A losing flip!

[clobberintime]

I always liked the Ditko and Romita art but the teen drama never interested me either. I liked the sci fi and fantasy stuff of the FF, Thor and Hulk much better. I was heavily into comics when the X-men restarted and loved the new approach to the book at that time as the story was not so much focused on teens with problems - I think I was around 14 when issue #94 came out.

[Aman619]

I cant believe you guys are serious? Spidey is one of the cornerstones of comics in your lifetimes. I can see not liking long periods of his bad stories, but certainly you have read the original 50 issues at some point... and liked them, no? I mean, Spidey is Spidey! Everybody loves Spidey!! or so I thought.

 

Clearly a huge number of fans did get into the whole melodrama of Spider-Man. The "human touch" to superheroes was of course what distinguished Marvel from its competitors and made it so successful. In small doses, it was palatable, but Stan definitely cranked up the "pathos and bathos" knob to 11 when it came to Spidey, and I just found it hard to stomach after a while. Comics were supposed to be an escape from the Peter Parker-ness of our own drab lives.

 

the melodrama was always overdone I agree. But the newness of Spidey whupping the supervillain, only to have his girlfriend not take his phone call cause he missed their date was eye-opening in comics. Sure its dragged on now for 45 years of variations on the same plots... but in its essense it was a fun read...

 

For me the FF actually became boring once it became cosmic, after Galactus. I stopped reading it in the issues in the 70s and 80s.. Then liked the Doom returns and the Thing as Intergalactic Gladiator series.

[Aman619]

I cant believe you guys are serious? Spidey is one of the cornerstones of comics in your lifetimes. I can see not liking long periods of his bad stories, but certainly you have read the original 50 issues at some point... and liked them, no? I mean, Spidey is Spidey! Everybody loves Spidey!! or so I thought.

 

Clearly a huge number of fans did get into the whole melodrama of Spider-Man. The "human touch" to superheroes was of course what distinguished Marvel from its competitors and made it so successful. In small doses, it was palatable, but Stan definitely cranked up the "pathos and bathos" knob to 11 when it came to Spidey, and I just found it hard to stomach after a while. Comics were supposed to be an escape from the Peter Parker-ness of our own drab lives.

 

the melodrama was always overdone I agree. But the newness of Spidey whupping the supervillain, only to have his girlfriend not take his phone call cause he missed their date was eye-opening in comics. Sure its dragged on now for 45 years of variations on the same plots... but in its essense it was a fun read...

 

For me the FF actually became boring once it became cosmic, after Galactus. I stopped reading it in the issues in the 70s and 80s.. Then liked the Doom returns and the Thing as Intergalactic Gladiator series.

[burntboy]

but Stan definitely cranked up the "pathos and bathos" knob to 11 when it came to Spidey, and I just found it hard to stomach after a while.

 

I agree. I cannot count the number of times I have mentioned the umpteenth instance of Spidey/Parker angst. I mean - come on. Yes, the guy had probelms but enough is enough already.

 

Looks like we've uncovered a simmering core of Spidey discontent!

 

Even starting from the very first issues, didn't you find yourself yelling at Peter Parker "Come on you stupid [!@#%^&^] wimp, just pound the [!@#%^&^] out of Flash Thompson already! And if you need some money, go become a professional boxer, for god's sake, and make a fortune! You can fight crime on the side! Anything, just stop your [!@#%^&^] whining!!!"

 

interesting observations!!!! of course no comic can be universally loved, i just thought that a top ten SA list without AF #15 seemed incomplete. but different strokes for different folks is fine with me.............

[fantastic_four]

Comics were supposed to be an escape from the Peter Parker-ness of our own drab lives.

 

Yea, but with the Peter Parker-ness in there, it's easier to identify with him when he breaks out of it by donning the Spidey costume. Women highly identify with this also, which is one of the main reasons I think Spidey has done so well on the big screen--it appeals to both men and women.

 

 

Even starting from the very first issues, didn't you find yourself yelling at Peter Parker "Come on you stupid [!@#%^&^] wimp, just pound the [!@#%^&^] out of Flash Thompson already! And if you need some money, go become a professional boxer, for god's sake, and make a fortune! You can fight crime on the side! Anything, just stop your [!@#%^&^] whining!!!"

 

You might feel differently if you had done exactly this--used your power for personal gain--and had the most important person in your life die (Uncle Ben) as a direct result of your mis-use of that power.

 

I can't defend everything Stan did from Amazing Spider-Man #1 onwards, but the core story which defines Peter Parker and Spidey in Amazing Fantasy 15, while overly short and sketchy, is absolutely the finest character development of Stan's career. Ultimate Spider-Man and the Spider-Man films haven't really changed the core strengths of that original story or Spidey's character, and that's a HUGE element in their success. It's just really easy for anyone with a modicum of empathy and who has ever felt like an underdog, an outcast, or a loser (geeks, nerds, minority groups, women) to identify with Peter's shy character and his ability to cast the shyness off when he becomes the jokey, acrobatic Spider-Man.

 

I'm not saying everyone should really identify with the character in the way Stan meant for you to--every person reacts in their own way to a story--but it's there, and a LARGE number of people do identify with it rather closely. It was interesting to hear Stan point out in that "Mutants, Monsters, and Marvels" video that an unintended side-effect of Spidey wearing an all-over costume is that it increased people of other races' ability to identify with the character...whether you're black, red, yellow, or olive-skinned, it's more possible to project yourself into Spidey's persona because you can't see his skin or face like you can with a Batman, Superman, Daredevil, etc.

