Moldoff's Tragic Career as a Pre-Code Horror Artist?

[markseifert]

 

That's contrary to what Gaines believed and told Kefauver and his colleagues in 1954.

 

True, but I think you can just put that down to hyperbole. He was being pointedly defiant throughout his testimony. Kind of a "yeah, I did that. I'm that guy. So what?" kind of thing.

 

He'd obviously decided he was going to stand in the middle of the ring and not duck or backpedal.

[EC ed]

Yellowjacket #7 from 1946 featured "Tales of Terror" complete with host the "Ancient Witch"... (scans courtesy of Digital Comic Museum)

 

And this, from Hit Comics #1 in 1940 (scans courtesy of comicbookplus) (this is just the 1st and last pages of the story)...she's called the "Ancient Witch" on the first page, and the "Old Witch" on the last page:

 

[rjpb]

I like seeing those old horror stories that pre-date the "horror comic". They nicely illustrate the origins of the genre in comic books. The idea of an old witch host goes back to the popular radio series Witch's Tales which began in 1931, hosted by "Old Nancy, the Witch of Salem". The morbid puns and jokes that the EC hosts are known for find their counterpart in the those of the host "Raymond" on The Inner Sanctum Mysteries radio show which started in the early 40s.

 

As with pretty much everything else in comic books, existing popular culture was a huge influence on the genre. Even the most original concept, the superhero, has it's roots in The Phantom comic strip, pulp heroes of the 1930s, masked men from the movies and radio, as well as the fantastical possibilities explored in sci-fi pulps.

[adamstrange]

Siegal and Shuster created horror stories in either 1935 or 1936 so even from the earliest days of original comic stories, horror was a part.

[fifties]

I read somewhere that Gaines and Feldstein got the idea for initially including horror stories in their other genre books from a popular radio program at the time, called, "The Witches Tale".

[markseifert]

I read somewhere that Gaines and Feldstein got the idea for initially including horror stories in their other genre books from a popular radio program at the time, called, "The Witches Tale".

 

Very interesting. Looks like that might be the first radio horror host...?

 

 

[bronze johnny]

I don't think the idea of starting a horror comic is so strikingly original that it would never have otherwise been thought of. There were at least horror elements in comics from the very early days. Look at Cap 17.

 

With practically every other genre being tried, it's hard to believe horror comics wouldn't have had their run even if Moldoff hadn't made the suggestion to Gaines.

 

Comics were borrowing cover imagery from the "horror" pulps from 1939 on, and while pulps themselves were dying out by the late 40s, the genres they spawned were obviously an influence on the ideas for broadening appeal of comic books as the ear of superhero dominance seemed to wind down. Horror had also been a staple in the stories as well. As you say, it would be hard to believe horror comics wouldn't have existed one way or another.

I agree. Things were trending towards a blossoming of the horror genre, with or without any particular individual. In his essay on Shakespeare, Emerson wrote that a great man "finds himself in the river of the thoughts and events, forced onward by the ideas and necessities of his contemporaries. He stands where all the eyes of men look one way, and their hands all point in the direction in which he should go."

 

That's contrary to what Gaines believed and told Kefauver and his colleagues in 1954.

Interesting. Do you have the quote? I'd be curious to know what Gaines had to say.

 

It's in the testimony but Mark points out that Gaines probably didn't mean it that way.

[bronze johnny]

As you say, it would be hard to believe horror comics wouldn't have existed one way or another.

 

Plus, what's the timeline of this supposed to be...?

 

I'm sure I'm missing stuff, but you've got:

 

Fall 1948 -- Adventures into the Unknown

Fall 1948 -- Moon Girl #5 -- horror by Moldoff and Johnny Craig. So presumably the pitch to Fawcett and then EC came around this time. Unless there's a book I'm not thinking of.

 

May 1949 -- Amazing Mysteries #32 (Atlas)

Aug 1949 -- Marvel Tales #93

 

Dec 1949 -- Suspense #1 (Atlas)

Dec 1949 -- Crime Patrol #15 -- Feldstein horror, Crypt-Keeper.

