Show Us Your Ducks! 16 16

[tb]

There must have been a considerable number of file copies from various sources. Some have characteristic markings, including the Western stamp, but most of my best file copies are completely unmarked. The V2#1 above is also a file copy, it was just not designated as such by CGC.

 

From my meetings with Yellow Kid, Malcolm Willits (I recorded several hours of our conversation on video), and collectors who were around in the 1970s, I've learned that Willits and Leonard Brown made a number of deals and trades with Disney after they founded Collector's Book Store in 1965. For example, Willits mentioned that they traded an extra copy of the "Mickey Mouse and the Mad Doctor" poster to Dave Smith, who started the Disney Archives around that time, in a lopsided deal where they received large amounts of quality material. In one or more of these deals, they received multiple file copies of Mickey Mouse Magazine. Willits picked some of the best of these for his personal collection, but many of the books I've been posting were duplicates that were for sale in CBS. All of these books were absorbed by long term collectors 30-40 years ago and did not surface again until 1. Willits' run was sold around 1995 and 2. I purchased the parallel run from CBS in 2003-04. The file copy run that sold at Sotheby's (or Christie's?) around 1994 must have been an entirely different collection, and the find you described was probably yet another. I would not be surprised if there are 10 or more runs of file copies floating around. This is of course the only reason that books like the one above exist at all.

[Moondog]

There must have been a considerable number of file copies from various sources. Some have characteristic markings, including the Western stamp, but most of my best file copies are completely unmarked. The V2#1 above is also a file copy, it was just not designated as such by CGC.

 

From my meetings with Yellow Kid, Malcolm Willits (I recorded several hours of our conversation on video), and collectors who were around in the 1970s, I've learned that Willits and Leonard Brown made a number of deals and trades with Disney after they founded Collector's Book Store in 1965. For example, Willits mentioned that they traded an extra copy of the "Mickey Mouse and the Mad Doctor" poster to Dave Smith, who started the Disney Archives around that time, in a lopsided deal where they received large amounts of quality material. In one or more of these deals, they received multiple file copies of Mickey Mouse Magazine. Willits picked some of the best of these for his personal collection, but many of the books I've been posting were duplicates that were for sale in CBS. All of these books were absorbed by long term collectors 30-40 years ago and did not surface again until 1. Willits' run was sold around 1995 and 2. I purchased the parallel run from CBS in 2003-04. The file copy run that sold at Sotheby's (or Christie's?) around 1994 must have been an entirely different collection, and the find you described was probably yet another. I would not be surprised if there are 10 or more runs of file copies floating around. This is of course the only reason that books like the one above exist at all.

 

Thanks, tb. What proof does CGC need to designate a book a File Copy?

 

[tb]

I don't know and am not sure what to read into the designations. I take them with a grain of salt, but I always try mention the provenance on the submission form when possible. In some cases, I've included copies of auction catalogs or dealers' lists. For the Mickey Mouse Magazines, my own experience is that most file copies are marked one way or the other so it rarely is an issue. For the unmarked file copies that I mentioned, their condition is usually so off the charts that they never could have been circulated.

[Moondog]

I don't know and am not sure what to read into the designations. I take them with a grain of salt, but I always try mention the provenance on the submission form when possible. In some cases, I've included copies of auction catalogs or dealers' lists. For the Mickey Mouse Magazines, my own experience is that most file copies are marked one way or the other so it rarely is an issue. For the unmarked file copies that I mentioned, their condition is usually so off the charts that they never could have been circulated.

 

The lot that I lost out on were not marked, but they were definitely file copies since the seller worked at Western. All the copies he had were from the first color issue on.

[tb]

Another MMM back from certification last week. Bought this from Jerry Weist in 2002 (for something like $200).

 

And, for a change, a WDC&S just bought from Transplant.

 

 

[tb]

The ad on the back cover has got to be the creepiest I've ever seen on a funny animal book. Things were different back in 1935...

 

[Duffman_Comics]

Hey! I have one of those too - but mine has far more character:

 

 

 

 

 

Now, here's a question for Fowl and Rodent Magazine aficionados.

 

My copy has had an ad page pasted over the inside back cover, specifically done for Australia - note the "Competitions are void in Oz" disclaimer. This was definitely done at the time of distribution, and as you can see it is for a "savoury sauce" - P.M.U.

