What is the mark up? 0

[Panelfan1]

A little while back I sold a piece of art and shortly after saw it for 5 times the amount on the reputable dealers site.  No, it wasn't cooliness.  

Wondering what kind of mark ups you have witnessed personally.  You dont need to name dealers if you don't wish. For example you sold a bronze splash for x and saw it shortly after for 2.5x.  

Looking to see if there is a norm.

Reason for this post is to have a better understanding of markup for purpose of bargaining when going to make a purchase.  Before I had made that deal I thought markups were slimmer for new aquisitions (art that the dealer just got in)

Think of this like when you go to the car dealer. You look up dealer cost and this helps with bargaining.

Opinions/experiences appreciated.

[Bronty]

There is no norm.  

 

/thread 

[Bronty]

Okay, so I'm being a (rhymes with rick) but I don't think you've thought this through and there is no way this thread can go other than to ultimately tell you there is no norm.

There is no standard mark up percentage.   There's an endless amount of factors, only a few of which I list here:

a) every dealer operates differently

b) what people ultimately do is price it at the max price they think they can get

c) how fast they want to get that money plays into it

d) "markup" is a useless without parameters.   Paying $10 and marking up to $100, or paying $100k and marking up to $110k.   Which is the bigger markup?    By % its the first one, but by $ its the second one.

Edited February 22, 2017 by Bronty

[SquareChaos]

I don't have a lot of experience for this, but I think the markup would be as high as the dealer thought the market would bear... unless they wanted to move it quickly. So I don't think there is a formula to plug in the sell price and spit out the percentage of markup.

[malvin]

markup can be irrelevant, it is priced to what the market will bear, as others have said.  For collectors, cost would matter since they sometimes would not sell things below costs, but there is no set markup.

Malvin

[Panelfan1]

Ok everyone.  Look - everything you are saying so far I understand. Was hoping you can share personal experiences.  Say from the past year or so if you had them.  

Perhaps my experience was unusual. Thing is I had asked the dealer what the art I was looking to sell was worth and then they ended up pricing it way more. This was someone whom I thought was fair (before the deal).   I expected them to offer less than they sold for. Possibly as little as half - but 5x was more than I imagined.

Again - what if any markups have you personally experienced?

Incidentally I am not upset or bitter or what not about that transaction. Just using it here  as an illustration in the discussion.

 

Thanks.

 

Edited February 22, 2017 by Panelfan1

[SquareChaos]

I didn't mean to derail your thread... but this seems more like a round about way to ask people if they feel like they'd been ripped off by a dealer 

I hope other people can provide responses closer to what you're after, I always look forward to people writing about their experiences in this forum as it is probably the primary source of knowledge for me concerning this hobby.

[Panelfan1]

21 minutes ago, SquareChaos said:

I didn't mean to derail your thread... but this seems more like a round about way to ask people if they feel like they'd been ripped off by a dealer 

I hope other people can provide responses closer to what you're after, I always look forward to people writing about their experiences in this forum as it is probably the primary source of knowledge for me concerning this hobby.

Yeah. Point wasnt about being ripped off at all.   I am fairly direct when I post threads.  Always looking forward. Interested in eyewitness reports so I can get a better understanding on future transactions.

Edited February 22, 2017 by Panelfan1

[SquareChaos]

2 minutes ago, Panelfan1 said:

Yeah. Point wasnt about being ripped off at all.   I am fairly direct when I post threads.  Always looking forward. Interested in eyewitness reports so I can get a better understanding on future transactions.

I think you have received the only viable answer already, but I hope you get more of what you're looking for 

[JadeGiant]

I have to agree with the notion that there is no “norm” from what I have seen in my collecting. I am not even surprised when I see stuff listed on dealer sites at multiples of what most people would think is FMV. I have seen it enough to know it is a reality.

[Twanj]

2-3x

from things I have seen sold at Heritage or CL then pop up on dealer's sites.

2 hours ago, Panelfan1 said:

Before I had made that deal I thought markups were slimmer for new aquisitions (art that the dealer just got in)

I think you might be able to make more of a bargaining deal if the art has been in stock longer & not sold. unless you're saying that they may raise the price if it doesn't sell, which also does happen.

[Kohei]

1 hour ago, Twanj said:

2-3x

from things I have seen sold at Heritage or CL then pop up on dealer's sites.

I've seen this-then I've also seen pieces bounce from auction site to auction site and each time the reserve goes up. Ultimately, it's the collector who misses out and the piece gets stuck with a speculator who doesn't really want it.

[AnkurJ]

I have seen 2-3x in many cases.

[Stronguy]

Several years ago I was offered a very nice early Bronze Age Avengers splash page for $800 which was not a steal but also not an overly aggressive price.  Between the time I tentatively accepted the offer and the time I actually had the funds in-hand it was sold to a dealer.  Within a month it was list on their website for $12,000.  Mind you, this was in the day when covers from that era could be had for $5,000 or so.

[MyNameIsLegion]

4 hours ago, Stronguy said:

Several years ago I was offered a very nice early Bronze Age Avengers splash page for $800 which was not a steal but also not an overly aggressive price.  Between the time I tentatively accepted the offer and the time I actually had the funds in-hand it was sold to a dealer.  Within a month it was list on their website for $12,000.  Mind you, this was in the day when covers from that era could be had for $5,000 or so.

That's because the zero key's been stuck on Steve Donnely's keyboard for 20 years....

[ESeffinga]

Hahahahahahahaaaaa

[John E.]

I just noticed that a really nice David Mack "Kraven Last Hunt" commission that (under)sold on eBay for $145 on 1/22/17 is now up at Romitaman (2/26/17) for $500. That's about a 3.5X markup.

 

Edited February 28, 2017 by Jay Olie Espy

[John E.]

Can I hijack this thread a bit? So I've never traded art with a dealer, so I'm wondering who determines the value of your piece? Since I've never traded with a dealer, I imagine that the trade is usually lopsided in favor of the dealer. The one exception might be that $20 page you bought at a con 40 years ago that's now worth $2000. But what if we're talking about modern art? I guess that point I'm trying to get to is that if you trade in your $250 piece of modern art for $200 in credit, then what's the advantage of trading over just selling it on your own?

[romitaman]

16 minutes ago, Jay Olie Espy said:

I just noticed that a really nice David Mack "Kraven Last Hunt" commission that (under)sold on eBay for $145 on 1/22/17 is now up at Romitaman (2/26/17) for $500. That's about a 3.5X markup.

 

seeing that i took it at 500 trade recently in a big deal I did last week...the markup is ZERO...Thanks

Edited February 28, 2017 by romitaman

[John E.]

8 hours ago, romitaman said:

seeing that i took it at 500 trade recently in a big deal I did last week...the markup is ZERO...Thanks

I should've been clearer to say that I don't assume it was you, Mike, that won the auction and is trying to resell it, as it could've been another buyer who could've taken it to you for consignment; that's why I wrote that it's on your site, but not that you did it directly, but I'll give you that my last sentence makes that assumption. Besides, that David Mack piece was in a recent public auction not forgotten by anyone who was watching or bidding. The sales history is still available on eBay. Anyone who followed the auction and sees it now on your site will draw the same conclusion, not just me.