Ozonetv Posted June 28, 2021 Share Posted June 28, 2021 On 6/26/2021 at 12:34 AM, eee91 said: WOW. NICE. Yeah, that wasn't signed at the same time. With the way his signature changed over his lifetime, I'm guessing that your Avengers 1 was signed sometime before the FF 10, but that's just a guess of mine. James J Johnson or Mr Zipper would know more. Yup, Ozonetv is right. If you request to not slab your book if it doesn't pass verification, they send it back with a sticker on the bag that says REJECT. If you tell Voldemort to slab the book even if the sig doesn't pass verification, their blue label will say: "Jack Kirby signature (on 1st page) unverifiable by BAS". Respectfully, totally disagree. Ozonetv's two books look like Jack - not Roz. This is a photo someone posted on the boards here a few years back. You can see the top sig is Jack - the bottom two sigs are (most likely) Roz- Can't believe Beckett would think a Jack Kirby sig in a book with the PASSPORT BOOK SHOP stamp was sus. Yeesh... For what it's worth, my last two Kirby sig books I sent to Voldemort got rejected, too. Instead I took really good photographs of the signature, then sent the books to CGC to get slabbed. They'll get blue labels with "Jack Kirby written on page 1 in pen" on the label - then I'll keep photographs of the signature with the slab whenever I want to enjoy them. Now I just have to hope to get my Kirby books back from CGC sometime before 2023... Thats exactly my plan. :-) Brian Minor printed my pages on newsprint, and it looks pretty authentic. eee91 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan. Posted June 28, 2021 Share Posted June 28, 2021 Post hoc signature verification seems like a pretty stupid business to be in. K.P.D. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
namisgr Posted June 28, 2021 Share Posted June 28, 2021 1 hour ago, Ryan. said: Post hoc signature verification seems like a pretty stupid business to be in. It is a common practice in many areas of collectibles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan. Posted June 28, 2021 Share Posted June 28, 2021 Nevertheless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eee91 Posted June 28, 2021 Share Posted June 28, 2021 On 6/26/2021 at 2:55 PM, rexinnih said: I actually got disappointing news back from PSA this week on this one that I had both Kirby and Stan Lee sign in person. There was a note that while the Stan Lee was genuine, they couldn't verify the Kirby. My mistake as now I realize I should send it into CBCS for verification as they should have more experience with Kirby signatures. I recommend against sending Kirbys into them for verification. Since Beckett took over, they've been terrible at correctly verifying Kirby sigs. You'd be better off keeping your book raw, or taking quality photos of the sigs, print them out, and then send the book to CGC instead. Keep the photos with the slab. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Zipper Posted June 29, 2021 Share Posted June 29, 2021 On 6/26/2021 at 5:55 PM, rexinnih said: I actually got disappointing news back from PSA this week on this one that I had both Kirby and Stan Lee sign in person. There was a note that while the Stan Lee was genuine, they couldn't verify the Kirby. My mistake as now I realize I should send it into CBCS for verification as they should have more experience with Kirby signatures. This Kirby is absolutely authentic. Exactly what you’d expect to see from the late 80s. mr_highgrade and rexinnih 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Zipper Posted June 29, 2021 Share Posted June 29, 2021 On 6/25/2021 at 3:51 PM, Ozonetv said: I just got this book rejected by cbcs - Everyone I showed it to seem to think its the real deal. Oddly, I submitted a second book signed by Kirby (that I picked up from the same guy) and it passed with flying colors. ugh. Undoubtedly authentic. Ozonetv 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rexinnih Posted June 29, 2021 Share Posted June 29, 2021 6 hours ago, Mr. Zipper said: This Kirby is absolutely authentic. Exactly what you’d expect to see from the late 80s. Thanks - that fits the timeframe I got it signed by Kirby in San Diego. The Stan Lee was the Emerald City Comic Con in 2018 prior to his passing and glad I took the opportunity to get a photo with him and a few signatures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acuman Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 (edited) On 6/22/2021 at 11:40 AM, 956Ref said: Howdy. I came across two books that have Kirby and Stan autos on the splash page. They are still raw and would like some help authenticating them. If anyone can offer their experience I would greatly appreciate it. I have no backstory other than an older collector came into a nearby LCS and sold them. I’m interested but would like to avoid a fake if possible. The two books are X-men 10 and X-men 12. Any information would be greatly appreciated! First impression is that both Kirby signatures looks good. I would say the signature on X-Men #12 is more representative of his signature than that on #10. Upon closer comparison with other examples I have of Kirby's signature, I would say that the angle of the Y is steeper than usual (it is typically parallel to the vertical stroke in the K). The loop on the upward clockwise stroke of the J is typically larger. These two Kirby signatures, have barely any space between the loop and the vertical stroke. So they are not the best examples of Kirby's signatures as compared to others that are out there. But I need to preface by saying that signatures do evolve, these could be later as his penmanship starts to shake. If he was signing a lot of books quickly that day, it could also alter the autograph from his normal slower signatures. I can confidently say they are not from his wife (Roz). Please check you message. I can provide more insight. Edited June 30, 2021 by Acuman 956Ref 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
