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Cole Schave collection: face jobs?

Started by namisgr,

4,963 posts in this topic

Bomber-Bob

Bomber-Bob

Posted
Posted

I've recently looked over hundreds of my SA comics. I only found one example that had the right edge fanning in anything close to this severity. This does not happen this often from natural conditions. Assuming these books were submitted in bulk to CGC, why didn't the graders notice this condition and downgrade for it. Instead, it looks like most got bumped up. What the heck is going on, this is mass destruction of nice books. It would be nice to hear from Paul Litch on this matter.

 

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DrWatson

DrWatson

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Posted
I've recently looked over hundreds of my SA comics. I only found one example that had the right edge fanning in anything close to this severity. This does not happen this often from natural conditions. Assuming these books were submitted in bulk to CGC, why didn't the graders notice this condition and downgrade for it. Instead, it looks like most got bumped up. What the heck is going on, this is mass destruction of nice books. It would be nice to hear from Paul Litch on this matter.

Did you ever stop to think who might actually be pressing these books? Doug isn't pressing them himself.

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Bomber-Bob

Bomber-Bob

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Posted
I've recently looked over hundreds of my SA comics. I only found one example that had the right edge fanning in anything close to this severity. This does not happen this often from natural conditions. Assuming these books were submitted in bulk to CGC, why didn't the graders notice this condition and downgrade for it. Instead, it looks like most got bumped up. What the heck is going on, this is mass destruction of nice books. It would be nice to hear from Paul Litch on this matter.

Did you ever stop to think who might actually be pressing these books? Doug isn't pressing them himself.

 

I know there is a lot of insinuation that this happened inhouse at CGC but I just can't believe it. If it's true, all integrity has been lost.

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Green

Green

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Posted
I've recently looked over hundreds of my SA comics. I only found one example that had the right edge fanning in anything close to this severity. This does not happen this often from natural conditions. Assuming these books were submitted in bulk to CGC, why didn't the graders notice this condition and downgrade for it. Instead, it looks like most got bumped up. What the heck is going on, this is mass destruction of nice books. It would be nice to hear from Paul Litch on this matter.

Did you ever stop to think who might actually be pressing these books? Doug isn't pressing them himself.

 

I know there is a lot of insinuation that this happened inhouse at CGC but I just can't believe it. If it's true, all integrity has been lost.

 

Wttb.

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drbanner

drbanner

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Posted
I've recently looked over hundreds of my SA comics. I only found one example that had the right edge fanning in anything close to this severity. This does not happen this often from natural conditions. Assuming these books were submitted in bulk to CGC, why didn't the graders notice this condition and downgrade for it. Instead, it looks like most got bumped up. What the heck is going on, this is mass destruction of nice books. It would be nice to hear from Paul Litch on this matter.

Did you ever stop to think who might actually be pressing these books? Doug isn't pressing them himself.

I know there is a lot of insinuation that this happened inhouse at CGC...

Matt/CGC did this to these books? Comics by George Costanza?

 

You gotta be kidding me... :cry:

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Gotham Kid

Gotham Kid

Posted
Posted
I've recently looked over hundreds of my SA comics. I only found one example that had the right edge fanning in anything close to this severity. This does not happen this often from natural conditions. Assuming these books were submitted in bulk to CGC, why didn't the graders notice this condition and downgrade for it. Instead, it looks like most got bumped up. What the heck is going on, this is mass destruction of nice books. It would be nice to hear from Paul Litch on this matter.

Did you ever stop to think who might actually be pressing these books? Doug isn't pressing them himself.

 

I know there is a lot of insinuation that this happened inhouse at CGC but I just can't believe it. If it's true, all integrity has been lost.

 

:popcorn:

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Flaming_Telepath

Flaming_Telepath

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Posted
I've recently looked over hundreds of my SA comics. I only found one example that had the right edge fanning in anything close to this severity. This does not happen this often from natural conditions. Assuming these books were submitted in bulk to CGC, why didn't the graders notice this condition and downgrade for it. Instead, it looks like most got bumped up. What the heck is going on, this is mass destruction of nice books. It would be nice to hear from Paul Litch on this matter.

Did you ever stop to think who might actually be pressing these books? Doug isn't pressing them himself.

 

I know there is a lot of insinuation that this happened inhouse at CGC but I just can't believe it. If it's true, all integrity has been lost.

 

Why can't you believe it?