Dec 1949 -- War Against Crime #10 -- Horror

 

This Magazine is Haunted #1 -- Oct 1951 -- Fawcett Moldoff horror

 

****

 

So, Moldoff's statement seems to be that he pitched to Fawcett, they passed, he pitched to EC, had a deal in place, which Bill Gaines reneged on when the time came.

 

Could be, but you have to wonder why he went to Fawcett first -- he was getting regular work from EC up to that point and not that much from Fawcett, which obviously had a squeaky-clean rep anyway. So, that's odd.

 

Still could be, but there was certainly a fair bit of horror out by the time EC got into it on an ongoing basis.

 

 

Moldoff went to Fawcett first because he trusted Lieberson more than Gaines. It appears as if Moldoff was taking a chance on increasing his status in the industry.

[Cat-Man_America]

As you say, it would be hard to believe horror comics wouldn't have existed one way or another.

 

Plus, what's the timeline of this supposed to be...?

 

I'm sure I'm missing stuff, but you've got:

 

Fall 1948 -- Adventures into the Unknown

Fall 1948 -- Moon Girl #5 -- horror by Moldoff and Johnny Craig. So presumably the pitch to Fawcett and then EC came around this time. Unless there's a book I'm not thinking of.

 

May 1949 -- Amazing Mysteries #32 (Atlas)

Aug 1949 -- Marvel Tales #93

 

Dec 1949 -- Suspense #1 (Atlas)

Dec 1949 -- Crime Patrol #15 -- Feldstein horror, Crypt-Keeper.

Dec 1949 -- War Against Crime #10 -- Horror

 

This Magazine is Haunted #1 -- Oct 1951 -- Fawcett Moldoff horror

 

****

 

So, Moldoff's statement seems to be that he pitched to Fawcett, they passed, he pitched to EC, had a deal in place, which Bill Gaines reneged on when the time came.

 

Could be, but you have to wonder why he went to Fawcett first -- he was getting regular work from EC up to that point and not that much from Fawcett, which obviously had a squeaky-clean rep anyway. So, that's odd.

 

Still could be, but there was certainly a fair bit of horror out by the time EC got into it on an ongoing basis.

 

 

Moldoff went to Fawcett first because he trusted Lieberson more than Gaines. It appears as if Moldoff was taking a chance on increasing his status in the industry.

 

 

As far as comics devoted to the horror genre, Eerie was published over a year earlier than Adventures Into The Unknown (Fall 1947)...

 

 

Sheldon Moldoff obviously had a great idea for a title, but the inspiration wasn't especially groundbreaking. Also, his vision of a horror themed comic didn't wasn't a good fit with the Gaines/Feldstein New Trend concept. His idea and the package of art provided was probably one of many floated to the young publisher while he was trying to get his footing in his late father's business.

 

It seems obvious from the interview that Bill Gaines outsmarted Shelly, not that Moldoff wasn't clever in trying to take advantage of the novice publisher by leveraging his artistic skill and ambition into a financially lucrative business arrangement. Even though (to my way of thinking) Shelly clearly didn't create the genre, he did bring a finished product to the publisher providing a head-start on a major trend.

 

Looking at the end result logically, it appears that Gaines was a little sharper than Moldoff gave him credit. Shelly's business sense clearly didn't extend to hard-nosed legal maneuvering. It wouldn't be the first time that an ambitious comic creator was outsmarted by a publisher and his lawyer. Just look to Martin Goodman's partnership deal with Joe Simon & Jack Kirby on Captain America and where that ended up. Bottom line: Old school practices (promises & hand-shake) are always trumped by a good lawyer.

 

Also, in the long-run it would appear that Bill Gaines made the right business moves in maintaining his creative control and stylized streamlining of the New Trend line. He ended up publishing the best horror, the best sci-fi, the best war/adventure and Crime/Shock titles of the era, hiring many of the best artists, and paying the highest per page rates. My

 

 

[Weird Paper]

I think this thread has the kind of content and expertise that defines what a message board should actually be about. Thank you.

