are not guaranteed).

 

Refund the money (or at least some depending on the situation), yes. Replace a book at the facilitator's discretion, no. Replacing the book would depend completely on the situation and the customer/facilitator. Some customers would be up for that, some not, but that shouldn't be done without working it out with the customer first.

 

As to the second part, I absolutely agree that sigs aren't guaranteed. To the facilitator's best ability they should attempt to get every sig that they have committed to, but many times circumstances beyond their control play a part and they cannot guarantee any sig (nor should they be required to).

 

On a related topic, grades cannot be guaranteed either. Once a book has been de-slabbed and signed, there is no guarantee that a book will retain it's grade, nor should there be. If, by chance, a facilitator has inadvertently damaged a book, they would be responsible for a refund/replacement, but otherwise the facilitator is not responsible for grade drops. To throw in my own experience, I've had very few grade drops over the years. But it does happen and the facilitator should not be held accountable for that.

 

3) What compensation should be given when books are at CGC but the invoice number cannot be found? (Possible reasons, number re-issued by CGC and facilitator not informed, misfiled by facilitator, books are dropped off at the CGC booth and green copy is not given to facilitator at show, unreadable green copy, or my dog ate the green copy.)

 

Again, this one depends on the customer and facilitator. Maybe the customer is easy going and doesn't mind the wait as long as the book gets signed. Maybe the customer has a hard and fast expectation that after a certain date, it's been too long and a refund is on order. Neither is right or wrong, but that facilitator has the responsibility of taking care of the customer, making sure their order is where it needs to be when it needs to be there, and keeping their information handy (especially invoice numbers). If I were a facilitator, this is what I would expect of myself.

 

 

Sharon

[lscomics]

You opened your self up to all answers by asking open ended question!

 

Really you asked those 3 questions with no spiteful or malicious intent! Tell the truth, its not hard.

 

Z,

 

I'm not taking sides here, so please don't take it that way.

 

It's time to let DWC and CGC handle this privately. I completely understand your frustration. I had similar problems sometime back with a facilitator/Witness and couldn't get what I considered to be a straight answer. I tried and tried. I hinted at it in threads, I came out and said it in threads, and finally even started threads about it. In the end the exact same thing happened then that is happening now. we wound up with three factions, those with me, those with the Witness, and there was the majority that just wanted it all to go away.

 

That third group is growing by the day now, as it was then.

 

The long and short of it is this, at this point no good will come of further posting about it. You're too entrenched to see DWC's side. DWC is trying to cover themselves and keep business coming in. You've both managed to give and get a pretty good black eye. Now is the time to let it go, at least publicly.

 

I'm not saying to give up, by all means you should get your books back or books equal to them, signed or not. I know not having them signed sucks to say the least, but a big part of this hobby is the risk of not getting things done. I am pretty sure I can say that anyone I have ever sent books to has had a minimum of one failure to get a signature. It's rarely (if ever) their fault. The creator doesn't show, lines are too long, creator cuts the appearance short...whatever. The point is that it happens.

 

I have had books lost in the system, too. I shouldn't happen, but it does. Accidents happen and there are a million and one different ways that they can happen. No one bats 1000, that is life. Considering the volume I saw DWC handle in 3/4 of a day in Dallas, I understand that there will be the occasional screw up. I have even had problems very similar to yours with DWC. It took a lot of time and a lot more patience, but I did get everything back in hand and all signed. The same deal with the other Witness I had problems with and made very public, I did finally get them all back after between 8-10 months (I've made a point to forget).

 

I know there is a lot of money in this, whether you're collecting for fun, as I am, or if you're trying to flip the books and make money. It gets frustrating and even scary at times, especially with rare or expensive books. Just remember that there are people on the other end of the phone or email and they don't want you to be disappointed any more than you want to be. They may not be acting fast enough for you, but I have no doubt that they are trying.

 

Non of this is to diminish your claim or frustration. I'm just saying it's time to move on publicly.

 

 

Three questions for the boards. I do believe a useful discussion can ensue.

