Which of these comics is the king of the Copper age?

[VintageComics]

In terms of the "market cap" for those three books, the "invisible hand" of the market currently says:

 

New Mutants #98 $2,629,800

Amazing Spider-man #300 $1,988,200

TMNT #1 $1,731,000

 

Reference: http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=8699927

 

"Voting with dollars"

 

Which is pretty much the order most dealers would put them in.

[Spyder!]

All else equal, TMNT #1 is by far the king of the Copper Age, and it really isn't even close at all.

 

Take all three books in the same grade, same PQ, and TMNT #1 will outsell the others in every single grade.

[paul747]

In terms of the "market cap" for those three books, the "invisible hand" of the market currently says:

 

New Mutants #98 $2,629,800

Amazing Spider-man #300 $1,988,200

TMNT #1 $1,731,000

 

Reference: http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=8699927

 

"Voting with dollars"

 

Which is pretty much the order most dealers would put them in.

I think the entire market cap thing is neat. But ... Tmnt #1 is uber rare compared to the other 2 books . It has a smaller cap for sure but greater individual value in every grade.

[1Cool]

Even though the GPA are almost equal I'd definitely trade a NM 98 CGC 9.8 for a BA 12 CGC 9.6 every time. I think BA 12 has way more upward room especially in the 9.6/9.8 range.

[joe_collector]

All else equal, TMNT #1 is by far the king of the Copper Age, and it really isn't even close at all.

 

Take all three books in the same grade, same PQ, and TMNT #1 will outsell the others in every single grade.

 

Sure, but that's based almost entirely on scarcity.

 

No way in heII you can compare straight-up, an indie book with a 3K print run against a mainstream comic with a 250-500K+ print run. It's just stupid.

 

Any mathematicians willing to run the number to normalize TMNT's low print run against other CA keys, and then see how the values look then?

[joe_collector]

In terms of the "market cap" for those three books, the "invisible hand" of the market currently says:

 

New Mutants #98 $2,629,800

Amazing Spider-man #300 $1,988,200

TMNT #1 $1,731,000

 

That's actually a very interesting way to look at it, as it helps compare books no matter the print run or scarcity, and basically assign the total a market has invested in it.

 

A rarer book will be more valuable, while a book with a higher print run will have lower prices, but still be comparable based on total capitalization.

[thecopperagekids]

Let it begin. No one knows where it will end, one month to decide and all will be revealed!

 

Those three books are arguably in contention for top copper age books but if a King of The Copper Age is to be crowned on this board..... I SAY THEE NAY!

 

I would say that myself, The Copper Age Kids, would fill the role of The King Of The Copper Age, in a suitably fitting fashion.

 

Let it be so boardies, declare myself as your liege and your master.

 

I will accordingly take my proper place, on my throne, as the reigning KING OF THE COPPER AGE.

 

 

***

Lame puns * aside, it is nigh impossible to assign anyone of those 3 books as the King of the copper age.They are all in high demand, but the TMNT 1 is the truly rare book, of the 3.

 

Inversely, there is more activity on NM 98 and ASM 300 (per total GPA sales) so if you are breaking it down by "best seller", then it'd be:

 

#1 NM 98

 

# 2 ASM 300

 

#3 TMNT 1

 

 

*Actually, this was a pretty awesome pun.Just sayin'

[kimik]

In terms of the "market cap" for those three books, the "invisible hand" of the market currently says:

 

New Mutants #98 $2,629,800

Amazing Spider-man #300 $1,988,200

TMNT #1 $1,731,000

 

That's actually a very interesting way to look at it, as it helps compare books no matter the print run or scarcity, and basically assign the total a market has invested in it.

 

A rarer book will be more valuable, while a book with a higher print run will have lower prices, but still be comparable based on total capitalization.

 

The only problem with the total capitalization approach is that it neglects the print runs. Based on that, with the black bagged Superman #75 selling for $20 for me at shows and using the low end print run of 2 million copies = $40 million total capitalization and arguably the king of the copper age.

 

If TMNT had the same print run as ASM #300 or NM #98 it would be much higher than those two.

[oakman29]

I don't even care. I have all three anyway.

[joe_collector]

In terms of the "market cap" for those three books, the "invisible hand" of the market currently says:

 

New Mutants #98 $2,629,800

Amazing Spider-man #300 $1,988,200

TMNT #1 $1,731,000

 

That's actually a very interesting way to look at it, as it helps compare books no matter the print run or scarcity, and basically assign the total a market has invested in it.

 

A rarer book will be more valuable, while a book with a higher print run will have lower prices, but still be comparable based on total capitalization.

 

The only problem with the total capitalization approach is that it neglects the print runs. Based on that, with the black bagged Superman #75 selling for $20 for me at shows and using the low end print run of 2 million copies = $40 million total capitalization and arguably the king of the copper age.

 

No, it actually does normalize the numbers, as it only takes into consideration the CGC copies, i.e investment-level books out in the wild.