 

Why would Doug start using a different presser now that Matt's with CGC? Beyond Matt's obvious skills, I'd suggest that he has even more reason to continue using Matt these days.

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gyro-1

gyro-1

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could joey reproduce this effect on a cheep book to see how it happens ?

If you know exactly how to reproduce this effect you should be able to never let it happen and prove or disprove if it is pressing ?

This brings CGC pressing into question

not good

:(

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Bomber-Bob

Bomber-Bob

Posted
Posted
I've recently looked over hundreds of my SA comics. I only found one example that had the right edge fanning in anything close to this severity. This does not happen this often from natural conditions. Assuming these books were submitted in bulk to CGC, why didn't the graders notice this condition and downgrade for it. Instead, it looks like most got bumped up. What the heck is going on, this is mass destruction of nice books. It would be nice to hear from Paul Litch on this matter.

Did you ever stop to think who might actually be pressing these books? Doug isn't pressing them himself.

 

I know there is a lot of insinuation that this happened inhouse at CGC but I just can't believe it. If it's true, all integrity has been lost.

 

Why can't you believe it?

 

Why would Doug start using a different presser now that Matt's with CGC? Beyond Matt's obvious skills, I'd suggest that he has even more reason to continue using Matt these days.

 

First off, I have no knowledge of, historically, who does Doug's pressing.

Second, these are terrible press jobs. This does not look like his work.

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gaz973

gaz973

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this is exactly one of the sort of occurrences that creates one of those conflicts of interest that a whole bunch of board members warned about when it was announced that Matt Nelson would be working with CGC.

 

 

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DrWatson

DrWatson

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Posted
I've recently looked over hundreds of my SA comics. I only found one example that had the right edge fanning in anything close to this severity. This does not happen this often from natural conditions. Assuming these books were submitted in bulk to CGC, why didn't the graders notice this condition and downgrade for it. Instead, it looks like most got bumped up. What the heck is going on, this is mass destruction of nice books. It would be nice to hear from Paul Litch on this matter.

Did you ever stop to think who might actually be pressing these books? Doug isn't pressing them himself.

 

I know there is a lot of insinuation that this happened inhouse at CGC but I just can't believe it. If it's true, all integrity has been lost.

 

Why can't you believe it?

 

Why would Doug start using a different presser now that Matt's with CGC? Beyond Matt's obvious skills, I'd suggest that he has even more reason to continue using Matt these days.

 

First off, I have no knowledge of, historically, who does Doug's pressing.

Second, these are terrible press jobs. This does not look like his work.

Depends on what one considers terrible, doesn't it?

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Green

Green

Posted
Posted
I've recently looked over hundreds of my SA comics. I only found one example that had the right edge fanning in anything close to this severity. This does not happen this often from natural conditions. Assuming these books were submitted in bulk to CGC, why didn't the graders notice this condition and downgrade for it. Instead, it looks like most got bumped up. What the heck is going on, this is mass destruction of nice books. It would be nice to hear from Paul Litch on this matter.

Did you ever stop to think who might actually be pressing these books? Doug isn't pressing them himself.

 

I know there is a lot of insinuation that this happened inhouse at CGC but I just can't believe it. If it's true, all integrity has been lost.

 

Why can't you believe it?

 

Why would Doug start using a different presser now that Matt's with CGC? Beyond Matt's obvious skills, I'd suggest that he has even more reason to continue using Matt these days.

 

First off, I have no knowledge of, historically, who does Doug's pressing.

Second, these are terrible press jobs. This does not look like his work.

Depends on what one considers terrible, doesn't it?

:applause:
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drbanner

drbanner

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Posted
this is exactly one of the sort of occurrences that creates one of those conflicts of interest that a whole bunch of board members warned about when it was announced that Matt Nelson would be working with CGC.

Indeed, if CGC these books up themselves in-house, that's a travesty against our hobby.

 

I'd like to see the latest Esquirecomics audit report on how his 3rd-party oversight is working. You know, ensuring that CGC is making sure that CGC doesn't get preferential treatment when CGC presses books for you before CGC grades them. lol

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Flaming_Telepath

Flaming_Telepath

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Posted
I've recently looked over hundreds of my SA comics. I only found one example that had the right edge fanning in anything close to this severity. This does not happen this often from natural conditions. Assuming these books were submitted in bulk to CGC, why didn't the graders notice this condition and downgrade for it. Instead, it looks like most got bumped up. What the heck is going on, this is mass destruction of nice books. It would be nice to hear from Paul Litch on this matter.