 

 

 

 

Can anyone tell me what's under this ad?

[tb]

Duffman,

 

Thanks to YellowKid, I may have uncovered a bit more info that might give a clue towards explaining your mysterious copy:

 

"In a letter to Roy [Disney] dated October 11, 1935, Kamen reported:

 

"The actual net sales on the twenty-five cent issue is, at this time, 150,000.

On the second issue (October) they expect 200,000 net. The print order for

November is 300,000. The November issue will carry ten pages of advertising

(paid for, but some at special" prices [a policy neither Kamen nor the Disneys

approved of]). They have already sold five pages for the December issue, and

expect it to carry from ten to twenty pages of advertising. I had the entire

Horne staff over here the other night for a pep meeting. Granger, of Australia

[a good place for collectors to look for early issues of the magazine], wired an

order in for 25,000 copies of the first issue and with the order came a draft for

$750 (that was three cents a copy), so that was $750 like found for Hal. [...]""

[gaute]

The ad on the back cover has got to be the creepiest I've ever seen on a funny animal book. Things were different back in 1935...

 

 

that's a very sharp 7.5

thanks for showing us these great books!

[Duffman_Comics]

Duffman,

 

Thanks to YellowKid, I may have uncovered a bit more info that might give a clue towards explaining your mysterious copy:

 

"In a letter to Roy [Disney] dated October 11, 1935, Kamen reported:

 

"The actual net sales on the twenty-five cent issue is, at this time, 150,000.

On the second issue (October) they expect 200,000 net. The print order for

November is 300,000. The November issue will carry ten pages of advertising

(paid for, but some at special" prices [a policy neither Kamen nor the Disneys

approved of]). They have already sold five pages for the December issue, and

expect it to carry from ten to twenty pages of advertising. I had the entire

Horne staff over here the other night for a pep meeting. Granger, of Australia

[a good place for collectors to look for early issues of the magazine], wired an

order in for 25,000 copies of the first issue and with the order came a draft for

$750 (that was three cents a copy), so that was $750 like found for Hal. [...]""

 

That's interesting. The US's population in 1935 was estimated at a shade under 128 million and Oz had a little under 7 million .

 

25,000 is pretty strong number for a market so small by comparison.

 

Still doesn't tell me what's underneath

[tb]

that's a very sharp 7.5

 

The earliest issues often have spine splits that kill the technical grade. Sadly, I think it is most likely that this copy is the best existing.

 

Still doesn't tell me what's underneath

 

I forgot to check before I got it certified.

 

Pictures of the remaining copies in my run should soon be available in my registry set; I'm in the process of scanning them. I'll take a break from the Duck thread now to keep the spamming under control.

Edited February 6, 2012 by tb

[AJD]

 

 

Now, here's a question for Fowl and Rodent Magazine aficionados.

 

 

I now want to go open a pub called the Fowl and Rodent...

[Point Five]

 

Now, here's a question for Fowl and Rodent Magazine aficionados.

 

 

I now want to go open a pub called the Fowl and Rodent...

There is an Irish gastropub called The Dog and Duck in our neighborhood. The Fowl and Rodent would be a good sister establishment!

 

 

[50YrsCollctngCmcs]

The ad on the back cover has got to be the creepiest I've ever seen on a funny animal book. Things were different back in 1935...

 

 

That was a Bugs Bunny foot! They sold mouse tales on the back of Looney Tunes!

[50YrsCollctngCmcs]

There must have been a considerable number of file copies from various sources. Some have characteristic markings, including the Western stamp, but most of my best file copies are completely unmarked. The V2#1 above is also a file copy, it was just not designated as such by CGC.