 

1) Does a facilitator have the right to not ship books to customer when there is an undisputed balance due that far exceeds the value of the few books to be shipped? FYI - CGC’s answer is yes.

 

Absolutely. Especially once the signed books have returned from CGC. If there's money still owed at that point, the facilitator has every right to hold some or all of the books as they see fit until the balance is paid.

 

2) If the customer is so unhappy with the service or grade, does the facilitator have the right to replace the book in question with a raw or graded book of equal or greater condition and refund any money paid (or in some cases just not charge the fee)? Essentially reversing the transaction completely. (Additional fact, website states signatures are not guaranteed).

 

Refund the money (or at least some depending on the situation), yes. Replace a book at the facilitator's discretion, no. Replacing the book would depend completely on the situation and the customer/facilitator. Some customer's would be up for that, some not, but that shouldn't be done without working it out with the customer first.

 

As to the second part, I absolutely agree that sigs aren't guaranteed. To the facilitator's best ability they should atempt to get every sig that they have committed to, but many times circumstances beyond their control play a part and they cannot guarantee any sig (nor should they be required to).

 

On a related topic, grades cannot be guaranteed either. Once a book has been de-slabbed and signed, there is no guarantee that a book will retain it's grade, nor should there be. If, by chance, a facilitator has inadvertantly damaged a book, they would be responsible for a refund/replacement, but otherwise the facilitator is not responsible for grade drops. To throw in my own experience, I've had very few grade drops over the years. But it does happen and the facilitator should not be held accountable for that.

 

3) What compensation should be given when books are at CGC but the invoice number cannot be found? (Possible reasons, number re-issued by CGC and facilitator not informed, misfiled by facilitator, books are dropped off at the CGC booth and green copy is not given to facilitator at show, unreadable green copy, or my dog ate the green copy.)

 

Again, this one depends on the customer and facilitator. Maybe the customer is easy going and doesn't mind the wait as long as the book gets signed. Maybe the customer has a hard and fast expectation that after a certain date, it's been too lonbg and a refund is on order. Neither is right or wrong, but that facilitator has the responsibility of taking care of the customer, making sure their order is where it needs to be when it needs to be there, and keeping their information handy (especially invoice numbers). If I were a facilitator, this is what I would expect of myself.

 

 

Sharon

 

Two posts that are well stated and on topic. Nicely done gentlemen.

[Ziazmere]

You opened your self up to all answers by asking open ended question!

 

Really you asked those 3 questions with no spiteful or malicious intent! Tell the truth, its not hard.

 

Z,

 

I'm not taking sides here, so please don't take it that way.

 

It's time to let DWC and CGC handle this privately. I completely understand your frustration. I had similar problems sometime back with a facilitator/Witness and couldn't get what I considered to be a straight answer. I tried and tried. I hinted at it in threads, I came out and said it in threads, and finally even started threads about it. In the end the exact same thing happened then that is happening now. we wound up with three factions, those with me, those with the Witness, and there was the majority that just wanted it all to go away.

 

That third group is growing by the day now, as it was then.

 

The long and short of it is this, at this point no good will come of further posting about it. You're too entrenched to see DWC's side. DWC is trying to cover themselves and keep business coming in. You've both managed to give and get a pretty good black eye. Now is the time to let it go, at least publicly.

 

I'm not saying to give up, by all means you should get your books back or books equal to them, signed or not. I know not having them signed sucks to say the least, but a big part of this hobby is the risk of not getting things done. I am pretty sure I can say that anyone I have ever sent books to has had a minimum of one failure to get a signature. It's rarely (if ever) their fault. The creator doesn't show, lines are too long, creator cuts the appearance short...whatever. The point is that it happens.

 

I have had books lost in the system, too. I shouldn't happen, but it does. Accidents happen and there are a million and one different ways that they can happen. No one bats 1000, that is life. Considering the volume I saw DWC handle in 3/4 of a day in Dallas, I understand that there will be the occasional screw up. I have even had problems very similar to yours with DWC. It took a lot of time and a lot more patience, but I did get everything back in hand and all signed. The same deal with the other Witness I had problems with and made very public, I did finally get them all back after between 8-10 months (I've made a point to forget).

