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Amazing Fantasy 15

Started by BEAUMONTS,

39 posts in this topic

TwoFace-migration

TwoFace-migration

Posted
Posted
No, I haven't contacted him. It looks kind of fishy with the 1 feedback, but If I lived in the area I would see if I could take a look. confused-smiley-013.gif

 

The thing that would have initially turned me off on this auction is that in his first line he states with certainty how each book is unrestored and even gives a "offical" like grade range.......but if you read the bottom part, he goes on to say how he basically knows nothing about comics.....

 

HOWEVER...if you check the feedback, this transaction was legit.....btmp took some risk and possibly hit a mini jackpot......

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TwoFace-migration

TwoFace-migration

Posted
Posted

Here is a dumb dumb question....say in the scenario that this seller was a complete shill...and the buyer sent out $6K and got oreo cookies instead....what happens to his money?????????? does eBay cut you a check for your losses....like FDIC insures a bank, or are you just screwed?? and does it matter if you paid for the auction via money order or PAYPAL....

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Silver Surfer

Silver Surfer

Posted
Posted
Here is a dumb dumb question....say in the scenario that this seller was a complete shill...and the buyer sent out $6K and got oreo cookies instead....what happens to his money?????????? does eBay cut you a check for your losses....like FDIC insures a bank, or are you just screwed?? and does it matter if you paid for the auction via money order or PAYPAL....

 

Wouldn't it be best to send payment via a money order? That way it can be traced to the individual and really all you have to worry about is whether these are unrestored as the seller claims? Take the books to a LCS and have them do a quick resto check on the expensive items? Forgot to check the sellers return policy.

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TwoFace-migration

TwoFace-migration

Posted
Posted
Here is a dumb dumb question....say in the scenario that this seller was a complete shill...and the buyer sent out $6K and got oreo cookies instead....what happens to his money?????????? does eBay cut you a check for your losses....like FDIC insures a bank, or are you just screwed?? and does it matter if you paid for the auction via money order or PAYPAL....

 

Wouldn't it be best to send payment via a money order? That way it can be traced to the individual and really all you have to worry about is whether these are unrestored as the seller claims? Take the books to a LCS and have them do a quick resto check on the expensive items? Forgot to check the sellers return policy.

 

Your right on this point...I should have better amplified.....in this hyopthetical case, where you are sent nothing, its a complete scam.....what happens to your money?? who steps in to cover your loss since the shill seller is most likely sophisticated enough to have a good exit strategy not leading to himself......

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sfilosa

sfilosa

Posted
Posted

The buyer seems to know enough to tell you the books aren't CGC'd but uses their numerical termonology.

 

Also, of the 594 issues of Amazing Fantasy that are graded, 214 are restored. That's means one out of every three copies has been restored (which is a huge percentage).

 

And if you think your LCS dealer can spot all restoration, good luck. Even most of the season dealers can't spot all restoration.

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mrwoogieman

mrwoogieman

Posted
Posted
The buyer seems to know enough to tell you the books aren't CGC'd but uses their numerical termonology.

 

Also, of the 594 issues of Amazing Fantasy that are graded, 214 are restored. That's means one out of every three copies has been restored (which is a huge percentage).

 

And if you think your LCS dealer can spot all restoration, good luck. Even most of the season dealers can't spot all restoration.

 

And a trimmed right edge ranks right up there among the toughest to detect category, even if you've been at it for years. Cover overhang helps a lot, but if that right edge front cover is flush with the interior pages, most dealers I know will look, look and look again to see if they can detect trimming or not.

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reykjavik

reykjavik

Posted
Posted
Here is a dumb dumb question....say in the scenario that this seller was a complete shill...and the buyer sent out $6K and got oreo cookies instead....what happens to his money?????????? does eBay cut you a check for your losses....like FDIC insures a bank, or are you just screwed?? and does it matter if you paid for the auction via money order or PAYPAL....

 

Wouldn't it be best to send payment via a money order? That way it can be traced to the individual and really all you have to worry about is whether these are unrestored as the seller claims? Take the books to a LCS and have them do a quick resto check on the expensive items? Forgot to check the sellers return policy.

