Interior Tears Question 1 1

[comicginger1789]

So I have this copy of UXM 121 that is in  the 7.0-7.5 range by mine estimate. However it has this flaw inside. It’s just the one page. Production flaw? Does it ding the book down any? Thoughts are much appreciated. Just wondering how this would compare to say an interior page rip.

[theCapraAegagrus]

That is interesting. IMO it looks like a "MFG defect", but I doubt that CGC will treat it that way.

[comicginger1789]

Right? But does it still grade a 7.0-7.5? I mean, maybe if it was not there, it is a 7.5 book. With it 7.0? Or worse?

[theCapraAegagrus]

Just now, comicginger1789 said:

Right? But does it still grade a 7.0-7.5? I mean, maybe if it was not there, it is a 7.5 book. With it 7.0? Or worse?

Whatever you think it is without the tears, go another 0.5 lower.

[comicginger1789]

Just now, theCapraAegagrus said:

Whatever you think it is without the tears, go another 0.5 lower.

Seems fair. I wonder if CGC would catch it. Sadly, I don't grade books. Only personally for my records, but thought it was a weird tear and wondered if any had seen one there before by chance. 

[theCapraAegagrus]

7 minutes ago, comicginger1789 said:

Seems fair. I wonder if CGC would catch it. Sadly, I don't grade books. Only personally for my records, but thought it was a weird tear and wondered if any had seen one there before by chance. 

It looks too clean to be done after assembly, doesn't it? If you're only noting it for personal collection, I'd mark down the number you think it is, and note the "MFG tear(s)". CGC usually only gives a pass to defects that are common.

[comicginger1789]

1 minute ago, theCapraAegagrus said:

It looks too clean to be done after assembly, doesn't it? If you're only noting it for personal collection, I'd mark down the number you think it is, and note the "MFG tear(s)". CGC usually only gives a pass to defects that are common.

Yeah, the pieces of paper that is punched out is still there wrinkled up in the centrefold, if that makes sense. Like if someone wanted to using something fine, you could grab that piece of paper and glue it back in place and the hole would be covered up (don't worry....never going to do that). But I did not think it was common like the tears at the bottom of book pages from this era. 

[silverseeker]

On 9/11/2020 at 10:41 AM, theCapraAegagrus said:

That is interesting. IMO it looks like a "MFG defect", but I doubt that CGC will treat it that way.

+1

I've seen other books that exhibit this exact same type of tear, and agree that looks like a manufacturing defect...

How it happens during manufacturing is a whole other question...

[The Lions Den]

On 9/11/2020 at 1:45 PM, comicginger1789 said:

Seems fair. I wonder if CGC would catch it. Sadly, I don't grade books. Only personally for my records, but thought it was a weird tear and wondered if any had seen one there before by chance. 

This isn't as uncommon as you may think. In the grade range you're talking about, it shouldn't make much difference...

[William-James88]

On 9/11/2020 at 1:43 PM, comicginger1789 said:

Right? But does it still grade a 7.0-7.5? I mean, maybe if it was not there, it is a 7.5 book. With it 7.0? Or worse?

I think it would not change the grade at that range.

[comicginger1789]

What if the book were 9.2-9.4? Would you bump down to 9.0 or worse? Curious for future reference and if it’s something that turns one off. Honestly because it’s not a missing coupon or something nasty, I don’t mind one bit but that’s just this collectors feelings.

[William-James88]

3 hours ago, comicginger1789 said:

What if the book were 9.2-9.4? Would you bump down to 9.0 or worse? Curious for future reference and if it’s something that turns one off. Honestly because it’s not a missing coupon or something nasty, I don’t mind one bit but that’s just this collectors feelings.

Yes, I would bump it down to an 8.0. Not sure how CGC would judge it.

[The Lions Den]

3 hours ago, comicginger1789 said:

What if the book were 9.2-9.4? Would you bump down to 9.0 or worse? Curious for future reference and if it’s something that turns one off. Honestly because it’s not a missing coupon or something nasty, I don’t mind one bit but that’s just this collectors feelings.

In higher grades, I have seen a flaw like this affect the grade. Determining how much it affects the grade is ultimately left to the grader's discretion. I have seen a book get bumped down a full grade for a page tear, but that was a fairly large tear (about 2" long). So it depends on the grader and the flaw. It's tough to really pinpoint things like this because both these factors can vary...

[The Lions Den]

7 minutes ago, William-James88 said:

Yes, I would bump it down to an 8.0. Not sure how CGC would judge it.

Always trust your instincts...

[William-James88]

1 hour ago, The Lions Den said:

Always trust your instincts...

Thanks! I learnt to grade from an old school grader while I worked at his shop. He told me that the best advice he could give me after all these years was to give the comic the grade you'd be comfortable with if you bought the comic. This could get higher than 8.0, maybe a 9.0 but unless it's CGC'd with that 9.0 I can easily imagine people returning the comic claiming a tear like that shouldn't be found in comics of this range. The problem with this comic is that unless it's high grade, it isn't worth getting graded. 

[The Lions Den]

16 minutes ago, William-James88 said:

Thanks! I learnt to grade from an old school grader while I worked at his shop. He told me that the best advice he could give me after all these years was to give the comic the grade you'd be comfortable with if you bought the comic. This could get higher than 8.0, maybe a 9.0 but unless it's CGC'd with that 9.0 I can easily imagine people returning the comic claiming a tear like that shouldn't be found in comics of this range. The problem with this comic is that unless it's high grade, it isn't worth getting graded. 

It's kind of funny, but I've seen that flaw before, and I do think it may have happened during the manufacturing process. It would likely be viewed differently by CGC if it had been manufactured that way as opposed to something that had been done by human interaction...

[William-James88]

22 minutes ago, The Lions Den said:

It's kind of funny, but I've seen that flaw before, and I do think it may have happened during the manufacturing process. It would likely be viewed differently by CGC if it had been manufactured that way as opposed to something that had been done by human interaction...

This sounds like Schrodinger's comic.