 

I know there is a lot of money in this, whether you're collecting for fun, as I am, or if you're trying to flip the books and make money. It gets frustrating and even scary at times, especially with rare or expensive books. Just remember that there are people on the other end of the phone or email and they don't want you to be disappointed any more than you want to be. They may not be acting fast enough for you, but I have no doubt that they are trying.

 

Non of this is to diminish your claim or frustration. I'm just saying it's time to move on publicly.

 

 

Medicar,

 

No offense taken

 

I have been PMing Joe and Paul since the 7th of May... They have all the information. I have been in communication with CGC over the phone!

 

DWC however continues to barrage me with PMs and emails showing their incompetency as a business and as a facilitator that represents CGC!

[thehumantorch]

I have a question----

 

1) Are these isolated incidents or recurring incidents?

 

And I have a (long) analogy, so if you don’t like heavy reading, please skip.

 

Before I did any of this as a business, I was in the business of customer care and satisfaction. I worked for a high end printer/publisher in the DC/MD area.

 

I worked at this specific plant for over 13 years, and ever customer was a valued customer. Prior to this plant, I worked at a facility in Buffalo, NY where one of our biggest clients was Marvel Comics. We did color seps for Marvel, the Syndicates (and by this I mean the Sunday Comic Syndicates), as well as Chase Pittkin, Lumber Boys, Home Depot, Mark Jewelers (I'm pretty sure that was the name), as well as K-Mart, Mr. Tire, etc. We had a number of small and big clients, but the two biggest were Marvel and the Syndicates.

 

The employees that worked there were hard working, honest people and took the job seriously. We had management that didn't take our biggest clients QUITE as seriously. After all, these were COMICS. Who gives a s...t, right?

 

Wrong.

 

We had one issue of Spec. SM where there were color corrections that needed to be made to Mary Jane's lipstick. Our guys kept getting it wrong. THREE times this had to get kicked back. We had to generate new film and proofs each time. If our management on that team hadn't been lazy and double-checked his peoples work, there wouldn't be a need to do this three times. On the third go-round, the manager of that dept got all in a huff (and I can still see this as it were yesterday) "WHO GIVES A S...T WHAT COLOR HER LIPS ARE??? ITS A KIDS COMIC BOOK FOR GODS SAKE!!!"

 

Well, when you have a paying client, who (regardless if they're our biggest or smallest) is PAYING us to do a job and do it CORRECTLY and without headache or hassles, it shouldn't matter if it's Marvel Comics or the President's Newsletter, YOU, my friend, are being paid to do the job RIGHT and to do it without complaints or excuses. This was the conversation he and I had.

 

That client is paying you to do a job.

The customer is always right.

The customer can (and WILL) take their business somewhere else.

 

If we lost a client, someone lost their job.

 

That manager was given the next three days off without pay.

When he came back to work, his attitude was clearly adjusted.

 

When I left this Buffalo NY facility and went to work in the MD/VA/DC area, and eventually landed at Balmar Printing, where I would be for the next 13+ years, my clients included Marriott, Amtrak, AT&T, GPO (Government Printing), Humane Society---small Mom & Pop shops, big corps and small outsource clients.

We did it all. The one thing we never did was make excuses or blame our mistakes on our clients EVEN IF THE CLIENT WAS AT FAULT FOR ANYTHING---such as forgetting to send us hi-res files, neglecting to give us all the print specs, perhaps they'd omitted certain important details like...oh, I don't know....WHAT PMS COLORS they might like on this really fancy foil embossed cover?

 

But as a full service facility, a printer/publisher/binder in a dying economy and a dying medium---hell, even BEFORE print went belly up---it didn't matter.

 

Questions--

1) How can I help?

2) What can I do to make this right?

3) Is there anything that I can do to make this more efficient?

4) Is there any information missing that perhaps I can glean with a call to my client?

