Anyone watching Dueling Dealers tonight?
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91 posts in this topic

On 1/5/2023 at 1:53 AM, cloud cloddie said:

Just skimmed it to see all the ‘amazing’ art. Meh. I liked the Ms Marvel page and the Ralph Reese painting was cool. That was about it. (shrug)

I tend to look at art through the perspective of what makes good art great - if I only looked at art for the things I like, it'd be a pretty boring hobby.

A $350 Wonder Woman painting, $500 Clayton Crain and Mark Silvestri Wolverine sketches, a published page with Superman and Batman for $750, a John McCrea Red Sonja cover, a vintage Ernie Chan Batman pinup from the 70s, a Black Widow Art Deco cover, a David Finch pinup, a painted Duke Nukem cover, a Mike Vosburg cover, two unbelievable Bill Ward drawings, a 90's spidey action page, a Russ Heath Sgt Rock page, a published Savage Sword of Conan pinup, a Joe Simon painted published book cover, a 90's Fastner and Larsen published pinup, a couple of 1960s Archie complete stories, a Mike Perkins Avengers/X-Men cover, two 90's Spidey/Hulk fight pages, a Sal Buscema 70's Hulk fight page, not to mention the two pieces you posted - and that's a 'Meh' for your reaction? Man, I feel sorry for you.

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On 1/5/2023 at 4:54 AM, Dr. Balls said:

I tend to look at art through the perspective of what makes good art great - if I only looked at art for the things I like, it'd be a pretty boring hobby.

A $350 Wonder Woman painting, $500 Clayton Crain and Mark Silvestri Wolverine sketches, a published page with Superman and Batman for $750, a John McCrea Red Sonja cover, a vintage Ernie Chan Batman pinup from the 70s, a Black Widow Art Deco cover, a David Finch pinup, a painted Duke Nukem cover, a Mike Vosburg cover, two unbelievable Bill Ward drawings, a 90's spidey action page, a Russ Heath Sgt Rock page, a published Savage Sword of Conan pinup, a Joe Simon painted published book cover, a 90's Fastner and Larsen published pinup, a couple of 1960s Archie complete stories, a Mike Perkins Avengers/X-Men cover, two 90's Spidey/Hulk fight pages, a Sal Buscema 70's Hulk fight page, not to mention the two pieces you posted - and that's a 'Meh' for your reaction? Man, I feel sorry for you.

It didn’t seem like a ton sold before the recap, so clearly I’m not the only person that didn’t find everything amazing. And you can save your pity. (thumbsu

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On 1/5/2023 at 7:54 AM, Dr. Balls said:

I tend to look at art through the perspective of what makes good art great - if I only looked at art for the things I like, it'd be a pretty boring hobby.

A $350 Wonder Woman painting, $500 Clayton Crain and Mark Silvestri Wolverine sketches, a published page with Superman and Batman for $750, a John McCrea Red Sonja cover, a vintage Ernie Chan Batman pinup from the 70s, a Black Widow Art Deco cover, a David Finch pinup, a painted Duke Nukem cover, a Mike Vosburg cover, two unbelievable Bill Ward drawings, a 90's spidey action page, a Russ Heath Sgt Rock page, a published Savage Sword of Conan pinup, a Joe Simon painted published book cover, a 90's Fastner and Larsen published pinup, a couple of 1960s Archie complete stories, a Mike Perkins Avengers/X-Men cover, two 90's Spidey/Hulk fight pages, a Sal Buscema 70's Hulk fight page, not to mention the two pieces you posted - and that's a 'Meh' for your reaction? Man, I feel sorry for you.

If your collection averages less than $1,000 a page and you are buying Clayton Crain Wolvie because you will never be able to afford Jim Lee X-Men, then the offerings were good. If your basement contains $2M in framed Jim Lee art and you are a player on Ditko Spidey auctions, then meh is probably your evaluation. Simply a matter of perspective, with both opinions being legitimate.

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On 1/5/2023 at 10:17 AM, cloud cloddie said:

It didn’t seem like a ton sold before the recap, so clearly I’m not the only person that didn’t find everything amazing. And you can save your pity. (thumbsu

Yeah, sorry about that last sentence, it didn't come across very well. $9600 combined sales before the recap, that seemed to be a pretty good night compared to the last few I've watched. I did notice a lot of stuff for Mike must have sold on the recap because his site shows a lot of those pieces he had on the show as on hold/sold.

On 1/6/2023 at 7:11 AM, KirbyCollector said:

If your collection averages less than $1,000 a page and you are buying Clayton Crain Wolvie because you will never be able to afford Jim Lee X-Men, then the offerings were good. If your basement contains $2M in framed Jim Lee art and you are a player on Ditko Spidey auctions, then meh is probably your evaluation. Simply a matter of perspective, with both opinions being legitimate.

I can see that perspective, but I'd imagine if you have the wherewithal to own $2M in art - you'd also recognize well-balanced, good quality art at any price point - I mean, unless you're some crypto bro, a person doesn't start out buying $75k Jim Lee pieces. They start smaller and work their way up with lower price-point experiences. And I'll walk back my comment about the art being "Amazing" as that's a point of contention and personal interpretation. :foryou:

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On 1/6/2023 at 10:06 AM, Dr. Balls said:

Yeah, sorry about that last sentence, it didn't come across very well. $9600 combined sales before the recap, that seemed to be a pretty good night compared to the last few I've watched. I did notice a lot of stuff for Mike must have sold on the recap because his site shows a lot of those pieces he had on the show as on hold/sold.