 

Your right on this point...I should have better amplified.....in this hyopthetical case, where you are sent nothing, its a complete scam.....what happens to your money?? who steps in to cover your loss since the shill seller is most likely sophisticated enough to have a good exit strategy not leading to himself......

 

 

eBay only insures up to something like $250 dollars (they, for some reason, aren't held to american tort laws). Money Orders offer NO PROTECTION WHATSOEVER! DO NOT send a money order if you need protection. An MO is merely proof of payment (like for court, or reimbursement etc...). Paypal as well offers no protection when paying by bank transfer. If you want to use eBay and you want protection, pay by PayPal but under "Funding Options" click on "Change Fundtion Options" and change it to credit card funding only. Then, if you get screwed you can cancel the payment with your credit card company. Sending checks, MO's and paypal bank transfers offers practically no protection.

 

(the paypal stuff was accurate as to a few months ago, they could have changed their policy since)

 

Also, the mere fact that someone has positive feedback from "legit" auctions does not mean they are legit. Often times people will put up false auctions and have their friends win them and leave positive feedback. I've heard of people doing this 250+ times leaving a seller with great positive feedback. Then theyll post $250,000 dollars worth of goods and well you know the rest. So, if it seems to good to be true (like someone with only 2positives putting up a collection of some of the best comics in the world for only 6 grand) there is a high chance it is a scam. I've done a lot of research on eBay scams and am in the process of starting a class action suit against eBay. If you have any quetions feel free to PM me or email me.

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FFB

FFB

Posted
Posted
Here is a dumb dumb question....say in the scenario that this seller was a complete shill...and the buyer sent out $6K and got oreo cookies instead....what happens to his money?????????? does eBay cut you a check for your losses....like FDIC insures a bank, or are you just screwed?? and does it matter if you paid for the auction via money order or PAYPAL....

 

Wouldn't it be best to send payment via a money order? That way it can be traced to the individual and really all you have to worry about is whether these are unrestored as the seller claims? Take the books to a LCS and have them do a quick resto check on the expensive items? Forgot to check the sellers return policy.

 

Your right on this point...I should have better amplified.....in this hyopthetical case, where you are sent nothing, its a complete scam.....what happens to your money?? who steps in to cover your loss since the shill seller is most likely sophisticated enough to have a good exit strategy not leading to himself......

 

 

eBay only insures up to something like $250 dollars (they, for some reason, aren't held to american tort laws).

 

What do you mean, they aren't held to american tort laws? confused.gif They most certainly are.

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reykjavik

reykjavik

Posted
Posted
Here is a dumb dumb question....say in the scenario that this seller was a complete shill...and the buyer sent out $6K and got oreo cookies instead....what happens to his money?????????? does eBay cut you a check for your losses....like FDIC insures a bank, or are you just screwed?? and does it matter if you paid for the auction via money order or PAYPAL....

 

Wouldn't it be best to send payment via a money order? That way it can be traced to the individual and really all you have to worry about is whether these are unrestored as the seller claims? Take the books to a LCS and have them do a quick resto check on the expensive items? Forgot to check the sellers return policy.

 

Your right on this point...I should have better amplified.....in this hyopthetical case, where you are sent nothing, its a complete scam.....what happens to your money?? who steps in to cover your loss since the shill seller is most likely sophisticated enough to have a good exit strategy not leading to himself......

 

 

eBay only insures up to something like $250 dollars (they, for some reason, aren't held to american tort laws).

 

What do you mean, they aren't held to american tort laws? confused.gif They most certainly are.

 

 

Nope. Unfortunately they aren't. If you were to sell something and make a percentagae based on the final price of that sale, then you are held at least secondarily liable for fraud in most cases. Thats why newspapers/tv/radio/magazines etc... just charge a blanket posting fee. Once you charge a blanket posting fee AND a final value fee based on that sale, and then you are in furtherance of that sale by connecting the seller and the buyer, AND you then own the payment company, you normally are held liable for some degree of the fraud. Often times you are held entirely liable (so eBay would pay you back 100% and then sue the 3rd party for their share of the payment). That is why when Sothebys sells stolen art without doing beyond due diligance they are held partially liable when the art is uncovered as stolen. eBay however, is not held to ANY of this because legislatures are ignorant to this major loophole. It happened because eBay started out as a regular auction house online. Then they started final fees, then "buy it now" buttons, before you know it their competition for Amazon.com but still being legislatively protected as a mere cute little online auction house.