 

Attitude---

1) CAN DO attitude

2) Multi-task.

3) The job doesn't end when we swipe your card

4) Thank you for your business.

5) Thank you for your business.

and most important

6) In a business where we know you have SEVERAL other options---

THANK YOU FOR YOUR BUSINESS.

 

Whenever we lost a client, someone was accountable. (as above)

 

That was a 10K client or a 100K client. They just found someone else who could do their job better and more efficient. They just found someone that could handle their work with zero drama, zero headaches, and guess what....CHEAPER too.

 

Because yes, you know what? My company was a high-end printer that really DID charge a premium to do a job that (some, but not many) other printers in the area could do as well, for perhaps a little less.

 

Half way into my 13 year stint, I became responsible for trafficking the jobs through the plant from entry (job planning with CSR's) to print, bindery and shipping. I was in charge of a lot of different cogs in that machine and I worked with a team of people that were all key to making it go smooth. These guys took pride in their work. They got paid sh..t to do the job because of the economy, but they did good work. When someone screwed up, he owned up to it. He didn't blame it on someone else.

 

We had a sales team that were 50/50. Some were hard go-getters, and others were lax with the clients they had. And we had this one sales rep, her name was Janet. She had (HAD being the key word here) been the top sales lady on our payroll for almost 2 decades. She thought her poo didn't stink. She thought she was the Big Dog. She threw her weight around like she owned the place. Her clients were some of THE biggest in the company.

 

The owner of the company said "If Janet wanted me to kiss her azz in the middle of the 695 beltway, I'd DO it!"

And I think she believed it. Well, when her clients work started to get sloppy---and a lot of this was based on information for jobs that she could have and SHOULD have been responsible for getting---she started to blame it on someone else.

All of a sudden, it was the color depts fault for not having the specs, or it was bindery's fault for not knowing this was an annual newsletter that should have been stitched and not glue bound, or it was our division president fault for not having a conf. call with all parties responsible.

 

Our company seemed to forget for a bit that Janet worked for THEM, not the other way around. They forgot that even though Janet had become a shi..y sales rep, content with blaming everyone else for her shortcomings, even going so far as to throw her own client under the bus or even our own company PRESIDENT under the bus....it was all about her making excuses.

 

And my company kept her around because they (don't ask why) felt that perhaps without her, they might lose that client.

 

One day Janet got way too big for her panties.

She actually hauled off and HIT another employee.

HR had no choice but to let her go.

Management was flipping out.

NO! NO! NO! We CANT let Janet go!

What about her clients?

 

Guess what. We assigned a different sales rep, one of those hard working

go-getters to her client list.

 

Guess what.

We didn't lose the business.

 

Guess what.

The clients business FLOURISHED. It grew.

We gave them someone that could handle their work better, more efficient, someone that didn't make excuses.

 

They were in love with us again.

They told us what a pain it had been in the end to continue to work with Janet,

and they didn't know that they had the option to use a different facilitator / sales rep for their account.

 

There seems to be zero accountability sometimes, and some of us may forget who is actually putting money on the table.

 

When you are spending HUNDREDS and THOUSANDS of dollars on a service that you don't feel you are getting, you have EVER RIGHT to speak up.

 

You have EVERY RIGHT to voice your concerns.

 

This is YOUR money that you (actually don’t) need to spend because this is a HOBBY and NOT a necessity.

 

The moment that business walks out the door, it is NOT coming back.

 

In sales, in business, in comics or any other (pick your poison) you need to recognize the paying customer as that guy who is keeping your business afloat.

 

Weather its grading comics, signing comics, or bagging groceries.

You are providing a service, a service that you are being paid and being paid WELL to provide...do it, do it right and say THANK YOU for your patronage.

 

Because otherwise, you will become a dinosaur, just like the print industry.

 

The underlying message on this thread was someone who felt they were not getting the service they were paying for. This isn't the first thread, and probably won’t be the last.

 

Mud slinging?

No, I hope not.

 

Mud slinging is when someone says, "You're a big ol retarded jerk who stole my money, shot my dog, burned my house----and you smell too!"

