GRADING CONTEST : ROUND 9 *DELETED*

[verygoodplus]

I hadn't finalized my grade, but every time I get it down to 8.5/9.0... I go the wrong way.

 

So, I probably would have gone with 9.0.

[Mr. Zipper]

Not so fast. Being able to discern the defects from the scan is the WHOLE POINT OF THE GAME, isn't it? If we're spoon fed where they are and what to look for, it defeats the purpose of playing this game.

 

The grading notes are not going to "spoon feed" anyone data (a complete list of defects) that they can plug into a program and "compute" a grade. The grading notes don't defeat the purpose of the game, they just ensure we have the same information as the CGC people grading the book.

 

In my view, the the whole point of the contest is weighing the severity of defects and arriving at the grade!

[Aman619]

but many defects are not discernable on monitors, or certainly to a lesser degree than when CGC hold the actual book in their hands. I did not see the tanning on that Showcase... and I looked all around for awhile.

[verygoodplus]

In my view, the the whole point of the contest is weighing the severity of defects and arriving at the grade!

 

Well said.

[FFB]

Everybody is taking this wayyyyy too seriously. I didn't read the whole Round 8 thread, but I'm figuring that Greggy (a) told some people, but not others, about the tanning interiors or (b) didn't let anybody know.

 

No one but me asked Greggy about tanning, but I highly doubt I was the only person who noticed it. In fact, the severely darkened cover stock was the first thing I noticed when I looked at the book. In order to confirm that it was actually tanning, I asked Greggy to confirm whether it was tanning (as opposed to some trick of the scan), and if so, whether the inside cover looked like the outside cover (which it usually does when you're talking about tanning, as opposed to a dust shadow where you only get darkening on one side of the folio). I also asked whether the tanning was as dark in person as it looked in the scan.

 

Although some people may have missed the tanning, I think plenty of people saw it, said to themselves "Oh who cares, CGC doesn't downgrade for tanning that much," and then submitted a grade that was too high.

 

Whatever happened though, the tanning was not a "hidden defect," so what greggy told Andy was correct. The book was downgraded for tanning, not just "interior tanning" and the tanning was obvious.

 

Finally, leave greggy alone, you [#@$%!!!]. I'd rather all of you whiners leave the contest if you can't have fun and feel the need to [#@$%!!!] about everything.

[FFB]

but many defects are not discernable on monitors, or certainly to a lesser degree than when CGC hold the actual book in their hands. I did not see the tanning on that Showcase... and I looked all around for awhile.

 

You really need to adjust your monitor then. I don't see how you could have missed it. The whites of the cover are dark tan on this book!

[FFB]

If you're also going to invite 70+ people to spend time playing the contest, the least you should provide them with is an even-handed disbursement of information. Nikos has handled these contests impecably, and I've said so over and over.

 

Agreed. Nikos

 

My suggestion would be to post the scan, grading notes and any observable issue, e.g., the scratch on back is on the slab, not the book or there is a 1 inch corner bend that's difficult to see in scan.

 

Period. No questions.

 

Everyone gets the same info and a level playing field, and Nikos gets a break from answering countless questions.

 

I agree, except allow questions. If grading notes are posted, there will be far fewer questions, so the time spent getting and posting grading notes will pay for itself -- but grading notes should not be a substitute for someone being able to ask a specific question.

[Red Hook]

Everybody is taking this wayyyyy too seriously. I didn't read the whole Round 8 thread, but I'm figuring that Greggy (a) told some people, but not others, about the tanning interiors or (b) didn't let anybody know.

 

No one but me asked Greggy about tanning, but I highly doubt I was the only person who noticed it. In fact, the severely darkened cover stock was the first thing I noticed when I looked at the book. In order to confirm that it was actually tanning, I asked Greggy to confirm whether it was tanning (as opposed to some trick of the scan), and if so, whether the inside cover looked like the outside cover (which it usually does when you're talking about tanning, as opposed to a dust shadow where you only get darkening on one side of the folio). I also asked whether the tanning was as dark in person as it looked in the scan.

 

Although some people may have missed the tanning, I think plenty of people saw it, said to themselves "Oh who cares, CGC doesn't downgrade for tanning that much," and then submitted a grade that was too high.

 

Whatever happened though, the tanning was not a "hidden defect," so what greggy told Andy was correct. The book was downgraded for tanning, not just "interior tanning" and the tanning was obvious.

 

Finally, leave greggy alone, you [#@$%!!!]. I'd rather all of you whiners leave the contest if you can't have fun and feel the need to [#@$%!!!] about everything.

 

Oh, Blow it your asss ya' big Windbag! Stop whining about the whiners!

[FFB]

If you're also going to invite 70+ people to spend time playing the contest, the least you should provide them with is an even-handed disbursement of information. Nikos has handled these contests impecably, and I've said so over and over.

 

Agreed. Nikos

 

My suggestion would be to post the scan, grading notes and any observable issue, e.g., the scratch on back is on the slab, not the book or there is a 1 inch corner bend that's difficult to see in scan.

 

Period. No questions.

 

Everyone gets the same info and a level playing field, and Nikos gets a break from answering countless questions.

 

Not so fast. Being able to discern the defects from the scan is the WHOLE POINT OF THE GAME, isn't it? If we're spoon fed where they are and what to look for, it defeats the purpose of playing this game.

 

No, that is not the point of the game. Being able to guess what CGC graded the book is the point of the game. You can't do that consistently without knowing what defects they saw when they graded it.

 

If you think you can see all of the defects in a scan that you can see in hand, you are sorely mistaken.