[COI]

I've never had a lot of "Peter Parker" in me so I feel zero affinity for him in those early issues.

 

I don't "identify" with Peter Parker either, but Spidey has always been a favorite. The quality of the book has always been top notch, and as far as comics go, the book as always been pure entertainment for me. Now, it's just about the collectibility of the SA issues.

 

If I only collected books that had any sort of emotional impact on me, my entire collection would consist of several runs of "A death in the Family" and "Born Again".

[rob_react]

I've never had a lot of "Peter Parker" in me so I feel zero affinity for him in those early issues.

 

I don't "identify" with Peter Parker either, but Spidey has always been a favorite. The quality of the book has always been top notch, and as far as comics go, the book as always been pure entertainment for me. Now, it's just about the collectibility of the SA issues.

 

If I only collected books that had any sort of emotional impact on me, my entire collection would consist of several runs of "A death in the Family" and "Born Again".

 

I'm not talking about "emotional impact." I'm talking about the basic connection that you need to feel to a fictional character in order to care enough about them to want to know their story. I can't muster that for Peter Parker in those early issues. Later on, as they moved beyond the teen angst phase I enjoyed the character more, but I never really got into him the way other people obviously have.

[uclapeterg]

I cant believe you guys are serious? Spidey is one of the cornerstones of comics in your lifetimes. I can see not liking long periods of his bad stories, but certainly you have read the original 50 issues at some point... and liked them, no?

 

I read the first 50 issues years ago. There's some good stuff in there, but it didn't work for me in the same way that something like Fantastic Four did. I've never had a lot of "Peter Parker" in me so I feel zero affinity for him in those early issues.

 

EXACTLY.

[uclapeterg]

hmmm, the guy with the username "Fantastic Four" defending Spider-Man?

[*paull*]

I agree with you about "Born Again", but "A Death in the Family" had emotional impact?

[fantastic_four]

hmmm, the guy with the username "Fantastic Four" defending Spider-Man?

 

Check my forum profile--I had Spider-Man listed as "collecting specialty 1" for a long time and just changed it to Fantastic Four recently. I chose my name because it's the same as my ebay name, and most major variants of Spider-Man were taken on ebay. I mostly like FF because they're such a tough challenge to collect in high grade when you compare them to most other Silver Age Marvel titles. JIMs are also tough, but I don't like Thor nearly as much as the FF.

[tth2]

Aman, I heard ya the first time!

[Aman619]

did I repeat myself? cant even remember....

[tth2]

interesting observations!!!! of course no comic can be universally loved, i just thought that a top ten SA list without AF #15 seemed incomplete. but different strokes for different folks is fine with me.............

 

Harry, no question that AF 15 is a Top 3 SA book, due to its significance. And actually, I do like the story in AF 15, with the clever tragic twist.

[tth2]

FF, no question that the Spidey fans outnumber the non-fans, and you do a good job of capturing the reasons why he was so popular.

[tth2]

check above, you replied to the same post twice...

[FlyingDonut]

Maybe it is blasphemy, but I really don't like Silver Age Spider-Man. Peter Parker is just too damned whiny. The angst-o-meter was at about 12 for the first 200 issues or so. How many times did "Spidey Cop Out?"

 

Please. If it was supposed to be the "cutting edge" of realism, Peter would have kicked Flash Thompson's [!@#%^&^] and run off with Gwen and Mary Jane.

[glasgap]

I've never been a Spider-Man fan. I mean, he's cool enough..... but for the most part I never really connected with the character.

 

Same here. For me, the character was dull, both in and out of costume.

 

I watched the Ryder cup this weekend. They had a silly bit on the TV where they asked the players " Spiderman or Batman". The answers were mixed.

 

For Marvelites, I guess the question would be "Spiderman or Fantastic Four". I suspect the younger generations will tend to say "Spiderman" whereas the more "seasoned" of us (21 and a bit!!!) may favour Fantastic Four. I am a big Fantastic Four fan and have sold most of my early Spiderman's to pay for my FF collection. Shows where my loyalties lie.

 

Alan

 

PS Thor may be quite far down the favourites list but he has one of the best "one liners" in Marvel (when battling Hercules in Thor 126) : "NOT ALL THE FURY IN THE HEAVENS - NOT ALL THE SAVAGERY ON EARTH - CAN EQUAL THE SENSES-SHATTERING CYCLONE OF RAGE WHICH IS THOR, WHEN SEIZED BY A POUNDING PAROXYSM OF WRATH.

 

I guess it beats "Hercules, I am a little upset"

[tth2]

Please. If it was supposed to be the "cutting edge" of realism, Peter would have kicked Flash Thompson's [!@#%^&^] and run off with Gwen and Mary Jane.

 

[tth2]

For Marvelites, I guess the question would be "Spiderman or Fantastic Four". I suspect the younger generations will tend to say "Spiderman" whereas the more "seasoned" of us (21 and a bit!!!) may favour Fantastic Four.

 

Actually, when I was a Marvelite, I was into neither. It was Captain America/TOS, X-Men and Avengers for me. In retrospect, I wish I'd collected ASM and FF, though, so I could've received more money when selling them to fund my current DC addiction.