 

Ever wonder why ebay is the one of the only web sites making billions of dolars of profit? If I sell you something with zero liability for everything I sold, lets see how quickly I become a billionaire as well.

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FFB

FFB

Posted
Posted
Here is a dumb dumb question....say in the scenario that this seller was a complete shill...and the buyer sent out $6K and got oreo cookies instead....what happens to his money?????????? does eBay cut you a check for your losses....like FDIC insures a bank, or are you just screwed?? and does it matter if you paid for the auction via money order or PAYPAL....

 

Wouldn't it be best to send payment via a money order? That way it can be traced to the individual and really all you have to worry about is whether these are unrestored as the seller claims? Take the books to a LCS and have them do a quick resto check on the expensive items? Forgot to check the sellers return policy.

 

Your right on this point...I should have better amplified.....in this hyopthetical case, where you are sent nothing, its a complete scam.....what happens to your money?? who steps in to cover your loss since the shill seller is most likely sophisticated enough to have a good exit strategy not leading to himself......

 

 

eBay only insures up to something like $250 dollars (they, for some reason, aren't held to american tort laws).

 

What do you mean, they aren't held to american tort laws? confused.gif They most certainly are.

 

 

Nope. Unfortunately they aren't. If you were to sell something and make a percentagae based on the final price of that sale, then you are held at least secondarily liable for fraud in most cases. Thats why newspapers/tv/radio/magazines etc... just charge a blanket posting fee. Once you charge a blanket posting fee AND a final value fee based on that sale, and then you are in furtherance of that sale by connecting the seller and the buyer, AND you then own the payment company, you normally are held liable for some degree of the fraud. Often times you are held entirely liable (so eBay would pay you back 100% and then sue the 3rd party for their share of the payment). That is why when Sothebys sells stolen art without doing beyond due diligance they are held partially liable when the art is uncovered as stolen. eBay however, is not held to ANY of this because legislatures are ignorant to this major loophole. It happened because eBay started out as a regular auction house online. Then they started final fees, then "buy it now" buttons, before you know it their competition for Amazon.com but still being legislatively protected as a mere cute little online auction house.

 

Ever wonder why ebay is the one of the only web sites making billions of dolars of profit? If I sell you something and zero liability for everything I sold, lets see how quickly I become a billionaire as well.

 

Secondarily liable for fraud? How? Tort liability for fraud and deceit requires a showing of "intent to defraud" (i.e., intent to induce reliance) and knowledge of falsity in every state in the United States. Admit it - you're just making this up, aren't you.

 

You want to cite me to some of these "american tort laws" that would render ebay "secondarily liable for fraud" based on a bogus auction? Stolen artwork is a special animal with its own set of laws that deal primarily with recovery of artwork stolen by the Nazis during the Holocaust. California (along with many other states) has a special statute, Code of Civil Procedure section 354.3, that allows the rightful owner to sue to recover the artwork (not sue for fraud and deceit just because the auction house unwittingly came to possess the artwork) long after the theft. But that has nothing to do with what you're talking about.

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reykjavik

reykjavik

Posted
Posted
Here is a dumb dumb question....say in the scenario that this seller was a complete shill...and the buyer sent out $6K and got oreo cookies instead....what happens to his money?????????? does eBay cut you a check for your losses....like FDIC insures a bank, or are you just screwed?? and does it matter if you paid for the auction via money order or PAYPAL....

 

Wouldn't it be best to send payment via a money order? That way it can be traced to the individual and really all you have to worry about is whether these are unrestored as the seller claims? Take the books to a LCS and have them do a quick resto check on the expensive items? Forgot to check the sellers return policy.

 

Your right on this point...I should have better amplified.....in this hyopthetical case, where you are sent nothing, its a complete scam.....what happens to your money?? who steps in to cover your loss since the shill seller is most likely sophisticated enough to have a good exit strategy not leading to himself......