 

From my meetings with Yellow Kid, Malcolm Willits (I recorded several hours of our conversation on video), and collectors who were around in the 1970s, I've learned that Willits and Leonard Brown made a number of deals and trades with Disney after they founded Collector's Book Store in 1965. For example, Willits mentioned that they traded an extra copy of the "Mickey Mouse and the Mad Doctor" poster to Dave Smith, who started the Disney Archives around that time, in a lopsided deal where they received large amounts of quality material. In one or more of these deals, they received multiple file copies of Mickey Mouse Magazine. Willits picked some of the best of these for his personal collection, but many of the books I've been posting were duplicates that were for sale in CBS. All of these books were absorbed by long term collectors 30-40 years ago and did not surface again until 1. Willits' run was sold around 1995 and 2. I purchased the parallel run from CBS in 2003-04. The file copy run that sold at Sotheby's (or Christie's?) around 1994 must have been an entirely different collection, and the find you described was probably yet another. I would not be surprised if there are 10 or more runs of file copies floating around. This is of course the only reason that books like the one above exist at all.

 

Sometime in the mid to latter part of the nineties, Busted Flush and I went to a San Diego Con on a Friday. This is when you could still park within walking distance of the hall for ten dollars for the day and no one was at the show on a Friday. We wandered around the quiet hall and ran into a dealer selling a complete collection of MMM that had come out of the Disney Archives. They were amazing!

 

Dave Smith ran the Disney archives for many years before it became what it is today. Storage was pretty informal in the old days but that is no longer the case with archival storage the norm today. I don't think you would be able to make the kinds of deals that were made in the seventies anymore!

 

I would like to find out the story of the Western Editorial copies someday. I actually visited Racine about five or six years ago while on a vacation in the area. I stopped by and tried to locate the old plant but couldn't. I saw a postman and asked him where it was and he pointed me in the correct direction. While no longer the home of Western Publishing the logo was still in view on the building entrance! That building was full of beautiful copies of great books for many years.

[BustedFlush]

The MMM collection was the biggest thrill to see that year at SDCC. That and 'Drippy Duck and Lil' Iffy.'

[Duffman_Comics]

that's a very sharp 7.5

 

The earliest issues often have spine splits that kill the technical grade. Sadly, I think it is most likely that this copy is the best existing.

 

This explains the necessity of the highly professional restoration having been performed on my book

 

Still doesn't tell me what's underneath

 

I forgot to check before I got it certified.

 

I really didn't expect you to take note/remember. In any case, not all mysteries should be solved

 

Pictures of the remaining copies in my run should soon be available in my registry set; I'm in the process of scanning them. I'll take a break from the Duck thread now to keep the spamming under control.

 

Nope, this isn't even remotely spamming. Please continue . . .

[AJD]

Duffman,

 

Thanks to YellowKid, I may have uncovered a bit more info that might give a clue towards explaining your mysterious copy:

 

"In a letter to Roy [Disney] dated October 11, 1935, Kamen reported:

 

"The actual net sales on the twenty-five cent issue is, at this time, 150,000.

On the second issue (October) they expect 200,000 net. The print order for

November is 300,000. The November issue will carry ten pages of advertising

(paid for, but some at special" prices [a policy neither Kamen nor the Disneys

approved of]). They have already sold five pages for the December issue, and

expect it to carry from ten to twenty pages of advertising. I had the entire

Horne staff over here the other night for a pep meeting. Granger, of Australia

[a good place for collectors to look for early issues of the magazine], wired an

order in for 25,000 copies of the first issue and with the order came a draft for

$750 (that was three cents a copy), so that was $750 like found for Hal. [...]""

 

The Granger would be Wal Granger. His son published Disney Comics in Australia under an exclusive licence because the father had a special relationship with Walt Disney. Here's the latter's obituary from the Sydney Morning Herald (19 Feb 2009):

 

 

In 1942 Wal Granger had been employed by his father, Walter Granger, for barely 12 months when he felt he was needed in the Australian Imperial Force and enlisted. He transferred to the RAAF and trained as a sergeant observer. After further training in England he was commissioned as a navigator and flew a tour of 36 operations in 101 Squadron, probably the most secret RAF squadron in World War II.

 

His operations were code-named ABC, Cigar or C'est Guerre, and carried secret equipment for jamming German Luftwaffe controller transmissions. German-speaking special operators went along and dis-information was broadcast from specially equipped Lancasters, to which were attached two very large vertical antennae.

 

The operations were dangerous as the planes flew in the main bomber stream at all times and 101 Squadron had the highest casualty loss of any squadron. After his tour, Walter Granger was awarded a Distinguished Flying Cross and returned to train future navigators.

