Bob Kane Original Art Opinions/Help Wanted (ADVICE GIVEN, THANK YOU). 1 1

[Twanj]

On 7/19/2023 at 10:50 AM, Andahaion said:

I second this.  Unless you already have some friends in this hobby, it's super important (in my opinion) to develop a relationship with someone(s) who understands the hobby and to which you can go to for anything.  I didn't have anyone like that until this board and there's one individual in particular where we text back and forth all the time about all things OA related whether it's auction results, tracking pages, discussing deals, reminding each other of art drops, bringing pages to each other's attention, etc.  Very beneficial.  

Agreed!

Always good to have a second opinion and sounding board.

[Bronty]

On 7/18/2023 at 8:23 PM, iancomics said:

Hello, yes, that was certainly me. I was able to get in contact with one of the other dealers at the show who was able to forward my message to the dealer, and the situation will be sorted out.

I'm glad to hear that.   

I hope your next purchase goes much smoother.    Unfortunately as this thread is highlighting, with Kane, a lot of people prefer to just stay away.    

Call this a win if you get a refund and find something you might like better.    

If there's one thing I'd suggest while you're new, its buy published pages only.     Takes 95% of your potential problems out of the mix.

Edited July 19, 2023 by Bronty

[Rick2you2]

On 7/19/2023 at 1:00 PM, The Voord said:

That's another potential disaster for the OP!  Larry Stroman anyone?

Yes, well, commissions from reliable sources. I have, in the past, commissioned artists at shows. The really reliable ones don't ask for money up front. On the other hand, I have also encountered some who don't ask and still don't produce. 

[Will_K]

And sadly, paying an artist in advance does not guarantee the art's delivery / quality... nor a refund of the payment.  Most of these artists are widely reported / discussed.

Also, OP may find topics mentioning alternate versions of covers for sale (with logos and the works).  The art may be legitimate but the "alternate version" story may not be.  I will shy away from that stuff mainly because unless you examine the art directly, you won't know how logos, etc are attached. 

[pemart1966]

On 7/19/2023 at 2:38 PM, Bronty said:

I'm glad to hear that.   

I hope your next purchase goes much smoother.    Unfortunately as this thread is highlighting, with Kane, a lot of people prefer to just stay away.    

Call this a win if you get a refund and find something you might like better.    

If there's one thing I'd suggest while you're new, its buy published pages only.     Takes 95% of your potential problems out of the mix.

Buying published pages will not help you wrt Bob Kane.

[Bronty]

On 7/19/2023 at 8:21 PM, pemart1966 said:

Buying published pages will not help you wrt Bob Kane.

yes it will.  it will keep you away from anything claiming to be kane  

[The Voord]

On 7/20/2023 at 3:42 PM, Bronty said:

yes it will.  it will keep you away from anything claiming to be kane  

Probably the best you could hope for is Kane signing another artist's drawings . . . and even then, Kane probably had someone else signing the originals for him!

[pemart1966]

On 7/20/2023 at 10:42 AM, Bronty said:

yes it will.  it will keep you away from anything claiming to be kane  

Kane's signature appeared for decades on splash pages of stories that he had nothing to do with.

Bottom line?  Even a published page with Kane's signature on it is no guarantee that he had any involvement with it.

Edited July 21, 2023 by pemart1966

[ixng]

.

Edited July 25, 2023 by iancomics

[Bronty]

On 7/21/2023 at 12:58 PM, pemart1966 said:

Kane's signature appeared for decades on splash pages of stories that he had nothing to do with.

Bottom line?  Even a published page with Kane's signature on it is no guarantee that he had any involvement with it.

That's a good thing to point out.

I was referring to staying away from unpublished pages or drawings like the one the OP is considering when you're new to keep you away from outright fakes.      That does not imply throwing attribution of published pieces out of the window, but your point is relevant since we are talking about Kane. 

Edited July 26, 2023 by Bronty

[delekkerste]

On 7/17/2023 at 4:01 PM, iancomics said:

Something interesting is that on the back of the paper the sketch is on, it says "Whitney Museum of American Art", which Bob Kane has had his art on display there previously, making me think that maybe he did it while there. Using the font the text was printed in, I can determine it's Arial font, putting the piece likely being made in the 80s. How does the piece look? Any immediate issues found? Authentic? Opinions appreciated.

