Toth question 0

[drdroom]

A couple "Space Ghosts" animation pitch pieces sold pretty well in the June Heritage. They are signed by Sgroi and don't look like Toth (to me), so why were they sold as Toth/Sgroi? Did Alex do the cut-outs or the color or something?

[rjpb]

Because adding Toth's name increases their value?

[lb jefferies]

They definitely didn’t scream Toth to me, either. 

[Will_K]

Maybe only because there was some tangential relationship to "Space Ghost" which Alex Toth did have a hand in creating. 

It's possible someone simply googled "space ghosts" which came up with Toth's name.  Since the art was dated 1966 and Space Ghost also appeared in 1966, that someone (who maybe only had passing knowledge re: comics) decided to add Alex Toth to the auction description.  Do the characters look the same ??  No.  But you know, you google "space ghosts" and you have three of them over here... you have three of them over there... it's a match !!

HA descriptions have errors on occasion.  Some are more glaring than others.

There was a similar topic a few months ago:

https://www.cgccomics.com/boards/topic/470276-heritage-staff-vs-google-search/

[grapeape]

These men did work together before. Below is an example where Toth signs off on a piece solely his.... within the mix of a presentation piece. Both men did plenty of layouts but my guess is the watercolor or color oils crayon done by Sgori.

Toth signed 1st panel bottom left.

I am curious but we need more understand if their working arrangements. Hard to for sure say who did what or how much.

 

[Kent Mansley]

I could be misremembering, but I believe these sold a few years ago in another auction. Don't hold me to it, but I think in that auction they listed the three head shots as done by Toth and the rest by Sgroi. Sgroi was a strong artist but could not draw as well as Toth. Those head shots are definitely better than the figures on the boards. Seems potentially plausible to me.

These were also done in the early to mid-60's and Toth's animation style was still closer to the Space Angel series than what we remember him for. These head shots feel more like that than what we know ultimately became Space Ghost. In any case, it's impossible to know who did what with all this stuff unless it's signed. Multiple artists did drawings for the H&B show pitches back in the day including Ed Benedict, Bickenbach, Iwao Takamoto, Doug Wildey, Toth and more. 

As an aside, I used to know Tony Sgroi's daughter as she also worked in animation. Tony is mostly unknown but worked on so much stuff that we all grew up on. He was one of the most prolific animation artists at H&B for years. It's fun to see some of his art posted here. 

Edited July 7, 2021 by Kent Mansley

[Kent Mansley]

4 minutes ago, Kent Mansley said:

Multiple artists did drawings for the H&B show pitches back in the day including Ed Benedict, Bickenbach, Iwao Takamoto, Doug Wildey, Toth and more. 

 

For some reason, every time I submit the full name for the talented artist in bold above, the board edits out his first name. So I'll just say his full name was Richard Bickenbach, although he went by the shortened form of that name instead of the formal one.  

[grapeape]

On 7/6/2021 at 8:36 PM, Kent Mansley said:

For some reason, every time I submit the full name for the talented artist in bold above, the board edits out his first name. So I'll just say his full name was Richard Bickenbach, although he went by the shortened form of that name instead of the formal one.  

I learned that also but always forget. Richard” nickname is one of the 7 forbidden words? on the board.

[Rick2you2]

On 7/8/2021 at 8:05 PM, grapeape said:

I learned that also but always forget. Richard” nickname is one of the 7 forbidden words? on the board.

Which is why you could also call me Richard2you2, just like my mother, Mom2you2.

[Stefanomjr]

On 7/6/2021 at 11:36 PM, Kent Mansley said:

For some reason, every time I submit the full name for the talented artist in bold above, the board edits out his first name. So I'll just say his full name was Richard Bickenbach, although he went by the shortened form of that name instead of the formal one.  

Used to have tax clients (father and son), Richard Thomas Sr and Richard Thomas Jr........Jr had his first son and I asked his wife if they were looking to name the boy Richard Thomas III and she barked back - NO BECAUSE HE ISN"T GOING TO BE GOING BY THE NAME DICKIE. CGC seems to have the same reaction to the name 

[Rick2you2]

1 minute ago, Stefanomjr said:

Used to have tax clients (father and son), Richard Thomas Sr and Richard Thomas Jr........Jr had his first son and I asked his wife if they were looking to name the boy Richard Thomas III and she barked back - NO BECAUSE HE ISN"T GOING TO BE GOING BY THE NAME DICKIE. CGC seems to have the same reaction to the name 

Even worse, as a third he might be called "little Dickie".

[Will_K]

On 7/10/2021 at 6:28 AM, Rick2you2 said:

Which is why you could also call me Richard2you2, just like my mother, Mom2you2.

These names seem kind of... droid-ish.

[Stefanomjr]

6 hours ago, Rick2you2 said:

Even worse, as a third he might be called "little Dickie".

HA! Funny thing is that's what Jr went by!! (Totally forgot that till you said it)