Did you ever stop to think who might actually be pressing these books? Doug isn't pressing them himself.

 

I know there is a lot of insinuation that this happened inhouse at CGC but I just can't believe it. If it's true, all integrity has been lost.

 

Why can't you believe it?

 

Why would Doug start using a different presser now that Matt's with CGC? Beyond Matt's obvious skills, I'd suggest that he has even more reason to continue using Matt these days.

 

First off, I have no knowledge of, historically, who does Doug's pressing.

Second, these are terrible press jobs. This does not look like his work.

Depends on what one considers terrible, doesn't it?

 

Indeed.

 

Pressing is designed firstly and foremostly to get a grade bump at CGC.

 

If it makes the books look better, that's an added bonus, but it's not a deal-breaker.

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thehumantorch

thehumantorch

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Posted
I've recently looked over hundreds of my SA comics. I only found one example that had the right edge fanning in anything close to this severity. This does not happen this often from natural conditions. Assuming these books were submitted in bulk to CGC, why didn't the graders notice this condition and downgrade for it. Instead, it looks like most got bumped up. What the heck is going on, this is mass destruction of nice books. It would be nice to hear from Paul Litch on this matter.

Did you ever stop to think who might actually be pressing these books? Doug isn't pressing them himself.

 

I know there is a lot of insinuation that this happened inhouse at CGC but I just can't believe it. If it's true, all integrity has been lost.

 

Mass destruction of nice, often pedigree books. Technical grade increase and a visual grade decrease. It's obvious that it's happening and if this can be tied to CGC 'inhouse' pressing I'd lose my faith in them. That this is happening and that CGC seems to be looking the other way is alarming.

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Bookery

Bookery

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Some really wildly unscientific assumptions are being made here, and yet after a few pages they are already being bandied about as fact.

 

I have no idea what is causing these changes. But there are some theories that are more logical than others.

 

Perhaps Joey can tell us, but I have trouble imagining a situation in which the cover shrinks from side-to-side but not top-to-bottom. And if it did shrink in such an odd manner, it would cause the image to skew... Thor would be getting taller and skinnier. I also can't imagine a wet/heat process that would shrink the cover and not cause other problems such as discoloration. And if a cover could shrink by being humidified and heated to what is it... 160, 180 degrees... than thousands of comics being shipped through Florida on their way to CGC in hot humid UPS vans would be shrinking every month.

 

The cover doesn't seem trimmed to me... the tiny tiny chips are visible in both scans, as is a very tiny tear in the upper right edge. Even a trim of a mm or 2 would have removed these.

 

Again... I don't know... but I'm not convinced that pressing is the problem here. Everyone here is convinced that (a) pressing is the culprit and (b) CGC continues to upgrade for bad pressing even after promising not to.

 

Perhaps neither of these is true. There is a possibility that the CGC graders were accurate, and that no pressing was involved, or had any visible negative effects. I hesitate to say what might (I repeat might) be possibly happening,,, but if you think about the evidence before you, there is a conclusion that can be made that doesn't involve anything nefarious from anyone, yet might make many very uncomfortable nonetheless.

 

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joeypost

joeypost

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Rarely do I see a cover shrink. While I have not measured a cover to see if it shrinks, my guess would be that the pressing caused the interior pages to flatten and extend past the cover ever so slightly.

 

A true test would be to get a profile shot of the pages on the outside edge of the book and see if they have the traditional "V" shape to them.

 

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trmoore54

trmoore54

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Posted
I've recently looked over hundreds of my SA comics. I only found one example that had the right edge fanning in anything close to this severity. This does not happen this often from natural conditions. Assuming these books were submitted in bulk to CGC, why didn't the graders notice this condition and downgrade for it. Instead, it looks like most got bumped up. What the heck is going on, this is mass destruction of nice books. It would be nice to hear from Paul Litch on this matter.

 

I just looked at all my books knowing I have very few books with exposed RH pages...of approximately 200 books I can count the number that have exposed pages on two hands. And NOT ONE book has exposed pages visible from top to bottom...more commonly exposed at top right approx. 1/16" and tapering down to not exposed.

 

There is just WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY too many of these not to arrive at the conclusion that there has been massive manipulation with the same technique and same dubious result...booo! :boo:

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