Is Spider-Gwen #1 a sign of the bubble reaching its peak?

[mysterio]

I've been simply amazed, and a bit terrified, at the amounts and volume of money pouring into the multitude of S-G #1 variants this past week or so. I'm of the opinion that this can't end well. In honor of Friday I thought it would be interesting to move some of that discussion out of "heating up" over to here. Discuss. Feel free to try to convince me that this time is different, we are not in another 90s style bubble, that variants aren't just a reincarnation of foil/hologram covers that are actually better for the publishers because we buy more of them, and that S-G is the next Batman and EOSV #2 will send my kids to college in a few years.

[Vikingreed]

Love me some bubble threads!

 

 

 

My girl is here to stay!

[mysterio]

Love me some bubble threads!

 

 

Me too. I may end up with -5 points, but thought this thread title might get some other viewpoints posted that wouldn't venture into the pumping threads about S-G.

[IntoAnother]

I'm going to side with it is not a sign of a bubble popping. I've discussed this with several individuals and many of the conversations come back to the enormous amount of people who are buying/collecting due to a growing population and the access of so many sites such as ebay to sell comics rather than having shelves full in a shop. These were not my points but they made sense to me. I'm sure many people were taking advantage of sites yet I'd guess no where near the amount of people who purchase comics off ebay today.

Also comic book related movies and shows is on the rise and does not appear to be slowing down. Further exposing the masses to a spin of the great books we enjoy and leading many into comics for the first time. Rather than a comic leading one to be interested in a movie or show.

[mysterio]

I'm going to side with it is not a sign of a bubble popping. I've discussed this with several individuals and many of the conversations come back to the enormous amount of people who are buying/collecting due to a growing population and the access of so many sites such as ebay to sell comics rather than having shelves full in a shop.

 

The bubble clearly isn't popping yet, otherwise we wouldn't have this feeding frenzy going on with S-G and, to a lesser extent, Star Wars #1 (as evidenced by the Hot Topic episode last week, where it became clear that people only wanted to pay $100 for the book as long as other people were willing to pay $100+ for it). But this tulipmania frenzy for each new multivariant #1 is not sustainable, and SW and S-G seem (to me) to be examples of a trend towards extreme numbers of variants as a blatant cash-in by Marvel and by those fortunate early purchasers on the secondary market.

 

It would be silly to think that lots of people purchasing these variants aren't doing so to flip. They may be collectors, but not to this extent. Buying multiples to get rich "someday" was what drove the 90s bubble too. The music has to stop eventually.

[the authority]

I might normally think a book with this kind of build up was doomed to fall but for one thing. Every single Spider-Gwen #1 cover looks unbelievably great. I don't know whether or not they will tell a great story with the character but I would bet on it being a winner with great appeal. Regardless, this costume is the best design I've seen for a female character ever. It isn't an accident that those covers are fantastic imo.

[paul747]

I think It is a speculator Bubble for sure. People who are buying the books and churning the cash dont even know the characters ! The pure amount of solicited Marvel and DC variants is insane ! Look at next months solicitation for both Marvel and DC , Reboots, convergence, secret wars, crossovers, Lego, monster, cook, 1:25, 1:100, 25 new DC titles, young ,3D ect... and each one has so many incentive variants it will make your head spin. at some point retailers are going to get stuck with a ton of product that does not sell. Maybe not 1993 because I dont see the cases and cases of over printed horrible books being purchased. On the other hand for a retailer to stay in the game, and competitive, they have to over- order a ton of books to stay current. 9 out of ten of these variants drop in price with-in months of their initial release.

 

With the constant reboots people loose their attachment to the runs. A lot of frustration especially if you are a completest. If your a reader you could care less about the variants but the crossovers and needing to buy 20 titles to get one story will make you mad ! As a collector where is the future value on 400,000 bloated print runs and vol 3,4,5 ect.. its a total greedy cash grab market just like the 90's

Buying a variant for $500-1000 seems crazy ! Marvel and DC direct market variants are in place to make you order more books.The only variants that make sense are the shop variants

 

 

 

Image is putting out great stuff VOL 1-- long runs , great art and stories , not tons of variants. I like the new valiant stuff as a reader but all of the order incentive variants for each issue suck !

 

Why cant they just STOP with all of the variants To increase print runs and cash The constant reboots take away from collect-ability, I mean how many DD #1's do we have to buy ! give us new story's on long standing runs? Maybe they dont need 60 titles how about like 30 .

 

Its a KEY , HOT BOOK, Flippers market Period ! and that's who is buying ! sounds very familiar.

Many regular fans have thrown in the towel on marvel and wait for trades or books that tell the entire story. Just my opinion !

 

I know its all about the mighty $$$$

[mysterio]

I might normally think a book with this kind of build up was doomed to fall but for one thing. Every single Spider-Gwen #1 cover looks unbelievably great. I don't know whether or not they will tell a great story with the character but I would bet on it being a winner with great appeal. Regardless, this costume is the best design I've seen for a female character ever. It isn't an accident that those covers are fantastic imo.

 

I hope the character and story develop, I really do. I finally got around to reading EOSV #2 (in the 4th print) a couple of days ago, and it wasn't bad. There is potential there if they develop it. They've called in some talent to do the umpteen covers, to be sure, but they're all window dressing. If folks don't see the money rolling in copies are going to get dumped.

