High grade non-keys losing value?

[Mmehdy]

So what, in your learned opinion is the safest bet to "invest" in other than comics that add dividends both to your balance sheet and the enjoyment of your life?

 

I know this question wasn't addressed to me, but if you don't mind, I'll try to put forth some serious thoughts on it, all snarkiness aside (and to be honest, ciorac, aside from being a bit annoyed at the "delusional" thing, I'm not upset in this debate, with you or anyone else... I sometimes get a bit sarcastic as it entertains me a little, which, I know, is a bad habit. But, not having personally met most members, I generally don't remember over time who I've agreed with or disagreed with anyway, so have no idea if this is the first time we've "disagreed", or an ongoing process, so onward...)

 

Short term (meaning 5-10 years) i really have a tough time making any logical assumptions about the marketplace. That's why, whether I'm being sour or not, and maybe I am, I tend to project out 20 or more years because I believe over long periods of time, there are definite patterns in the history of what is popular and collected. This can be useful, perhaps, if you are determing what to set back for your children and grandchildren, but not much use to the person who is directly making the inquiry.

 

With stocks and precious metals there are hundreds of years of patterns and fluctuations to observe, though analyzing them correctly is, of course, the difference between the average person and the mega-millionaires.

 

Most "collectibles", (at least popular ones with ample things to be collected, say, as opposed to Ming vases)... the problem is that these things generally stay culturally relavent for only 2-3 generations. A few last even longer (Sherlock Holmes), and many last much shorter (Beanie Babies).

 

Action #1 keeps getting brought up, but unless one is very wealthy, is totally meaningless in terms of comics investing overall. As long as there are only 150 copies available, and there are at least 200-300 millionaires who want one, the price will keep going up. If someday there are only 50 rich folks who care about it... the price will fall dramatically.

 

There are lots of things short term (under 20 years) that defy predictability. A few years back (maybe 8 or 9?, I'm not sure), I was tracking the progress of an Action #1 that surfaced here in Dayton, but was sold to an out-of-state dealer. Now, this dealer was known for often outrageously high prices on many things. But this Action #1 was graded, if I recall, 3.0 by CGC, and the dealer put it on his website at straight guide value of $50,000. I figured an Action #1, slabbed, and offered at straight guide was a quick sell. But it languished on that site for nearly a year before finally, I presume, selling.

 

Then just a scant few years later, Action #1s, in all grades, are skyrocketing way beyond the normal course for an established and seasoned collectible. Who knew?

 

When the Christopher Reeve Superman movies came out, they had no discernable effect on the value of Superman comic books, that I remember, despite the movies' huge popularity. When Keaton's Batman premiered, there was an uptick in Joker issues, but not astronomical. Movies had some impact on comic values, but not an extraordinary amount.

 

Now, even a rumor of a character appearance can send prices on an issue up ten-fold. Why? I don't have an answer, other than speculators seem to be having a much greater influence on the market today than actual collectors.

 

Anything you get for a bargain price can, of course, be a good investment... especially if that investment can be a quick turn. In the 70s, I have no doubt collectors would have claimed Disney comics will be hot forever, just as superhero collectors say now.

 

There are some things you can count on, however...

 

For one thing, once a thing ceases to be produced (especially in pop culture), its long-term collectibility is likely doomed. As long as something is in the public eye, people will seek out the early and rare examples of that something. But if it ceases to be manufactured, such as dime novels, pulps, BLBs... its allure diminishes over time as later generations are unfamiliar with it.

 

It makes no difference if movies about super-heroes continue to be made or not... that's not what will drive comics collectability as a whole. It makes a difference if monthly comic books continue to be produced. If Marvel or DC go all digital some distant day, a generation or two later will have little connection to physical comics. Super heroes will be only a movie genre to them, not a paper collectible.

If comics continue to be produced for the next 10 or 20 years, back-issues and collectibles should continue to be fairly healthy, with character and genre fluctuations within, of course.

 

Truism #2: nothing totally ceases to be collectible... it just loses mass appeal and easy liquidity. The firsts of anything tend to be collected by someone... a Gutenberg, the first colonial bible, the first detective story, the first Remington rifle, the first Playboy magazine (even as most other issues are becoming near worthless). But once an item ceases to be in the public eye, all but the rarest or most singular examples will inevitably fade in desire and value. How many of you collect buggy whips? Certainly somebody somewhere does... but is it going to be liquid or sought after when you're ready to sell?