Mud slinging is when you say something about someone that isn't close to the truth. I agree with Joe Pierson and CGC, no mud slinging.

 

I believe in accountability.

I believe in being able to provide a paid service and being held accountable

when/if that service isn't being provided.

 

Are we providing a paid service or is this all just a courtesy?

Looking for answers?

Sure, a public forum? Okay---well, we are all part of this public forum.

We're like one big nerdy family.

And I am sure there are members of your family that you don't like (and ergo, by choice, don't have to deal with).

 

But if a member of your family continues to take advantage of you, you have every right to go to the other members of your family and ask for help.

 

In this case, CGC is the Dad.

And if you can't find satisfaction with the answers Dad is giving you----you get help from your brothers and sisters.

 

And if THAT still doesn't work---then you call the adoption agency and look for the birth parents because this kid doesn't live here any more :thumbsup:

 

 

**One last food for thought---if you clearly find yourself taking on more then you can take on....STOP. Stop taking on the work.

 

***If you find yourself telling a paying customer things like "I have a day job" or "My parter and I don't communicate" then STOP.

These are the absolute worst excuses that you can possibly give a paying customer/client. A client does not care that you have "a day job" or that you "don't communicate" with your partner.

All this does is underscore that you cannot handle the work and that your customer is not your priority.

 

If someone pays you to do a job, any excuse is unacceptable because at the end of the day, it's just an excuse.

Leave comics out of this for just a second and ask yourself a different question---how do you handle a vendor/employee that can't complete the task at hand for a filtration system? A party planner that couldn't deliver the cake that was ordered from the bakery? An auto-repair shop that couldn't service your car because the shop was book solid for the next two days?

The roofer you hired to repair your roof, but sub-contracted the job to lower scale division who used less then sub-par shingles on your house?

And the roof leaks, and you spent $8000 to get the job done right the first time,

and found out that the guy you hired paid the lesser known vendor to do the job for less then half what you paid him---because he had another "day job" already on his planner?

 

The moment anyone in any business lets their customer know that they are not a valued customer, that's the moment they lose that customer forever. You can fight tooth and nail to get that customer back, but once the damage is done, its done.

 

I say the following in all seriousness and this applies to ALL walks of life in the world of business.

Customers don't care about your problems.

Customers don't care about your other day jobs, your personal issues or your financial situation.

Customers are not your friends.

Customers are not there to give you moral support or make you feel good about yourself.

Customers don't want excuses.

Customers don't like to feel like they're being taken advantage of.

Customers are just that....they are customers that are paying their hard earned money to do to a job. Don't make excuses. If you can't handle the job, then don't take the job on. But make no mistake, it's a JOB, not a favor.

 

I say that last part because if I asked you to do something for me and you couldn't because of your day job, and clearly I wasn't paying you for the service, then yes....that is very much an acceptable excuse.

 

This IS my day job.

I take my job very seriously and the moment you stop treating this like a job and begin treating it like a drive-thru is the moment people stop taking you seriously.

 

Yikes, what a great post.

[thehumantorch]

AndyBobo,

3) Book not lost, simply sitting at CGC awaiting to be graded, and then shipped to customer like every other book. The problem is that no invoice number could be provided as soon as the book was submitted or in a timely manner.

 

Good answers though for a case of a totally lost book.

 

Liked your answers as they showed thought and some knowledge but I have to disagree that when a facilitator submit hundreds of books to CGC at their booth that it would be their fault if CGC failed to pull the green copy and return it to the facilitator. If the facilitator did one invoice at a time it would be easy to notice they didn't get the copy but when one does a short box at a time, one is up to the mercy of CGC that they pulled all the green (gold) copies.

 

ML, thank you for your answers and yes, returning email 6 week later is rude but never our intention. For this we apologize but for the last year, since CGC delay, our mailboxes have been flooded with emails from everyone asking where is their book (90% have invoice numbers and could call CGC directly). If we don't have the answer at our figuretips, we save the email as new and followup later. Sometimes the email isn't saved as new by mistake and it takes awhile to realize it was never answered. This is why we openly publish a phone number for people to call and encourge customers to follow-up with another email if they don't get an answer. 99% of the time the book is at CGC awaiting grading.

