SD Comic-Con Panel Discussion On Community Issues - Input Solicited

[tth2]

Hey, don't forget the Atari 800s!!!!!!!!!

I`m not THAT old... or nerdy.

[Larryw7]

I hope someone asks Patterson what methods PGX uses in detecting restoration.

[FlyingDonut]

as I said in the other thread, this being held at a GIANT CONVENTION CENTER. They have people who will set up videotaping and audiotaping of your panel, and probably provide transcription services.

 

Contact 619-525-5110 - ask for anyone in Event Management

[Batfiend-migration]

Steve Borock has notified me he can no longer participate on the panel.

 

Disappointing to say the least as there will be many CGC related issues to be discussed and Steve, with all his experience, would certainly have been in an excellent position to respond.

 

I am working on finding a replacement.

 

Just goes to show how relevant CGC feel these boards are.

[esquirecomics]

Steve Borock has notified me he can no longer participate on the panel.

 

Disappointing to say the least as there will be many CGC related issues to be discussed and Steve, with all his experience, would certainly have been in an excellent position to respond.

 

I am working on finding a replacement.

 

Just goes to show how relevant CGC feel these boards are.

 

I wouldn't say that. Some could say, myself included, that there is evidence that the comments on these boards have a clear impact on CGC.

 

In any event, the fact that several CGC employees/officers, including Steve Borock himself, post on the boards should be sufficient to demonstrate that they certainly at least read what is being written.

[Batfiend-migration]

They don't do anything about it though. As the vast majority in our hobby don't know or don't care about the issues as a lot on these boards do then the last thing that CGC would want is to give any creedence to some minor irritants.

[BassGMan]

They don't do anything about it though. As the vast majority in our hobby don't know or don't care about the issues as a lot on these boards do then the last thing that CGC would want is to give any creedence to some minor irritants.

 

I think I may know what you are saying. If Borock or CGC was to appear at the panel then more time would be spent on how they view and handle the pressing issue, a postion that they know is controversial and they don't necessarily want others (the innocent non-Forumites in attendance) to be influenced by the likes of this crowd (we are so dramatic and over the top this group). But by NOT being there, CGC's positions would not be dwelled on nearly to the extent as if they were, and thus keeping a lower profile about the whole thing. Yes, I know Borock may have lost a little respect from SOME of the people of this Forum for backing out, BUT, I cannot say that it was a bad business decision for him to do so under these circumstances.

[esquirecomics]

I don't believe CGC's absence will significantly impact the topics discussed or minimize the extent to which CGC decisions/positions are mentioned. If anything, I think its absence may very well lead to an increase of unanswered questions which, unfortunately, may cause those not on these boards to seriously examine the issues in a different light. Additionally, the fact that CGC's decisions has caused PGX to now have a prominent role on the panel whereas before they probably would have been lucky to have even attracted a passing mention by no means can be viewed favorably.

 

I have told CGC that a spot remains open for any of their representatives to participate on the panel. I think it would be a terrible decision not to have someone participate. Of course, perhaps only 5 people will show up at the panel and the whole discussion will be basically moot.

 

At a minimum I will promote the boards to whomever shows up.

[BassGMan]

Of course, perhaps only 5 people will show up at the panel and the whole discussion will be basically moot.

 

 

Oh, I think there will be a pretty good crowd. As said before, even if I had never even heard of this Forum, this panel would still be #1 on my list as it speaks to the real collectors and comic book investors out there (not the Fanboys of 90% of the panels). Being that tens of thousand of people travel to this show, many of which are very serious about the money they put into comic books, I believe many more will feel the same way. May be a really nice crowd. The more the merrier anyway.

[jkrk]

I've read much of this post and here is my view: Fortunately I have no dog in this hunt.

 

1)My gut tells me that Steve was walking into a Kangaroo court with no upside. A panel discussion on comic investing/collecting touching on some contraversial issues is OK but it am thinking that some posters might have other agendas.

 

One poster commented:

I don't believe CGC's absence will significantly impact the topics discussed or minimize the extent to which CGC decisions/positions are mentioned. If anything, I think its absence may very well lead to an increase of unanswered questions which, unfortunately, may cause those not on these boards to seriously examine the issues in a different light".

 

ARE WE TOUCHING ON THE PRESSING ISSUE OR ARE WE HAVING A PRESSING SEMINAR??