 

Pop culture collectibles, beyond the short-term, I don't think can ever be an especially wise investment... the public is too fickle. It's not an investment, it's a lottery ticket. That Action #1 that sold for 1.5 mil. may go for 2 mil., next time, or 1 mil. One's a great investment, one's a huge loss. That's truism #3... when dealing in very valuable items, that are likely only to have a few bidders, any collectible is subject to the whims and fancies of those bidders on any given day, regardless of the trends at large. Most people send major collectibles to auction, and auctions are always unpredictable. If Jack and Jill are the only two people on the planet willing to set a record price for an item (and that's what collectibles investing is... the belief that something will forever keep setting record prices for that item), and Jack gets in a car accident and doesn't make it to the auction... well, tough beans for the seller that day.

 

So anyway... sorry about the mini-series treatment here.

It's so trite I hate to say it... but all you can do is buy what you enjoy, and the luck with "investing" will fall where it may.

 

 

 

 

 

The post of the year. Buying a comic book is buying a lottery ticket, but a Key comic book gives you a much better chance to win it.

 

Let us talk for a second about paper life, I had a good conversation with John V about the life of a comic book a couple of years ago and white pages will last a heck of a lot longer, now I am hoping these will not crumble to dust in 40 to 50 years due to the acid in the pape and unlike coins or paintings or art, this is a lifetime cap on a comic book.

 

Folks, it is plain and simple...NOTHING IS GUARANTEED.....ever. When I bought Action 1 for $1800 which was 3 times mint guide people thought I lost my mind. I took gamble, a chance....those days are over. Be careful what you buy and how much you pay.

[Beige]

... but I'm not sold on comparing comics with pulp magazines to make the case. Aside from a couple of failed film attempts, pulp nostalgia never evolved into the widespread media-fueled hobby vis-à-vis comic books (with stratospheric prices paid for iconic titles that coincide with lucrative franchise tie-ins).

 

I have to disagree with this. Until James Bond came along, Tarzan was probably the most popular film franchise in history. And there were tons of cross-promotional items. The symbiotic relationship between the radio program and the pulp magazine kept The Shadow hugely popular in both formats for two decades. Zorro? Movies and TV shows. Lots of media tie-ins. Philip Marlowe was a big hit on radio, and helped further the careers of Humphrey Bogart and Powell. Buck Rogers began in the pulps and became a mega-media sensation. Dr. Kildare became a hit TV series. Max Brand spawned tons of B-westerns. Hopalong Cassidy was probably as popular in his day as Spider-Man is now.

 

Items tying in to these characters became quite collectible early on. Burroughs 1st editions were bringing big dollars even back in the 1960s. Chandler was an early favorite of book collectors. Some of these are still quite valuable, some are beginning to decline.

 

If anything, this points out the opposite argument. Even mega-media characters who are household names have their time and place... and no matter how big, are someday supplanted by something new.

Li'l Abner is the perfect example of this.

The comic strip ran for over 43 years!

August 13, 1934 through November 13, 1977.

It had Licensing, advertising and promotion in the hundreds, plus it also had 7 movies made about it.

It also had a 35 million dollar theme park called Dogpatch USA that is now abandoned collecting dust.

dogpatch-u-s-a abandoned

Yep, I would say if it could happen to Li'l Abner,then it could happen to obscure golden age characters. Ask anybody under the age of 40 who Li'l Abner is?

 

Late reply - I'm amazed the abandoned dogpatch hasn't been raked over by scavengers. Those small cartoon-like parts of rides, and especially the kiddy park types would look great in someones home - especially if they have a huge back yard.

What a waste to see it rusting away.

That's quite sad tbh.

[Beige]

Just to throw my in as a late comer to collecting HG comics...

There is no doubt that this medium will continue to be collected. None.

It's just too fascinating.

At work, my collegues who are all at the top end of their field, are fascinated by my foray into the world of comic books.

I took my Tec '66 into work to show a friend the beginning of Two-Face - and the fact he was originally called Harvey Kent was quite the revelation!

People ask me frequently - 'what do you have this week Andy?'

A couple of people have started buying and reading floppies, directly because of my introducing comics into their lives.