 

Sharon

 

If CGC is failing to pull the green copy and a book then 'disappears' for any period of time you should change the way you submit books. Rather than hand CGC a short box of books and hope they pull every green copy you should hand CGC one book at a time and wait for each green copy. Yes I realize how insane it must get for you at times and I realize it will cost you time and money but it is the best way to ensure every book is accounted for. It is absolutely vital that every customer feels that their book is safe and secure and knows where it is in the process at any time.

 

Admitting that you save an email to follow up later and sometimes fail to follow up is a pure error on your part and saying people can call a phone number or send a follow up email is now putting the onus on your customer for your mistake.

 

You should have a policy and procedures in place that ensure that every email is dealt with every day.

[Rich_Henn]

 

Yikes, what a great post.

 

 

I thank you and I apologize for the heavy reading. :thumbsup:

 

 

Now taking applications for The Kings Hand.

[thehumantorch]

 

Yikes, what a great post.

 

 

I thank you and I apologize for the heavy reading. :thumbsup:

 

 

Now taking applications for The Kings Hand.

 

Ah....do you know where the King's hand spends a fair amount of its time?

[Rich_Henn]

 

Yikes, what a great post.

 

 

I thank you and I apologize for the heavy reading. :thumbsup:

 

 

Now taking applications for The Kings Hand.

 

Ah....do you know where the King's hand spends a fair amount of its time?

 

 

It's the entire reason I am now accepting applications! ::

[thehumantorch]

 

Yikes, what a great post.

 

 

I thank you and I apologize for the heavy reading. :thumbsup:

 

 

Now taking applications for The Kings Hand.

 

Ah....do you know where the King's hand spends a fair amount of its time?

 

 

It's the entire reason I am now accepting applications! ::

 

Polish up your 'resume'

[N/A]

Hey Mods,

Can Rich's post be made a sticky for this subforum?

Seriously.

 

Rich Henn for Signature Series President!

 

Henn 2012

 

Very well stated Rich

 

I would LOVE to read Rich's post but I seriously have to schedule that amount of time.

[Pirate]

quit posting graemlins in every wtb thread and you would have time.

[N/A]

I had to toggle.

 

 

Do I need to sit down and spend hours calculating the percentage of WTB threads I actually post in?

 

I have a copy of your book btw but you're just mean old pirate.

[N/A]

Three questions for the boards. I do believe a useful discussion can ensue.

 

1) Does a facilitator have the right to not ship books to customer when there is an undisputed balance due that far exceeds the value of the few books to be shipped? FYI - CGC’s answer is yes.

 

2) If the customer is so unhappy with the service or grade, does the facilitator have the right to replace the book in question with a raw or graded book of equal or greater condition and refund any money paid (or in some cases just not charge the fee)? Essentially reversing the transaction completely. (Additional fact, website states signatures are not guaranteed).

 

3) What compensation should be given when books are at CGC but the invoice number cannot be found? (Possible reasons, number re-issued by CGC and facilitator not informed, misfiled by facilitator, books are dropped off at the CGC booth and green copy is not given to facilitator at show, unreadable green copy, or my dog ate the green copy.)

 

 

Sharon

 

2 and 3 to me are the same question and if you're soliciting honest business advice then I would suggest one of 2 things. Either cut down on the number of conventions in the short term in order to get your house in order. You should be checking every one of your processes to see what issues arise. If you don't wish to spend the time yourself then hire a 3rd party to do it. It can be quite useful.

 

I suspect the issues are a result of either processes that need improving or to reduce errors then reduce the number of submissions solicited. There appear to be glaring errors in your standard operating procedure and once those are corrected then it boils down to volume. Either more staff is required for the volume or the volume needs to be reduced. Until the procedure are fixed then the amount of attainable volume can't be calculated.