awakeintheashes Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 Whether Domino's first appearance was in NM # 98 is a whole other argument. The thing that makes no sense to me from any perspective is that CGC label # 11 as the first appearance of the "real" Domino when it's not the first appearance of any Domino. It looks like most, if not all, of the reference sites have listed #8 as her first appearance. For a while, some listed #8 while others listed #11 - some even broke it down by "first appearance in flashback" (#8) and "first appearance" (#11). I wouldn't be surprised if CGC begins to recognize #8 as her first appearance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeeksAreMyPeeps Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 It has to be New Mutants 98 because it is her first appearance. This is how they intended her to appear even if it is really not her inhabiting the body. While I agree with the conclusion that this is the key, you're torturing the term "appearance" as commonly accepted by comic collectors to make your case, so I disagree with your reasoning in this attempt. This is what people who argue for ads as first appearances are doing. This is similar to Avengers 83 and the Valkyrie. First time we ever see the character but it is really the Enchantress portraying her. Even so, most everyone goes with Avengers 83 being the first appearance because that is where the physical form of the character appears first. Much better. We're introduced to the concept of the character in a storytelling setting and given a visual of the character (the latter being an important companion to the former, otherwise the mention of a character we haven't seen would suffice). oldmilwaukee6er 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeeksAreMyPeeps Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 It's X-Force 8 and don't let anyone tell you otherwise . . . I'm curious as to how you come up with your prices. Do you keep raising the number until you get to a point where no one reasonable would pay it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeeksAreMyPeeps Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 (edited) It's X-Force 8 and don't let anyone tell you otherwise . . . I'm curious as to how you come up with your prices. Do you keep raising the number until you get to a point where no one reasonable would pay it? Not being facetious here. Obviously there are enough unreasonable people out there for this strategy to make money, as you like to remind us in the heating up threads. Edited July 18, 2015 by GeeksAreMyPeeps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
divad Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 Whether Domino's first appearance was in NM # 98 is a whole other argument. The thing that makes no sense to me from any perspective is that CGC label # 11 as the first appearance of the "real" Domino when it's not the first appearance of any Domino. It looks like most, if not all, of the reference sites have listed #8 as her first appearance. For a while, some listed #8 while others listed #11 - some even broke it down by "first appearance in flashback" (#8) and "first appearance" (#11). I wouldn't be surprised if CGC begins to recognize #8 as her first appearance. "They" could actually benefit from reading a comic or two, now and then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
divad Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 It's X-Force 8 and don't let anyone tell you otherwise . . . I'm curious as to how you come up with your prices. Do you keep raising the number until you get to a point where no one reasonable would pay it? Not being facetious here. Obviously there are enough unreasonable people out there for this strategy to make money, as you like to remind us in the heating up threads. There are plenty of collectors out there who realize to get quality HG books, you have to pay the price. A good many of my books get sold to SS flippers (who actually need the book before they can have it signed and flip it for three to four times more). You don't seem to take issue with any of those sellers (many of whom reside here). Anyone who has actually bought from me (now there's a concept for you) knows they're getting the real deal, plain and simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeeksAreMyPeeps Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 It's X-Force 8 and don't let anyone tell you otherwise . . . I'm curious as to how you come up with your prices. Do you keep raising the number until you get to a point where no one reasonable would pay it? Not being facetious here. Obviously there are enough unreasonable people out there for this strategy to make money, as you like to remind us in the heating up threads. There are plenty of collectors out there who realize to get quality HG books, you have to pay the price. A good many of my books get sold to SS flippers (who actually need the book before they can have it signed and flip it for three to four times more). You don't seem to take issue with any of those sellers (many of whom reside here). Anyone who has actually bought from me (now there's a concept for you) knows they're getting the real deal, plain and simple. Why would I take issue with people who buy books to get signed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
500Club Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 Again, X force 8 was a ret-con. It doesn't undo or negate the actual first "appearance" that occurred in NM 98. It just explains it. -J. +1 As noted, NM 98 is the first appearance of the character. X-Force 8 is the first appearance of the 'true' Domino. From here, the market can decide what that distinction is worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
500Club Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 It's X-Force 8 and don't let anyone tell you otherwise . . . I'm curious as to how you come up with your prices. Do you keep raising the number until you get to a point where no one reasonable would pay it? Not being facetious here. Obviously there are enough unreasonable people out there for this strategy to make money, as you like to remind us in the heating up threads. In divad's defence, he does put up extremely large scans, that allow the buyer to well judge the book for themselves. I don't necessarily agree with all of his grades, but he is a dramatic step above the average eBay seller, where 'NM' nets you an 8.0-8.5 copy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeeksAreMyPeeps Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 It's X-Force 8 and don't let anyone tell you otherwise . . . I'm curious as to how you come up with your prices. Do you keep raising the number until you get to a point where no one reasonable would pay it? Not being facetious here. Obviously there are enough unreasonable people out there for this strategy to make money, as you like to remind us in the heating up threads. In divad's defence, he does put up extremely large scans, that allow the buyer to well judge the book for themselves. I don't necessarily agree with all of his grades, but he is a dramatic step above the average eBay seller, where 'NM' nets you an 8.0-8.5 copy. I wasn't even commenting on his grading here (as this issue seems to be in really decent shape), but rather just on how he decides on prices. Many of the results he posts don't seem to be based on other sales of the issue, and the numbers seem somewhat random. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
