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What makes a great Super-Team?

Started by blowout,

31 posts in this topic

blowout

blowout

Posted
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There are good Super-Teams and bad ones in comics. But what makes one team great and another a lamer?

 

The simple answer would be to say that with the best/most powerful heroes makes the best team, but this is not always the case.

For example, what made the New X-Men so much more successful than the original team?

 

I consider there be several factors that make a team great and here they are. I am sure some of you will disagree and have more to add. That is the point of this post to set up a dialogue and find out what makes the greatest super-teams work. grin.gif

 

Ingredients for a great Super-Team (in no particular order).

 

1. Good Mix Of Super Powers (Strength, Flying, Force Blasts etc)

2. Good Mix Of Personalities (Male, Female, Forceful, Timid etc)

3. Strong/ Charismatic Leader (Eg Captain America/Avengers)

4. Team Conflict/Rivalry (Eg Cyclops/Wolverine)

5. Good Rogues Gallery (Hero is only as good as his enemy)

6. Evolution Of Team/Roster As Times Change

 

 

 

 

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joe_collector

joe_collector

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>>For example, what made the New X-Men so much more successful than the original team?

 

Colossus.

 

Every super team needs a tough guy, and it's especially satisfying to have the big boys brawl it out. Makes for great cover copy as well, and the below one states the case quite clearly (finally an X-Man who can go toe-to-toe with Juggernaut).

 

97792366288.102.gif

 

Just by re-reading the early X-Men issues (especially against Juggy) I feel that if a Colossus-like character in there from the start, the series would never have been cancelled.

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ubiquiti

ubiquiti

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strong guys are a key..

Avengers always had one:She-Hulk, Hercules, Namor, Thor(multi-talnted strong-guy), Wonder Man, etc.

 

I like to break it down to four(maybe 5) different heroes/villains:(substitute gal for guy if you are so inclined)

Smart Guy/Leader type(Prof X, Mr. Fantastic, Captain America)

Strong Guy(Thing, Colossus, Hercules, Sasquatch)

Flying Guy(Iron Man, Storm, Human Torch, Quasar, Northstar)

Hot chick(Storm, Rogue, Scarlet Witch, She-Hulk had a kicking body)

Rebel Guy(Human Torch, Starfox, Wolverine, Gambit, Wonder-Man)

 

and maybe even super agile guy(Nightcrawler, Beast, Black Panther, Puck)

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joe_collector

joe_collector

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>>strong guys are a key.. Avengers always had one

 

Every group had one, except for X-Men.

 

I always thought that was a strange call from Stan the Man, since he's always writing about how popular the Big Guy Bouts were and how he tried to get them into most team books from time to time.

 

The classic Hulk vs. Thing battles are the most obvious, but Thor, Hercules, Surfer etc. would also tag-team up on each other. And he leaves the X-Men with a bunch of panty-waists? Doesn't make sense.

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The_Man_Of_Steel

The_Man_Of_Steel

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Good points Blowout, and if I may, I would like to add...

 

7. They should look "cool", in more technical terms, visually appealing character design.

 

Imagine Wolverine without the claws, cigars, and overall scruffy appearance. What would Wolverine be without those elements?

 

8. Interesting stories - Even the coolest looking characters are a bore without interesting stories, so the writer of a book can make or break a team.

 

Imagine the Uncanny X-Men run without the John Byrne/Cris Claremont run. Could the series have been as successful under a different creative team?

 

9. Different strengths and weaknesses - It's cool to watch a team work together as a team, using their strengths to help overcome their teamates weaknesses (both physical and psychological).

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blowout

blowout

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Yep, the creative team is definately crucial. The Claremont/Cockrum/Byrne teams sure worked for the X-Men. I also think the original team suffered as a book because Lee/Kirby didn't stay on it for long.

 

Interesting to hear the comments about the strong guy. I think Joe may be on to something with the Colossus theory for the X-Men. I always thought that Wolverine was the clincher for the new X-Men team's success but Colossus has always been a very under-rated character.

Some of the greatest moments in Super-Team books have indeed come from the strong guys slugging it out. Certainly gives more dramatic scope for the artists than say a battle between telepaths.

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joe_collector

joe_collector

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>>Some of the greatest moments in Super-Team books have indeed come from the strong guys slugging it out. Certainly gives more dramatic scope for the artists than say a battle between telepaths.

 

A great example is the classic X-Men 137. I know it's the Death of Phoenix issue, but the sequence I remember most is where Colossus dukes it out with Gladiator; which to my mind was the turning point/seal the deal point where the X-Men lost. Even Xavier kind of loses it after we see Gladiator dragging Pete out of the rubble.

 

Without a strong guy, those kinds of super-bouts just aren't possible and you're down to not including heavy-weight villains or falling back on the old "Xavier psionic attack" crutch for dealing with them.

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blowout

blowout

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In reference to the strong guy battles.

Not sure if it was because of CGI limitations (probably) but I would have liked to have seen the upcoming Hulk movie include a kick-[!@#%^&^] strong super-villain for ol green skin to duke it out with.

 

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MuadDib

MuadDib

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I haven't heard much about the hulk movie...who is the bad guy? General Ross? They should have created the U-Foes to fight the hulk! Remember them? The FF imitators! Now they were a cool super-villian team! X-Ray, Vapor, Ironclad, Vector You gotta love it!!!

grin.gifgrin.gifgrin.gif

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MuadDib

MuadDib

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What was that Avengers issue that featured the Puma chasing some native American kid who could opoen portals into other dimensions? I remember the U-Foes stepped out and fought not only the Hulk but also the Avengers, with Cap A & Gilgamesh! what was that issue? That issue had a kick [!@#%^&^] story with some great heavy hitting super duper strong guy bouts! sob sob frown.gifmemories...

 

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JLA_ALL_THE_WAY

JLA_ALL_THE_WAY

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Yesss, these villains were great!

 

I especially enjoyed their "ironic destinies" after battling the Hulk (I believe around # 340?) with the 'Collective' at the Portal Crossroads- thanx to Dr. Strange.

 

Vector in a world where he must deflect flying debris constantly.

Vapor in a world with no atmosphere.

Ironclad enters a world of quicksand.

X-ray in a world of beasts that literally FEED on his power!

 

As for the movie, conventional wisdom tells me that the first movie will concentrate on origin and personal conflict; the second will give us a more specific physically imposing Nemesis (Rhino? Juggernaut? Thing? Thor?) with lots more action.

 

Past successful examples of this:

Superman I & II

Star Trek I & II

Aliens I & II

 

Rick

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COI

COI

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Very cool. That was the era that 80's books peaked, shortly before the infamous early 90's [!@#%^&^] that almost sunk the hobby. Great stuff, and cheap too.

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