 

TMNT #1 values are grossly inflated by the low 3K print run, while ASM 300 and NM 98 are grossly devalued due to the high print runs, but the CGC investment capitalization should normalize them for comparison, and it's actually the most valid method I've seen so far.

[joe_collector]

If TMNT had the same print run as ASM #300 or NM #98 it would be much higher than those two.

 

No, from those numbers, it's clear that if TMNT had the same ultra-high print runs as ASM 300 or NM 98, it would be worth less in the same CGC grade.

 

Could you even imagine if for some crazy reason, Marvel only printed 3,000 copies of ASM 300? I guarantee it would easily outpace the current values of TMNT 1.

[kimik]

If TMNT had the same print run as ASM #300 or NM #98 it would be much higher than those two.

 

No, from those numbers, it's clear that if TMNT had the same ultra-high print runs as ASM 300 or NM 98, it would be worth less in the same CGC grade.

 

Could you even imagine if for some crazy reason, Marvel only printed 3,000 copies of ASM 300? I guarantee it would easily outpace the current values of TMNT 1.

 

I am not so sure about that. TMNT #1 would still be a high value book due to the popularity of the franchise. While ASM 300 has the ASM fanbase to back it, Venom is popular but does not have the widespread appeal of TMNT. In addition there is a limit to how high a low print run Copper or Modern book can rise due to a lack of willing buyers at certain price points. How many people would drop $10K on a low print 80s book that has a higher chance of pulling back versus AF 15 or a nice copy of a bigger Marvel or DC key?

[kimik]

In terms of the "market cap" for those three books, the "invisible hand" of the market currently says:

 

New Mutants #98 $2,629,800

Amazing Spider-man #300 $1,988,200

TMNT #1 $1,731,000

 

That's actually a very interesting way to look at it, as it helps compare books no matter the print run or scarcity, and basically assign the total a market has invested in it.

 

A rarer book will be more valuable, while a book with a higher print run will have lower prices, but still be comparable based on total capitalization.

 

The only problem with the total capitalization approach is that it neglects the print runs. Based on that, with the black bagged Superman #75 selling for $20 for me at shows and using the low end print run of 2 million copies = $40 million total capitalization and arguably the king of the copper age.

 

No, it actually does normalize the numbers, as it only takes into consideration the CGC copies, i.e investment-level books out in the wild.

 

TMNT #1 values are grossly inflated by the low 3K print run, while ASM 300 and NM 98 are grossly devalued due to the high print runs, but the CGC investment capitalization should normalize them for comparison, and it's actually the most valid method I've seen so far.

 

Grossly devalued? ASM 300 and NM 98 should sell for way less based on how plentiful they are. I am happy the movie hype has had them both pop a bit over the past year since I own HG slabbed copies, but the prices seem significantly overvalued to me based on how many copies are out there.

 

[joe_collector]

[How many people would drop $10K on a low print 80s book that has a higher chance of pulling back versus AF 15 or a nice copy of a bigger Marvel or DC key?

 

Let';s do some math - how many ASM collectors are there in the world? And what would happen to the market if there were only *ever* 3K copies of a given newstand/direct issue?

 

Or do you seriously believe that if TMNT had a print run of 500K that it would be selling at $10K a copy? Or even what ASM 300 sells for now? I seriously doubt it.

[joe_collector]

Grossly devalued? ASM 300 and NM 98 should sell for way less based on how plentiful they are.

 

Exactly my point, so what do you think TMNT #1 would sell for in CGC high-grade if it had a similar 500K print run?

[thecopperagekids]

[How many people would drop $10K on a low print 80s book that has a higher chance of pulling back versus AF 15 or a nice copy of a bigger Marvel or DC key?

 

Let';s do some math - how many ASM collectors are there in the world? And what would happen to the market if there were only *ever* 3K copies of a given newstand/direct issue?

 

 

There are a veriatable eff ton of ASM collectors out there.

 

A prime example of that is the ASM 768 Venom MJ variant.

 

The print run is likely double 3K (if not triple) and the last sale of the book in CGC 9.8 was $3400, IIRC.The sale went through this board, it's not listed in GPA.This is a book that is not even a key book in the Spidey mythos, it is a novelty piece.

 

Using that model, TMNT # 1 in CGC 9.8 still has a good amount of room for growth and can be considered just as sound of an investment (if not even better) than plunking down $10K for a slabbed AF 15.

 

This is a glowing example of why/how the relatively scarcer Copper Age keys (in high grade) strongly hold their own and represent a very viable piece of the hobby/market.

 

 

 

 

 

[joe_collector]

Using that model, TMNT # 1 in CGC 9.8 still has a good amount of room for growth and can be considered just as sound of an investment (if not even better) than plunking down $10K for a slabbed AF 15.

 

If you view the future potential for TMNT properties as good, then this is correct, and is backed up by the capitalization data.

 

All other things being equal, the market does not value TMNT #1 as high as ASM 300 or NM 98. That could be an opportunity or just an admission that Marvel rules right now.

[oakman29]

768?

[joe_collector]

768?

 

[oakman29]

768?

 

 

678 not 768 Dyslexia anyone?