 

Additionally, the fact that CGC's decisions has caused PGX to now have a prominent role on the panel whereas before they probably would have been lucky to have even attracted a passing mention by no means can be viewed favorably

Are we trying to intimidate CGC?

 

The solution surfaces:

I have told CGC that a spot remains open for any of their representatives to participate on the panel. I think it would be a terrible decision not to have someone participate

 

Let's intimidate CGC, if possible, but let's use their boards to accomplish our goal seems to be the message of this thread. If I were Steve I would have bowed out also.

 

I believe that what started out as an informative/interesting session is rapidly losing it's appeal. The cordial bantering seems to be turning into a hostile witch hunt. Perhaps It's past my bedtime and I'm cranky and no longer able to maintain a proper perspective or understand what Ive read.

 

In any case. Thanks to CGC for the use of their boards.

[awe4one]

Additionally, the fact that CGC's decisions has caused PGX to now have a prominent role on the panel whereas before they probably would have been lucky to have even attracted a passing mention by no means can be viewed favorably.

 

I have told CGC that a spot remains open for any of their representatives to participate on the panel. I think it would be a terrible decision not to have someone participate.

 

Having PGX on the panel will make CGC's absense all the more glaring considering the make-up and status of the rest of the panel. Not participating could be potentially much worse in the eyes of comicdom than participating in the eyes of Borock. Anyway you look at it, it's a terrible decision both from a business and practical standpoint...

 

Just cements my belief CGC has taken the short term view to issues rather than look long term... to the extent of it seriously damaging CGC's rep with the common collector...

 

Makes me wonder how Maggie will discuss CGC's absense in CBG when she writes a post-con report...

 

Jim

[Aman619]

Maggie will probably say something like this: "I had a great time on this great panel at Comicon about collecting comics. It was great. SO many greta questions were asked, and issues brought up. Unfortunately Borock couldnt make it, but we had a great time. Thanx to all who attended and participated. It was great. blah blah blah."

[RareHighGrade]

I believe that what started out as an informative/interesting session is rapidly losing it's appeal. The cordial bantering seems to be turning into a hostile witch hunt. Perhaps It's past my bedtime and I'm cranky and no longer able to maintain a proper perspective or understand what Ive read.

 

In any case. Thanks to CGC for the use of their boards.

 

I have to agree with jkrk. I am a pure collector who cares about the future of the hobby (including the "pressing" and other controversial issues). However, the panel discussion seems to have devolved into something with all the indicia of a set-up to confront CGC and Steve B. Regardless of Mark's intent, that was the clear perception. I cannot blame Steve for electing not to participate.

 

It is a shame that it turned out this way. It would have been great to have Steve B. participate in an objective panel discussion regarding collecting issues.

 

Having said all this, I nevertheless concur that at some point soon, CGC needs to address the controversial issues in an appropriate forum.

[Kevin Boyd]

If time permits I will wander upstairs to check this panel out.

 

As I've followed the discussions back and forth, I think it's really odd how some Forumites seem to be judging this panel as, depending on their point of view, the Nuremburg Trial or the G8 Summit.

 

I'm sure that's quite flattering to Mark, and I commend him on his work in putting together such an esteemed panel, but I'm sorry guys, it's just a panel about comic book collecting where people will voice their opinions about a variety of subjects and will, ultimately, be no more than a slight distraction in 4+ days of organized chaos. I don't see this having any effect on anything in the long run.

[esquirecomics]

I believe that what started out as an informative/interesting session is rapidly losing it's appeal. The cordial bantering seems to be turning into a hostile witch hunt. Perhaps It's past my bedtime and I'm cranky and no longer able to maintain a proper perspective or understand what Ive read.

 

In any case. Thanks to CGC for the use of their boards.

 

I have to agree with jkrk. I am a pure collector who cares about the future of the hobby (including the "pressing" and other controversial issues). However, the panel discussion seems to have devolved into something with all the indicia of a set-up to confront CGC and Steve B. Regardless of Mark's intent, that was the clear perception. I cannot blame Steve for electing not to participate.

 

It is a shame that it turned out this way. It would have been great to have Steve B. participate in an objective panel discussion regarding collecting issues.

 

For the life of me I cannot fathom how anyone reaches this opinion. You guys are reading far too much into anything that has been said on these boards.

