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Is Gerber's SI still, or was it ever, valid?

Started by fifties,

27 posts in this topic

fifties

fifties

Posted
Posted

In Gerbers Photo Journal of comics, his Scarcity Index (SI) of copies still in existence surmised;

 

number 6 = 50-200 copies.

 

number 7 = 21-50 copies.

 

He assigned a 7 to Action Comics #1, and a 6 to Detective Comics #27.

 

Valid?

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Tri-Color Brian

Tri-Color Brian

Posted
Posted

Probably not for those two...and may not be valid for most of the 5, 6, and 7 titles. A lot of comics have surfaced since Gerber wrote the photojournals, but you can get a rough feel for how close he was when you start trying to find some of those 5s, 6s, and 7s...the lesser collected titles are easier to find, the popular ones are really tough unless you get lucky or know someone. Collectors tend to hang on to the good covers or artist issues, and just like with Action 1 (which may have 250-300 copies existing), they don't surface quickly. So, I think as a "guide" the SI numbers are helpful, but we will probably never know if they were really accurate or not. Just my 2c .

 

And while I'm on this subject I would just like to say that I would have many fewer comics today if I had never bought or looked thru the photojournals. Those two books did me in... lol I wonder if Ernie had any idea how his books would drastically change the way collectors searched for and bought comics? It was a genius project that probably didn't make him much money, but it made him a legend.

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OtherEric

OtherEric

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I would say about 90% of the time the SI gives you a valid idea of the relative scarcity of a book, compared to the scarcity index of other books. I don't think that SI= x copies is particularly accurate; but most (not all) of the time a 8 will be harder to find than a 7, a 7 harder than a 6, and so on.

 

 

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Sqeggs

Sqeggs

Posted
Posted
In Gerbers Photo Journal of comics, his Scarcity Index (SI) of copies still in existence surmised;

 

number 6 = 50-200 copies.

 

number 7 = 21-50 copies.

 

He assigned a 7 to Action Comics #1, and a 6 to Detective Comics #27.

 

Valid?

 

Michelle Nolan had a series of articles looking book-by-book at their accuracy starting (I think) with the 7s. Conclusion was that he was off on some but still fairly accurate. Interesting reading.

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Sqeggs

Sqeggs

Posted
Posted
Probably not for those two...and may not be valid for most of the 5, 6, and 7 titles. A lot of comics have surfaced since Gerber wrote the photojournals, but you can get a rough feel for how close he was when you start trying to find some of those 5s, 6s, and 7s...the lesser collected titles are easier to find, the popular ones are really tough unless you get lucky or know someone. Collectors tend to hang on to the good covers or artist issues, and just like with Action 1 (which may have 250-300 copies existing), they don't surface quickly. So, I think as a "guide" the SI numbers are helpful, but we will probably never know if they were really accurate or not. Just my 2c .

 

And while I'm on this subject I would just like to say that I would have many fewer comics today if I had never bought or looked thru the photojournals. Those two books did me in... lol I wonder if Ernie had any idea how his books would drastically change the way collectors searched for and bought comics? It was a genius project that probably didn't make him much money, but it made him a legend.

 

If someone were to write a history of fandom, publication of those books would be one of the key events, I think.

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comicjack

comicjack

Posted
Posted
I would say about 90% of the time the SI gives you a valid idea of the relative scarcity of a book, compared to the scarcity index of other books. I don't think that SI= x copies is particularly accurate; but most (not all) of the time a 8 will be harder to find than a 7, a 7 harder than a 6, and so on.

 

 

 

I would say thats about right,once had a talk about this subject with him.He did enough auctions and had many connections to give a fair view of the whole market.In general he did have a pretty good handle on the comic world.My 2 cents!

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jimjum12

jimjum12

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Posted
I also wonder why the Gerber photo record is missing many books that i can't imagine were that difficult to find for example Web of Mystery.

 

Ernie ran out of time, space, and money. The guy literally put 110% into that project.... at least. GOD BLESS.....

 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus) (thumbs u

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rjpb

rjpb

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I also wonder why the Gerber photo record is missing many books that i can't imagine were that difficult to find for example Web of Mystery.

 

The Gerbers are an amazing endeavor, but there are quite a bit of missing later pre-code issues of a number of genres. I think this is a reflection of the highly superhero centric nature of collecting in the 80s. At the time the Gerbers were published, you could still pick up most of the now classic pre-code horror covers amazingly cheap.

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fifties

fifties

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  • Author
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And while I'm on this subject I would just like to say that I would have many fewer comics today if I had never bought or looked thru the photojournals. Those two books did me in... lol I wonder if Ernie had any idea how his books would drastically change the way collectors searched for and bought comics?

That's a very lucid point; his books gave a revelation of what was out there that I'm sure many or most collectors were unaware of, and had to have given impetus to acquiring them, perhaps inducing more, "out of the woodwork".

 

Another thing to consider is that he published the tomes in 1990, well before the internet and eBay got going, and I would have to believe a somewhat different market than what transpired afterward.

 

I take it then that the consensus would be, accurate on some, but not on other titles? And it was a massive undertaking.

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Tri-Color Brian

Tri-Color Brian

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Can you imagine the average collector tyring to do that project today? We have more images available (just look at Mycomicshop.com sometime), but how many have the dealer experience to know which books are scarce, rare, or just impossible to find? Not many...so I excuse Ernie for any blunders he made.

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jerome34

jerome34

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I would think that about 90% of his SI values are accurate with 5% being higher

than his values and 5% being lower. Which books are off is a never ending

question. When books are off, I think his error is just + or - one. I have not

seen any that were way off. A warehouse find could make such a difference.

 

On the other hand, his "existing counts" are way low thanks, primarily, to the

internet, big auction houses, and dealers with huge database. A simple

revision of the counts would be to multiply each of them by 3.

 

While Gerber got many of his images from private collectors and used the lists

of what they had and what they did not have, I think he undervalued the

importance of "items locked up in private collections." Thus there are a lot of

people saying "This 8 should be a 7" based in part on items coming to market

from older collections that he did not see. Rather than doing any wholesale

lowering of SI values, it would be more reasonable to increase the "existing

counts" for each SI value

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BOOT

BOOT

Posted
Posted
I would think that about 90% of his SI values are accurate with 5% being higher

than his values and 5% being lower. Which books are off is a never ending

question. When books are off, I think his error is just + or - one. I have not

seen any that were way off.

Highly concur with this. Gerber's data can be way useful.

 

Another place for up to date info is right here on these boards. Here are some fun threads with some great discussion:

 

To Be A Gerber "9" Or Not To Be, That Is The Question!

Gerber No-Shows: Post yours here!

The Illusive Gerber "10"s

Overstreet's phantom issues...

Where can I get the stickers made to go in Gerber?

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