[FFB]

Not so fast. Being able to discern the defects from the scan is the WHOLE POINT OF THE GAME, isn't it? If we're spoon fed where they are and what to look for, it defeats the purpose of playing this game.

 

The grading notes are not going to "spoon feed" anyone data (a complete list of defects) that they can plug into a program and "compute" a grade. The grading notes don't defeat the purpose of the game, they just ensure we have the same information as the CGC people grading the book.

 

In my view, the the whole point of the contest is weighing the severity of defects and arriving at the grade!

 

[FFB]

Everybody is taking this wayyyyy too seriously. I didn't read the whole Round 8 thread, but I'm figuring that Greggy (a) told some people, but not others, about the tanning interiors or (b) didn't let anybody know.

 

No one but me asked Greggy about tanning, but I highly doubt I was the only person who noticed it. In fact, the severely darkened cover stock was the first thing I noticed when I looked at the book. In order to confirm that it was actually tanning, I asked Greggy to confirm whether it was tanning (as opposed to some trick of the scan), and if so, whether the inside cover looked like the outside cover (which it usually does when you're talking about tanning, as opposed to a dust shadow where you only get darkening on one side of the folio). I also asked whether the tanning was as dark in person as it looked in the scan.

 

Although some people may have missed the tanning, I think plenty of people saw it, said to themselves "Oh who cares, CGC doesn't downgrade for tanning that much," and then submitted a grade that was too high.

 

Whatever happened though, the tanning was not a "hidden defect," so what greggy told Andy was correct. The book was downgraded for tanning, not just "interior tanning" and the tanning was obvious.

 

Finally, leave greggy alone, you [#@$%!!!]. I'd rather all of you whiners leave the contest if you can't have fun and feel the need to [#@$%!!!] about everything.

 

Oh, Blow it your asss ya' big Windbag! Stop whining about the whiners!

 

[drbanner]

In my view, the the whole point of the contest is weighing the severity of defects and arriving at the grade!

 

Then why not just post a list of defects and no scan? What you're describing is one component of the task at hand, but the first is looking at the book and finding the defects yourself (and knowing what to look for). IMHO anyways...

[blutobc]

For some reason I'm having visions of a few folks quietly smiling in the background. Here are my imagined thoughts of the following people.

 

UV - "see, see, this is what you have to put up with when people take things too seriously"

 

Newt - "they can't run a grading contest without me"

 

Nikos - "gee, I must have the biggest set of "balls" around here...bring it on!!!!"

 

DL - "you mean I coulda bugged greggy earlier without using all them graemlins"

 

Sorry to see you go from the contest greggy. I appreciated your contribution. But this disagreement doesn't look serious enough to drop from the contest. Feel free to change your mind.

 

As far as the tanning..I didn't ask about it...I plainly saw it on the cover...didn't worry about it on interior pages...finally discounted it as many books with that amount of exterior tanning get pretty good grades....ultimately blew the grade that round...might have gotten 1 point if interior tanning had been mentioned...still slept soundly that night regardless of a grading contest.

[Red Hook]

Oh, Blow it your asss ya' big Windbag! Stop whining about the whiners!

 

 

See, what should have really happened was that you get five points for your bloody brilliance, and everyone else gets a bump up of one point.

 

Note to you guys......I only practice effective whining. Never whining for whinings sake.

[FFB]

In my view, the the whole point of the contest is weighing the severity of defects and arriving at the grade!

 

Then why not just post a list of defects and no scan? What you're describing is one component of the task at hand, but the first is looking at the book and finding the defects yourself (and knowing what to look for). IMHO anyways...

 

Is that a serious question?

 

What is the problem with graders' notes AND the scan? Defects in a scan often look different than they do when the book is in hand. Sometimes they're invisible in a scan, so the notes help tell you that there is something there that you can't otherwise see.

[FFB]

Oh, Blow it your asss ya' big Windbag! Stop whining about the whiners!

 

 

See, what should have really happened was that you get five points for your bloody brilliance, and everyone else gets a bump up of one point.

 

I'd prefer ten points for my bloody brilliance. And a tuna fish sandwich.

 

Note to you guys......I only practice effective whining. Never whining for whinings sake.

 

 

Now try to figure out whether that's a friendly laugh, a sarcastic laugh, or a laugh because I just crapped my pants and I'm the only one who knows about it.

[Red Hook]

Could I ask you something......WHAT THE HELL IS YOUR AVATAR? I've been staring at it for weeks now and everytime I do I feel like I'm lying on an operating table about to have my appendix taken out!

[drbanner]

What is the problem with graders' notes AND the scan? Defects in a scan often look different than they do when the book is in hand. Sometimes they're invisible in a scan, so the notes help tell you that there is something there that you can't otherwise see.

 

Any defect that can't be seen in the scan, or if they look different in the scan than they do in person, they should be disclosed. However, "large tear front cover" that's obvious in the scan should not be disclosed - the playas need to be able to look at a book and find these defects (and be aware of what they're looking for).

[Red Hook]

What is the problem with graders' notes AND the scan? Defects in a scan often look different than they do when the book is in hand. Sometimes they're invisible in a scan, so the notes help tell you that there is something there that you can't otherwise see.

 

Any defect that can't be seen in the scan, or if they look different in the scan than they do in person, they should be disclosed. However, "large tear front cover" that's obvious in the scan should not be disclosed - the playas need to be able to look at a book and find these defects (and be aware of what they're looking for).

 

So you actually concur with my whining...??!!

[uclapeterg]

Could I ask you something......WHAT THE HELL IS YOUR AVATAR? I've been staring at it for weeks now and everytime I do I feel like I'm lying on an operating table about to have my appendix taken out!

 

Oh, I see a dark tanning to his avatar. Does anyone else see it?