Uber, by Avatar is the new favourite!

Will these people collect? Who knows. I do know an anaesthetist who now collects (nothing to do with me) SA keys. So will 2 collectors in the same Hospital help? I think yes. When a cardiologist sits in the tea-room reading Uber, then the genre isn't dead!

There is a fascination with comics that isn't translated to most other mediums. And it is quite ok now, to be a comic fan.

As for kids - my 19yr old has a couple of slabbed comics, and a lot of TPB's, and he attends every comic show in Melbourne, with a group of 10 - 20 fellow university students.

They are into moderns of course, but their interest is slowly going back to the bronze age.

TMNT and all that.

The Silver Age beckons.

The best bit is that upon graduation, they will all have good careers and soon after a nice disposable (after-mortgage) income!

 

I'm waffling, I know, but I really can't see anyway but 'steady as she goes' for the comic book industry.

[tb]

Depends on the titles. I collect Detective and Batman villain covers. They have all actually increased in price. Try finding a tec69 cheap... Or any of the early Joker covers. It depends on the character and the supply. Batman, superman doesn't decline very easy. Especially Batman... In the past 10 years every copy has increased. I agree with the duck books. People are not as interested in Disney books right now. I have been buying these because I really like them. Recently got a Four color 16. As soon as I noticed the prices had dropped I snagged a copy. Why? Well because Disney will never let mickey die. At any moment he can regain popularity and the book would just go right back up.

 

My own impression is that higher end Disney comics have been stagnant overall for the last 10 years, dropping a little when taking inflation into account. There have been huge price drops since the fall of 2008, but they even out with equally steep increases in 2006-08. But I agree that right now is one of the best times ever to buy quality Disney books: there seems to be unusually few buyers and many very nice books are falling through the cracks. 5-7 years ago, there were multiple aggressive bidders for just about every second or third tier book that came up for auction.

[rjpb]

Based on a lot what I've bought lately for my collection, Korean War nostalgia will have to hit real big for it to turn into an investment.

[Cat-Man_America]

Based on a lot what I've bought lately for my collection, Korean War nostalgia will have to hit real big for it to turn into an investment.

 

[font:Times New Roman]Those books could see significant gains after Dennis Rodman's full court press for peace.[/font] (thumbs u

[frozentundraguy]

Based on a lot what I've bought lately for my collection, Korean War nostalgia will have to hit real big for it to turn into an investment.

 

[font:Times New Roman]Those books could see significant gains after Dennis Rodman's full court press for peace.[/font] (thumbs u

 

 

[DeliBebek]

Value! Pshaw!

[AmazingSaul]

Depends on the titles. I collect Detective and Batman villain covers. They have all actually increased in price. Try finding a tec69 cheap... Or any of the early Joker covers. It depends on the character and the supply. Batman, superman doesn't decline very easy. Especially Batman... In the past 10 years every copy has increased. I agree with the duck books. People are not as interested in Disney books right now. I have been buying these because I really like them. Recently got a Four color 16. As soon as I noticed the prices had dropped I snagged a copy. Why? Well because Disney will never let mickey die. At any moment he can regain popularity and the book would just go right back up.

 

My own impression is that higher end Disney comics have been stagnant overall for the last 10 years, dropping a little when taking inflation into account. There have been huge price drops since the fall of 2008, but they even out with equally steep increases in 2006-08. But I agree that right now is one of the best times ever to buy quality Disney books: there seems to be unusually few buyers and many very nice books are falling through the cracks. 5-7 years ago, there were multiple aggressive bidders for just about every second or third tier book that came up for auction.

 

Exactly! That's what I do when I notice declines. For example I know this is GA... But showcase 22 dropped alot.... I picked up a few copies because it is cheap right now. The problem is I collect Batman as my main focus point. I try to get the expensive ones first before they are too expensive... My off comics are Disney and planet comics or silver age DC. I don't own much of marvel other than some keys. It's best to collect what you like. I grew up by anaheim so Disney has always grabbed my attention. It isn't priority but since I noticed low prices I gladly take the copies in.

[Bookery]

First customer in today, walks up to the counter and announces that he's new to collecting, and want to know what he should invest in.

 

I thought about pointing him to this thread, but I guess it's not very good business to terrify a potential consumer!