I can see that perspective, but I'd imagine if you have the wherewithal to own $2M in art - you'd also recognize well-balanced, good quality art at any price point - I mean, unless you're some crypto bro, a person doesn't start out buying $75k Jim Lee pieces. They start smaller and work their way up with lower price-point experiences. And I'll walk back my comment about the art being "Amazing" as that's a point of contention and personal interpretation. :foryou:

After the kerfuffel here, I decided to watch about half that show. What was particularly interesting to me is what people are willing to do in front of a camera to get attention. What are those weird clips between offerings? Who makes them? Should I even ask why Bill is wearing a fake Viking hat?

As for the art, admittedly the cheaper offerings, I thought most of them were probably worth what was sought, and they did have some artists with real skills, even if I didn’t know who the hell they were. Perhaps they could create more interest if they gave more background on the artist and/or piece. There was also a cover for $1,000 I liked, but, not enough to regret missing the live show. Still, if I have time to kill, I would take another crack at it. I think they need to figure out if they want to put on an art show or a sketch comedy. Perhaps they can find an artist who would be willing to take a shpritz of seltzer in the face if they can’t sell one of his pieces.

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On 1/6/2023 at 12:27 PM, Rick2you2 said:

After the kerfuffel here, I decided to watch about half that show. What was particularly interesting to me is what people are willing to do in front of a camera to get attention. What are those weird clips between offerings? Who makes them? Should I even ask why Bill is wearing a fake Viking hat?

As for the art, admittedly the cheaper offerings, I thought most of them were probably worth what was sought, and they did have some artists with real skills, even if I didn’t know who the hell they were. Perhaps they could create more interest if they gave more background on the artist and/or piece. There was also a cover for $1,000 I liked, but, not enough to regret missing the live show. Still, if I have time to kill, I would take another crack at it. I think they need to figure out if they want to put on an art show or a sketch comedy. Perhaps they can find an artist who would be willing to take a shpritz of seltzer in the face if they can’t sell one of his pieces.

I only started watching a few months ago, and I'm guessing the show's irreverence and fun was there from the start? I don't know Mike or Anthony, but I'd also guess that out of all the well-known dealers out there, they perhaps have a more outgoing personality than most (assuming other dealers might be more reserved - I have met zero art dealers, so I am not qualified to go too deep on that).

I think they are filling in an area of selling comic art that is unique to their personalities, and it extends their own dealer brand. If someone else is doing a format like that, I haven't seen it. And you're right - it's an art show and a sketch show, but I think they've claimed their niché, and differing opinions aside, I think it works well for them.

If someone is looking for straight-forward presentations of art for sale, the kitschiness of DD may not resonate with them. I also think that lots of people buying art like to have some time to eschew a potential purchase. I like to research stuff before I buy. All the auction houses give you plenty of time to do your due diligence, DD is almost like a quick-draw - perhaps the majority of buyers are there looking for specific artists, rather than specific pieces? I would think if you are looking for a specific artist, you are more apt to quick buy a piece that you like regardless of it's publication history?

The one piece I bought from Mike happened to be an artist I was actively looking for (Al Rio) who drew a character I was looking for (Lady Death), and produced it in the time frame of my art focus (1990-early 2000s). However, I still spent most of the show trying to determine if it was a published piece (it wasn't) and made an offer accordingly during the recap - but it was fun to pull the trigger on the show.

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On 1/6/2023 at 2:27 PM, Rick2you2 said:

What are those weird clips between offerings? Who makes them? Should I even ask why Bill is wearing a fake Viking hat?

Bill is supposed to be Thor or BillaThor.  Thor is Bill's favorite character.  This is just the stuff that you'll learn from watching lots of episodes of DD.  For example, the Recap round has been renamed the Ragnarok Recap round.  Those clips (they call them memes) are what really make the show a lot longer than a plain claim show (e.g. the Dealmakers of Comic Art with Will, Bechara and Glen).  Also they make DD very production intensive since they have to record those memes individually and then create effects.  Since Bill used to live fairly close to Mike, they recorded a lot of things together.  But since Bill recently moved to Florida, I'm sure there will be less stuff with Mike.   Anthony and Sharon seem to enjoy recording stuff.  When you join the channel ($4.99 / month), you're ID'd by the Thor's hammer in the chat (different colors indicate how long you've been a member).  Bill also plays Billigan.  This is due to Mike calling him "little buddy" on occasion (see also the Gilligan's Island themed episode of DD) in earlier episodes. 

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I see Anthony is having a special one on Monday in which any “reasonable” offer will be considered. That reminds me of a quote in my law school textbook in torts from a 1923 Harvard Law Review article pointing out that it was called the “reasonable man” standard (back then) because there was no such thing as a “reasonable” woman. I wonder what a “reasonable” price might be?

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That could be one crazy episode.  There was a recent episode where Anthony was doing "end of season" deals on unsold art from previous DD's.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b74VnICzbWw  You can probably use that episode to get an idea on the deals.  During regular DD episodes, given enough time to work a deal, Anthony can come down quite a bit in price.

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