[bronze johnny]

As you say, it would be hard to believe horror comics wouldn't have existed one way or another.

 

Plus, what's the timeline of this supposed to be...?

 

I'm sure I'm missing stuff, but you've got:

 

Fall 1948 -- Adventures into the Unknown

Fall 1948 -- Moon Girl #5 -- horror by Moldoff and Johnny Craig. So presumably the pitch to Fawcett and then EC came around this time. Unless there's a book I'm not thinking of.

 

May 1949 -- Amazing Mysteries #32 (Atlas)

Aug 1949 -- Marvel Tales #93

 

Dec 1949 -- Suspense #1 (Atlas)

Dec 1949 -- Crime Patrol #15 -- Feldstein horror, Crypt-Keeper.

Dec 1949 -- War Against Crime #10 -- Horror

 

This Magazine is Haunted #1 -- Oct 1951 -- Fawcett Moldoff horror

 

****

 

So, Moldoff's statement seems to be that he pitched to Fawcett, they passed, he pitched to EC, had a deal in place, which Bill Gaines reneged on when the time came.

 

Could be, but you have to wonder why he went to Fawcett first -- he was getting regular work from EC up to that point and not that much from Fawcett, which obviously had a squeaky-clean rep anyway. So, that's odd.

 

Still could be, but there was certainly a fair bit of horror out by the time EC got into it on an ongoing basis.

 

 

Moldoff went to Fawcett first because he trusted Lieberson more than Gaines. It appears as if Moldoff was taking a chance on increasing his status in the industry.

 

 

As far as comics devoted to the horror genre, Eerie was published over a year earlier than Adventures Into The Unknown (Fall 1947)...

 

 

Sheldon Moldoff obviously had a great idea for a title, but the inspiration wasn't especially groundbreaking. Also, his vision of a horror themed comic didn't wasn't a good fit with the Gaines/Feldstein New Trend concept. His idea and the package of art provided was probably one of many floated to the young publisher while he was trying to get his footing in his late father's business.

 

It seems obvious from the interview that Bill Gaines outsmarted Shelly, not that Moldoff wasn't clever in trying to take advantage of the novice publisher by leveraging his artistic skill and ambition into a financially lucrative business arrangement. Even though (to my way of thinking) Shelly clearly didn't create the genre, he did bring a finished product to the publisher providing a head-start on a major trend.

 

Looking at the end result logically, it appears that Gaines was a little sharper than Moldoff gave him credit. Shelly's business sense clearly didn't extend to hard-nosed legal maneuvering. It wouldn't be the first time that an ambitious comic creator was outsmarted by a publisher and his lawyer. Just look to Martin Goodman's partnership deal with Joe Simon & Jack Kirby on Captain America and where that ended up. Bottom line: Old school practices (promises & hand-shake) are always trumped by a good lawyer.

 

Also, in the long-run it would appear that Bill Gaines made the right business moves in maintaining his creative control and stylized streamlining of the New Trend line. He ended up publishing the best horror, the best sci-fi, the best war/adventure and Crime/Shock titles of the era, hiring many of the best artists, and paying the highest per page rates. My

 

 

Thanks for this excellent post! Curious to see if publishers were watching Adventures of the Unknown and if the sales were picking up for this first continuing horror series. Moldoff had to have known about the new ACG series- if only the question of Adventures into the Unknown had been raised during one of the Moldoff interviews. I'm not sure whether Moldoff was trying to take credit for creating the horror genre- he may have been looking for credit for having influenced Gaines into focusing on horror?

[BOOT]

Or was Moldoff's overall experiences as a precode horror artist tragic in the sense that he could have done more during this period?

Who needs that horror stuff? I think he reached his peak much later...

[Timely]

I bought a few Moldoff covers from him at Megacon a long time ago. I framed the pirate cover & put it in my son's room!