 

 

eBay only insures up to something like $250 dollars (they, for some reason, aren't held to american tort laws).

 

What do you mean, they aren't held to american tort laws? confused.gif They most certainly are.

 

 

Nope. Unfortunately they aren't. If you were to sell something and make a percentagae based on the final price of that sale, then you are held at least secondarily liable for fraud in most cases. Thats why newspapers/tv/radio/magazines etc... just charge a blanket posting fee. Once you charge a blanket posting fee AND a final value fee based on that sale, and then you are in furtherance of that sale by connecting the seller and the buyer, AND you then own the payment company, you normally are held liable for some degree of the fraud. Often times you are held entirely liable (so eBay would pay you back 100% and then sue the 3rd party for their share of the payment). That is why when Sothebys sells stolen art without doing beyond due diligance they are held partially liable when the art is uncovered as stolen. eBay however, is not held to ANY of this because legislatures are ignorant to this major loophole. It happened because eBay started out as a regular auction house online. Then they started final fees, then "buy it now" buttons, before you know it their competition for Amazon.com but still being legislatively protected as a mere cute little online auction house.

 

Ever wonder why ebay is the one of the only web sites making billions of dolars of profit? If I sell you something and zero liability for everything I sold, lets see how quickly I become a billionaire as well.

 

Secondarily liable for fraud? How? Tort liability for fraud and deceit requires a showing of "intent to defraud" (i.e., intent to induce reliance) and knowledge of falsity in every state in the United States. Admit it - you're just making this up, aren't you.

 

You want to cite me to some of these "american tort laws" that would render ebay "secondarily liable for fraud" based on a bogus auction? Stolen artwork is a special animal with its own set of laws that deal primarily with recovery of artwork stolen by the Nazis during the Holocaust. California (along with many other states) has a special statute, Code of Civil Procedure section 354.3, that allows the rightful owner to sue to recover the artwork (not sue for fraud and deceit just because the auction house unwittingly came to possess the artwork) long after the theft. But that has nothing to do with what you're talking about.

 

Youre right, i dont know what Im talking about...Im not a lawyer, but Ive been talking to some and picked up a little here and little there, Im not sure on ANY of the terminology (as this was a while ago, and even then I wasn't sure on the terminology), I am sure they did come up with something that would hold them liable. The reason why they didn't want to go through with the class suit was because of the millions of dollars of notice money they would have to put out and either they didn't have the money or couldnt find investors (or the payout wouldn't be anything substantial).

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FFB

FFB

Posted
Posted

Youre right, i dont know what Im talking about...Im not a lawyer, but Ive been talking to some and picked up a little here and little there, Im not sure on ANY of the terminology (as this was a while ago, and even then I wasn't sure on the terminology), I am sure they did come up with something that would hold them liable. The reason why they didn't want to go through with the class suit was because of the millions of dollars of notice money they would have to put out and either they didn't have the money or couldnt find investors (or the payout wouldn't be anything substantial).

 

I don't doubt that you may have spoken to someone who was a lawyer, but I will tell you that in my experience (which includes defending against several consumer class action lawsuits) I have never seen a class action plaintiff's lawyer worth his salt walk away from a suit against an entity like Ebay because of something like notice fees. In California, especially, Business & Professions Code section 17200 and the private attorney general statute (which permits a lawyer to apply for attorney's fees at what I think are grossly inflated rates, PLUS a multiplier, in cases such as a consumer class action case) would give the lawyer (who already has a huge war chest for things like notice fees) a huge arsenal of weaponry.

 

The attorney's fees in a class action suit of this magnitude would be several million dollars, if not tens of millions, which would offer more than enough of an incentive to take the case if there was any solid theory of liability. And if the defendant is truly liable for anything, the defendant usually has to pay the notice fees as part of the eventual settlement.

 

More likely, the reason no one has gone ahead with the suit is because ebay can't be held liable for the things you're talking about. They specifically disclaim any such liability in their user agreement, and buyers and sellers agree to those terms as a condition of using the site.

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