[Revol]

I don't know if it's a bubble, as I think Spider-Gwen specifically will be a strong book for the foreseeable future. But I'm not buying any of the variants purely because paying 30-40 dollars for a comic book that everyone else is paying the same amount for seems like a waste of time and money to me. And 100 dollars for an Adam Hughes cover? I'd rather buy the regular cover and spend a 100 dollars on a signed Hughes print instead.

[mysterio]

I don't know if it's a bubble, as I think Spider-Gwen specifically will be a strong book for the foreseeable future. But I'm not buying any of the variants purely because paying 30-40 dollars for a comic book that everyone else is paying the same amount for seems like a waste of time and money to me. And 100 dollars for an Adam Hughes cover? I'd rather buy the regular cover and spend a 100 dollars on a signed Hughes print instead.

 

What happens when the rest of the market has this exceedingly rational epiphany?

[Brock]

I might differentiate between a general bubble and a Spider-Gwen bubble...

 

I think the overall market is OK, but SG is looking pretty frothy. I collect Adam Hughes covers, and I haven't bought the SG ones, because I believe prices will be very low in about 8-12 months time.

 

IMHO, there is no rationale for the heat around SG, beyond unfounded speculation that this will be one of the greatest Marvel titles ever.

 

In looking back, Spider-Woman, Spider-Girl and other female Spider-Man homages have never been able to sustain a viable readership over the long term. While female-centred comics are becoming more popular overall, Marvel is diluting its own market by launching Spider-Woman, Silk and Spider-Gwen in rapid succession. I will be surprised if any last beyond 15 issues.

 

If I'm wrong (it's been known to happen, though apparently the rules say I'm not supposed to admit that on the Internet), then EOSV 2 will be the book to have, rather than SG 1.

 

[Rhymenoceros]

We are still nowhere near the print runs of the 90s on the majority of books, though it does seem to be creeping that direction. In '93, not as many individuals were buying dozens of copies like they are now. There have always been those who speculate, but it's so much easier for your average Joe to do today with online stores, eBay,forums etc. I don't think most retailers across the country would say they have it easier due to these options - it creates more competition for brick and motor shops that have been around for decades. I know the shop owners around here are not "rich" by your average person's standards.

 

Marvel has done a great job of taking our money in the past year. Secondary markets are easier to sell on than 20 years ago. I think this bubble has a lot of room to grow.

[paul747]

Who won in the ninety's?

 

 

People who bought silver age books ! Won in a big way !

Spider-Gwen is great , So is silk and Kamala

BUY AMAZING SPIDER-MAN #31 WITH YOUR HOT TOPIC VARIANT MONEY !

 

Might need some cash on the sidelines cause there is a silver bubble as well !

[THB]

Spider-Gwen should pop. Whos actually going to buy issues 2 - up?

[IntoAnother]

Does anyone feel that the potential bubble would be much less likely if the number of variants was greatly reduced? I understand money is to be made and if I had a shop I'd be pretty stoked to have my own shop variant for a book like Star Wars but is it leading to disaster?

 

Not that it's reality but if a limit of variants was placed on books do you feel it would be a good thing? Say 100k print run earns x # of variants if creators wanted them, and so on down to one variant for smaller runs.

 

 

For SG, I ordered the Phantom. The price was right and the homage is killer. I don't think SG is a sign IMO. I think she is an all around hit and don't see it as a flipper manufactured one.

 

Guess just the number of variants worries me.

[Jaydogrules]

Mysterio, your points are well taken. Between this and the Star Wars 1 (particularly that Hot Topic variant debacle), I fear the answer may sadly be "yes".

 

-J.

 

 

[mysterio]

Does anyone feel that the potential bubble would be much less likely if the number of variants was greatly reduced? I understand money is to be made and if I had a shop I'd be pretty stoked to have my own shop variant for a book like Star Wars but is it leading to disaster?

 

Not that it's reality but if a limit of variants was placed on books do you feel it would be a good thing? Say 100k print run earns x # of variants if creators wanted them, and so on down to one variant for smaller runs.

 

 

For SG, I ordered the Phantom. The price was right and the homage is killer. I don't think SG is a sign IMO. I think she is an all around hit and don't see it as a flipper manufactured one.

 

Guess just the number of variants worries me.

 

I guess for me the number of variants is definitely a symptom of this larger problem of over-hype. You used to know which edition of a book would get hot, because there were only 1-2 made. Now with like 15 variants of a cover, or more, how many of those will reach a sustainable resale value while the others plummet because nobody wants the "loser" variants that aren't worth anything? That adds to the crapshoot that is the current market.

 

Publishers stand to make more money by making more variants, as long as people are buying them, so there is no hope of them self-policing on this one. They make money on the primary market, not the secondary one.

[vaillant]

And aside from cover "variants", what a "silly" idea is to have (an hypothetic) Gwen Stacy as Spider-Woman?

 

All is a big, giant "What if" now – because they don’t know better? I really find it pretty much absurd…

[the authority]

The Spider-Gwen #1 Phantom is going to be the hot variant. I bought 3 of the color copies myself and I don't buy much Marvel stuff anymore. As for Star Wars, I would suggest the action figure covers.

[the authority]

And aside from cover "variants", what a "silly" idea is to have (an hypothetic) Gwen Stacy as Spider-Woman?

 

All is a big, giant "What if" now – because they don’t know better? I really find it pretty much absurd…

 

Haha ! What about The Walking Dead featuring Archie. Times are changing and although I like traditional stuff, Marvel absolutely doesn't imo. I think Spider-Gwen changing to a hero is a lot better than most of the alterations to characters in the last 10 or so years.