500Club Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 It's X-Force 8 and don't let anyone tell you otherwise . . . I'm curious as to how you come up with your prices. Do you keep raising the number until you get to a point where no one reasonable would pay it? Not being facetious here. Obviously there are enough unreasonable people out there for this strategy to make money, as you like to remind us in the heating up threads. In divad's defence, he does put up extremely large scans, that allow the buyer to well judge the book for themselves. I don't necessarily agree with all of his grades, but he is a dramatic step above the average eBay seller, where 'NM' nets you an 8.0-8.5 copy. I wasn't even commenting on his grading here (as this issue seems to be in really decent shape), but rather just on how he decides on prices. Many of the results he posts don't seem to be based on other sales of the issue, and the numbers seem somewhat random. He gets outlier prices. My suspicion is that this is a reflection of how bad grading is on eBay on average. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gatsby77 Posted July 20, 2015 Share Posted July 20, 2015 I'm in the NM 98-as-first-appearance camp. Why? Because I was reading New Mutants from # 92 on and loved the character who first appeared in # 98. Ironically, X-Force # 8 was the last issue I read of that title. Because I never read X-Force past # 8, I didn't catch the retcon. Similarly, having read some of the GA stories, no way do I believe that Alan Scott is gay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
___ Posted July 20, 2015 Share Posted July 20, 2015 That's a really weird situation. If a later story said that Superman in Action Comics #1 wasn't the real Superman... what would that mean? New Mutants #98 is dated February 1991. X-Force #8 is dated March 1992. Do you really get to wait a year to say that the first appearance of someone isn't "real"? The first Domino is in New Mutants #98. A year later, it's a Domino appearance in the second year of Domino's existence... so how can the year-later story make the appearance count as first? This just in... the REAL Spider-man is in Amazing Spider-man #149. Peter was a copycat. The first 148 don't count. Amen to everything said right here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
___ Posted July 20, 2015 Share Posted July 20, 2015 Domino's first "appearance" is still technically NM 98. X-force #8 is a ret-con. That's my story and I'm sticking to it. -J. AMEN to this statment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
divad Posted July 20, 2015 Share Posted July 20, 2015 I'm in the NM 98-as-first-appearance camp. Why? Because I was reading New Mutants from # 92 on and loved the character who first appeared in # 98. Ironically, X-Force # 8 was the last issue I read of that title. Because I never read X-Force past # 8, I didn't catch the retcon. Similarly, having read some of the GA stories, no way do I believe that Alan Scott is gay. All guys with two first names are gay . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
divad Posted July 20, 2015 Share Posted July 20, 2015 That's a really weird situation. If a later story said that Superman in Action Comics #1 wasn't the real Superman... what would that mean? New Mutants #98 is dated February 1991. X-Force #8 is dated March 1992. Do you really get to wait a year to say that the first appearance of someone isn't "real"? The first Domino is in New Mutants #98. A year later, it's a Domino appearance in the second year of Domino's existence... so how can the year-later story make the appearance count as first? This just in... the REAL Spider-man is in Amazing Spider-man #149. Peter was a copycat. The first 148 don't count. Amen to everything said right here! Except that even though it was a year in time, it really wasn't. New Mutants ended at 100 . . . that's only two issues And it's not a ret-con, if the character is only defined by a brief appearance in one previous issue. It's more like a blind date. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazyboy Posted July 21, 2015 Share Posted July 21, 2015 That's a really weird situation. If a later story said that Superman in Action Comics #1 wasn't the real Superman... what would that mean? Ask Kal-El of Earth-1? But seriously, there's no reason to introduce a loner as an impostor. New Mutants #98 is dated February 1991. X-Force #8 is dated March 1992. Do you really get to wait a year to say that the first appearance of someone isn't "real"? I don't know, what is the statute of limitations on declaring impostors? Is it the same issue, the next issue, a year? Does it matter whether the character is new or established? Does it matter if there is evidence that the writer/plotter intended it the whole time? This just in... the REAL Spider-man is in Amazing Spider-man #149. Peter was a copycat. The first 148 don't count. On what could anybody even possibly base that idea? Which established team was Spider-Man trying to infiltrate? Again, there's no reason to introduce a loner as an impostor. At least the (90s) Clone Saga was based on Spidey throwing away the clone-test results without even looking at them after the events of ASM 149. It made sense as a way to "fix" Spidey even if the idea annoyed some fans. Impostors are hardly unprecedented in comics (or real life, for that matter). Is everybody just getting hung-up here because it's the "first appearance" of a character? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AGGIEZ Posted March 16, 2017 Share Posted March 16, 2017 "RISE FROM YOUR GRAVE!" bumping this up because Domino was just cast in Deadpool 2 and CGC still has the label wrong... http://marvel.com/universe/Domino_(Neena_Thurman) gaz973 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ygogolak Posted March 16, 2017 Share Posted March 16, 2017 15 minutes ago, AGGIEZ said: "RISE FROM YOUR GRAVE!" bumping this up because Domino was just cast in Deadpool 2 and CGC still has the label wrong... http://marvel.com/universe/Domino_(Neena_Thurman) While I am in the camp for #8, going to be hard to get a label change when the creator believes differently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AGGIEZ Posted March 16, 2017 Share Posted March 16, 2017 Just more proof as to why I feel like Leifeld is an id'jit... RockMyAmadeus and awakeintheashes 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...