 

Exactly who on the panel - besides me according to some (and I'm still not clear on why my motivation should be in question simply because I have some constructive criticisms of CGC which are shared by many forumites) - would have an agenda to attack CGC?

 

Jon Berk? Mark Wilson? Tom Gordon? Maggie Thompson? Are you kidding me?

 

And even if you believe Daniel Patterson will use the panel as a vehicle to attack CGC, which I doubt, he was added to the panel ONLY after and because of Steve Borock pulling out at the last minute.

 

So that leaves me apparently to lead the anti-CGC charge (which I do not have an intention of doing, which is not to say hard questions will not be asked) and somehow take on 4-5 other panelists and manipulate the panel to do nothing but make CGC look bad. You guys either give me far too much credit, or too little credit to the ability and views of the other panelists.

 

Having said all this, I nevertheless concur that at some point soon, CGC needs to address the controversial issues in an appropriate forum.

 

I could not agree more, and that is a positive view.

 

There will be tens of thousands of collectors/dealers at the SD Comic-Con. It is the largest comic book show in the country, is it not? How can this not be an appropriate forum to address any of these issues? And given CGC's important role in the community, why would this not be seen as an opportune or appropriate time for CGC to participate in the discussion?

 

Those of us who held certain views or concerns were challenged to do something about them rather than simply discuss them on the boards, and take affirmative action. So I did, yet the criticisms continue and motivations are questioned. The important issues facing our community extend far beyond CGC, which is just a part of the picture. And the panel discussion will reflect that accordingly.

 

And I agree with some who say that this is just a panel discussion on comic books. Believe me I am not under the impression that this panel is more important than panel discussions I organize on preventing and prosecuting war crimes or terrorism, which I often do. But nonetheless I take these issues very seriously and I am sorry that some of you - and I am not directing this at a particular person - see fit to only look for the negatives rather than the positives.

[FlyingDonut]

"Since our inception, CGC has never considered “pressing” to be a “bad thing” unless the comic book was taken apart to press it. Comic books should not be taken apart. Unlike restoration, when a comic book cover is pressed CORRECTLY and SAFELY, it will enhance the look of the comic book and most experts can’t even tell it has been pressed if they did not see the comic book before it was pressed."

 

Steve Borock, January 28, 2004.

[Ze-man]

 

And given CGC's important role in the community, why would this not be seen as an opportune or appropriate time for CGC to participate in the discussion?

 

 

IMHO

By acknowledging or even responding to certain topics/questions. Would just give credence to matters that CGC would rather not give the time of day to.

It is one thing to simply discuss comics, but I imagine Steve & co. would rather not take part in a Q & A that included a hotbed of issues that CGC views as either unimportant, or possibly damaging to their bottom line.(or both)

Steve would hold his own press conference if that was his intention.

 

And bottom line Mark... if it is important to you,the panel.. and to those who care enough to attend. Then dahm those that think otherwise.( you know we love to dissect EVERYTHING to the enth degree here.. nature of the forum..that and it is a slow time on the boards)

I never once thought you were doing this Panel as a platform to sabotage Steve, I just think as it unfolded, and it was made clear what was actually going to take place. Steve simply decided to bow out.

 

I bet he still cares, and is very interested in what is said.

 

Pure guesswork on my part....or is it

 

Remember........... have fun , ok?

 

Ze-

[awe4one]

"Since our inception, CGC has never considered “pressing” to be a “bad thing” unless the comic book was taken apart to press it. Comic books should not be taken apart. Unlike restoration, when a comic book cover is pressed CORRECTLY and SAFELY, it will enhance the look of the comic book and most experts can’t even tell it has been pressed if they did not see the comic book before it was pressed."

 

Steve Borock, January 28, 2004.

 

I noticed he doesn't mention doing the pressing in-house or under the watchful guidance of their bosses...

 

Jim

[Red Hook]

"Since our inception, CGC has never considered “pressing” to be a “bad thing” unless the comic book was taken apart to press it. Comic books should not be taken apart. Unlike restoration, when a comic book cover is pressed CORRECTLY and SAFELY, it will enhance the look of the comic book and most experts can’t even tell it has been pressed if they did not see the comic book before it was pressed."

 

Steve Borock, January 28, 2004.

 

I noticed he doesn't mention doing the pressing in-house or under the watchful guidance of their bosses...

 

Jim

 

It's about the money, not the books.