 

Walter Arthur Granger, who has died in Sydney aged 84, was born in Casino, the first of four children to Walter Rogan Granger - a mail order toy retailer and associate of John Sands, the publishers and printers - and his wife, Lorna Madeline.

 

The Granger family moved to Sydney during the Depression years and Walter did well at Cranbrook, receiving a distinction in Business Principles.

 

While on a business trip to California, Walter senior had become acquainted with Walt and Roy Disney in 1937 in Burbank, near Hollywood, after successfully introducing the concept of "Mother's Day" in Australia.

 

Disney was badly cash-strapped after the launch of Snow White And The Seven Dwarfs. Walter senior convinced him to embark on an advertising campaign, which ensured the success of the venture. Disney never forgot and soon appointed him Australian representative for Disney Enterprises, later to become a magical world of television, toys, films and theme parks.

 

Flying Officer Wal Granger DFC returned safely from England in March 1946, but his father died suddenly in 1947. His standing had been so high as Disney's representative that Disney was encouraged to give the 23-year-old Wal a chance to take over the Australian business. He thus became the breadwinner for his mother and three younger siblings.

 

In April 1957 Wal married Joy Quinn, who became active in charities and a vice-president of the Black and White Committee.

 

Wal acquired a passion for farming, fishing and bowls and was a most convivial host. The Grangers built a house on the side of a cliff in Point Piper. They only only recently completed refurbishing Babworth House in Darling Point.

 

During Wal Granger's watch the Disney world flourished in Australia and grew beyond just Mickey Mouse, Snow White or the Big Bad Wolf. He loved good fellowship, a single malt scotch and a cigar.

 

Wal Granger is survived by Joy, their daughters Anna and Louise and their families.

[tb]

AJD: Thanks for the info on Walter and Wal Granger. Fun how you can get a little dose of history here every day.

 

I can't help but wonder if there are many more of the Australian editions circulating without anyone being aware of their origin. I'd love to find one of these copies from my own collection.

 

Sometime in the mid to latter part of the nineties, Busted Flush and I went to a San Diego Con on a Friday. This is when you could still park within walking distance of the hall for ten dollars for the day and no one was at the show on a Friday. We wandered around the quiet hall and ran into a dealer selling a complete collection of MMM that had come out of the Disney Archives. They were amazing!

 

Based on the timing and your description, I wonder if what you saw might have been Malcolm Willits' collection, especially if the books had no markings... Do you remember the dealer?

 

I would like to find out the story of the Western Editorial copies someday. I actually visited Racine about five or six years ago while on a vacation in the area. I stopped by and tried to locate the old plant but couldn't. I saw a postman and asked him where it was and he pointed me in the correct direction. While no longer the home of Western Publishing the logo was still in view on the building entrance! That building was full of beautiful copies of great books for many years.

 

This reminds me that I need to post the 1981 "Barks Collector" article that YellowKid gave me, describing possibly the best Disney comics collection I have ever heard of.

 

Today, I was scanning the book below and thought I'd share one more. If anyone were to give me 30 seconds to explain why I collect MMMs, I'd hand them this copy and let that do the talking.

 

 

[50YrsCollctngCmcs]

 

Sometime in the mid to latter part of the nineties, Busted Flush and I went to a San Diego Con on a Friday. This is when you could still park within walking distance of the hall for ten dollars for the day and no one was at the show on a Friday. We wandered around the quiet hall and ran into a dealer selling a complete collection of MMM that had come out of the Disney Archives. They were amazing!

 

Based on the timing and your description, I wonder if what you saw might have been Malcolm Willits' collection, especially if the books had no markings... Do you remember the dealer?

I don't remember who that was, I wish I did. He was actually quite a reasonable guy to talk to about this.

 

I would like to find out the story of the Western Editorial copies someday. I actually visited Racine about five or six years ago while on a vacation in the area. I stopped by and tried to locate the old plant but couldn't. I saw a postman and asked him where it was and he pointed me in the correct direction. While no longer the home of Western Publishing the logo was still in view on the building entrance! That building was full of beautiful copies of great books for many years.

 

This reminds me that I need to post the 1981 "Barks Collector" article that YellowKid gave me, describing possibly the best Disney comics collection I have ever heard of.

 

Please post away! I would love to read that; probably for the second time as I used to subscribe.