956Ref Posted July 3, 2021 Author Share Posted July 3, 2021 On 6/25/2021 at 7:28 PM, shadroch said: What state are you in? Different states have different laws pertaining to selling autographed items. As I understand it, most states require a seller to give a money back guarantee on the items authenticity. If the store owner is honest, he will back the books. If he is selling as is, he isn't worth dealing with. If the seller wants a premium pri ce, let him authenticate them. Offer a deal contingent on the signatures being verified. The problem is getting them slabbed eliminate the ability to see the signature so you are paying a premium for them having touched the books. Im in Texas. I havent asked him about a contingent deal, but I guess I can ask. From my few times dealing with him, he seems like a take it or leave it guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
956Ref Posted July 3, 2021 Author Share Posted July 3, 2021 On 6/26/2021 at 4:55 PM, rexinnih said: I actually got disappointing news back from PSA this week on this one that I had both Kirby and Stan Lee sign in person. There was a note that while the Stan Lee was genuine, they couldn't verify the Kirby. My mistake as now I realize I should send it into CBCS for verification as they should have more experience with Kirby signatures. Im sure that's frustrating to have that signed in person and then get rejected for authenticity. Sorry, maybe CBCS will fare better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Zipper Posted July 3, 2021 Share Posted July 3, 2021 8 hours ago, 956Ref said: Im sure that's frustrating to have that signed in person and then get rejected for authenticity. Sorry, maybe CBCS will fare better. As of late, James Spence Authentication (JSA) has been solid on Kirby authentication. They have a consultant who knows Kirby fairly well. Unfortunately, that doesn’t help you though if you want it slabbed. rexinnih 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
956Ref Posted July 11, 2021 Author Share Posted July 11, 2021 Thanks so much to everyone that contributed and Dm'd me. I ended up picking up the 10 and a 17 that was dual signed. The juggernaut was sadly gone by the time I returned. Excited to add some kirby sigs to the collection. Shout out to @Acuman for sending me some other examples and schooling me up on things to look for! eee91 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rexinnih Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 Hi all - wanted to add one more to the group to review. I have one that I previously posted above that I did get in person but this one I'm intrigued with because it's made out "To Paul" and that happens to be my name. On a small Captain America print and not a comic. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Zipper Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 RE: "To Paul Best Wishes"... I do not believe Jack signed this. Likely a response to a mail request in my opinion. eee91 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eee91 Posted October 20, 2021 Share Posted October 20, 2021 Agree with Mr. Zipper. It resembles Roz Kirby's proxy sig. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
956Ref Posted October 21, 2021 Author Share Posted October 21, 2021 @Acuman loves to analyze kirby sigs, so tagging him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acuman Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 @rexinnih @956Ref The attached examples have Best Wishes. The JSA approved is from Roz, in my opinion. The other three are from the King in person. In my opinion, the To Paul piece is a Roz proxy signature. Even without looking at the Kirby signature and just looking at the letter W in wishes you can see that both the JSA and Paul pieces have a hook on the W. The rest do not. Looking at the relationship between the height and transition of the letter b and y in Kirby, one can see that that Paul piece is also more similar to the JSA piece. There are other problems with the small K and big K that I dont want to go into detail because it could help forgers. Look at the angle of the B in Best. Compare that to the angle of J and K in each the examples. In the true signatures they are same angle as J and K. In the Paul and JSA piece, they are not. So the forger only focused on making the angle of J and K the same, but forgot to make the angle of the rest of the To Paul and Best, the same angle as the J and K. In many cases with dedications added, its easier to spot fakes. Therefore there are several inconsistencies that suggest it is a proxy. eee91, SpidersComics and davidtere 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rexinnih Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 Thank you all so much for the review and feedback! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