 

[Flex Mentallo]

First customer in today, walks up to the counter and announces that he's new to collecting, and want to know what he should invest in.

 

I thought about pointing him to this thread, but I guess it's not very good business to terrify a potential consumer!

 

Or anyone else

 

Hee hee

[Cat-Man_America]

First customer in today, walks up to the counter and announces that he's new to collecting, and want to know what he should invest in.

 

I thought about pointing him to this thread, but I guess it's not very good business to terrify a potential consumer!

 

Or anyone else

 

Hee hee

 

Flex, allow me to restate my simple philosophy in respect to collecting (this pun bears repeating):

 

[font:Times New Roman]To keep your head above water never buy what you can't fiord.[/font]

[mrmyst]

First customer in today, walks up to the counter and announces that he's new to collecting, and want to know what he should invest in.

 

I thought about pointing him to this thread, but I guess it's not very good business to terrify a potential consumer!

 

Or anyone else

 

Hee hee

 

Flex, allow me to restate my simple philosophy in respect to collecting (this pun bears repeating):

 

[font:Times New Roman]To keep your head above water never buy what you can't fiord.[/font]

 

Dam.

[Bookery]

First customer in today, walks up to the counter and announces that he's new to collecting, and want to know what he should invest in.

 

I thought about pointing him to this thread, but I guess it's not very good business to terrify a potential consumer!

 

Or anyone else

 

Hee hee

 

Flex, allow me to restate my simple philosophy in respect to collecting (this pun bears repeating):

 

[font:Times New Roman]To keep your head above water never buy what you can't fiord.[/font]

 

Dam.

 

Water you trying to say?

 

[Cat-Man_America]

First customer in today, walks up to the counter and announces that he's new to collecting, and want to know what he should invest in.

 

I thought about pointing him to this thread, but I guess it's not very good business to terrify a potential consumer!

 

Or anyone else

 

Hee hee

 

Flex, allow me to restate my simple philosophy in respect to collecting (this pun bears repeating):

 

[font:Times New Roman]To keep your head above water never buy what you can't fiord.[/font]

 

Dam.

 

Water you trying to say?

 

[font:Times New Roman]Don't follow the wave, get on board early and ride it! [/font]

[DarrenSmith]

I think so, too. The success of super hero movies has really been rather unexpected, if you think about it. Stan Lee spent years trying to interest a major studio in the Marvel properties. Super heroes on prime time TV consisted of the 1950s Superman series, the short-lived 1960s campy Batman series, and the even shorter-lived Green Hornet series -- unless I'm forgetting something.

 

 

 

I also remember watching 'The Flash,' 'Shazam,' 'Isis,' and I watched a few episodes of the new Green Arrow show named 'Arrow' plus there was Spiderman that I think was a made for TV movie, but it possibly could have been a TV show.

[mintcollector]

First customer in today, walks up to the counter and announces that he's new to collecting, and want to know what he should invest in.

 

I thought about pointing him to this thread, but I guess it's not very good business to terrify a potential consumer!

 

!

 

You should try being in the antiques business every time Kovel's releases their 'top ten' list...or whenever something interesting is shown on Pawn Stars, American Pickers, or Antiques Roadshow.

 

I can relate...

 

 

[Mmehdy]

First customer in today, walks up to the counter and announces that he's new to collecting, and want to know what he should invest in.

 

I thought about pointing him to this thread, but I guess it's not very good business to terrify a potential consumer!

 

What did you advise him to do......Ga or SA or both or NONE?

[rjpb]

First customer in today, walks up to the counter and announces that he's new to collecting, and want to know what he should invest in.

 

I thought about pointing him to this thread, but I guess it's not very good business to terrify a potential consumer!

 

What did you advise him to do......Ga or SA or both or NONE?

 

The 1948 issue of Highlights for Children with the first Goofus and Gallant once the movie is announced.

[Mmehdy]

First customer in today, walks up to the counter and announces that he's new to collecting, and want to know what he should invest in.

 

I thought about pointing him to this thread, but I guess it's not very good business to terrify a potential consumer!

 

What did you advise him to do......Ga or SA or both or NONE?

 

The 1948 issue of Highlights for Children with the first Goofus and Gallant once the movie is announced.

 

 

You should keep it where it belongs....in your collection