Sorry to heap more doubt and bad news on this situation, but, the Whitney Museum has only been at its 99 Gansevoort Street location since 2015. Before then, it was located on the Upper East Side on Madison Ave., so, that stamp on the back is 8 years old at most. 

- Gene (Founding Member of the "new" Whitney Museum)

Edited July 26, 2023 by delekkerste

[grapeape]

On 7/26/2023 at 10:26 AM, delekkerste said:

Sorry to heap more doubt and bad news on this situation, but, the Whitney Museum has only been at its 99 Gansevoort Street location since 2015. Before then, it was located on the Upper East Side on Madison Ave., so, that stamp on the back is 8 years old at most. 

- Gene (Founding Member of the "new" Whitney Museum)

https://www.ebay.com/itm/186003188063?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=aALt04eSRsy&sssrc=2349624&ssuid=huUHVhc0Tca&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY
 

More museum stamps on an eBay auction ending today. On the provenance the seller starts out with I was told...... Dead giveaway that 90% "Bob Kane" art has shaky provenance. 😔 No one really knows what they have!

 

 

[The Voord]

On 7/26/2023 at 10:17 PM, grapeape said:

No one really knows what they have!

 

 

More a case of what they haven't got!

[Will_K]

On 7/26/2023 at 5:17 PM, grapeape said:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/186003188063?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=aALt04eSRsy&sssrc=2349624&ssuid=huUHVhc0Tca&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

Steamer truck stamps!!!  The piece sure made the rounds.    For future reference:

Edited July 26, 2023 by Will_K

[delekkerste]

On 7/26/2023 at 5:17 PM, grapeape said:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/186003188063?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=aALt04eSRsy&sssrc=2349624&ssuid=huUHVhc0Tca&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY
 

More museum stamps on an eBay auction ending today. On the provenance the seller starts out with I was told...... Dead giveaway that 90% "Bob Kane" art has shaky provenance. 😔 No one really knows what they have!

 

 

"Museum of the City of New York - CERTIFIED"!!! 

What in the AF...there is no reason for a piece like this to have gone around multiple museums and galleries who all decided to stamp the back of it. 

As for the OP's piece, I really don't know when the Whitney would have had an occasion to have a "Bob Kane" Batman piece in their possession, much less have cause to stamp the back of it for some unfathomable reason. And sometime 2015-present no less. More likely that a forger wanted to create the illusion that this piece was somehow displayed at the Whitney at some point back in the day and was too dumb to realize that the museum wasn't always at its new location.

The whole museum stamp thing just smells of some forger's trademark. 

[buttock]

On 7/26/2023 at 8:47 PM, delekkerste said:

"Museum of the City of New York - CERTIFIED"!!! 

What in the AF...there is no reason for a piece like this to have gone around multiple museums and galleries who all decided to stamp the back of it. 

As for the OP's piece, I really don't know when the Whitney would have had an occasion to have a "Bob Kane" Batman piece in their possession, much less have cause to stamp the back of it for some unfathomable reason. And sometime 2015-present no less. More likely that a forger wanted to create the illusion that this piece was somehow displayed at the Whitney at some point back in the day and was too dumb to realize that the museum wasn't always at its new location.

The whole museum stamp thing just smells of some forger's trademark. 

Yup.  It's like a certificate of authenticity.  So many of them are made after the fact to try and pass a fake.  

[grapeape]

On 7/26/2023 at 7:47 PM, delekkerste said:

"Museum of the City of New York - CERTIFIED"!!! 

What in the AF...there is no reason for a piece like this to have gone around multiple museums and galleries who all decided to stamp the back of it. 

As for the OP's piece, I really don't know when the Whitney would have had an occasion to have a "Bob Kane" Batman piece in their possession, much less have cause to stamp the back of it for some unfathomable reason. And sometime 2015-present no less. More likely that a forger wanted to create the illusion that this piece was somehow displayed at the Whitney at some point back in the day and was too dumb to realize that the museum wasn't always at its new location.

The whole museum stamp thing just smells of some forger's trademark. 

Sadly someone paid $361 for all those stamps. And once it sinks in, the duped will not eat the mistake. They'll pass it on, to some other hopeful dupe, maybe with another I was told....see museum COA on back.

☠️ 

 

 

[MIL0S]

current Heritage weekly has a Bob Kane Batman sketch: 

https://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/sketches/bob-kane-batman-and-robin-sketch-original-art-undated-/a/322331-46110.s?ic4=GalleryView-Thumbnail-071515

 

[Bronty]

On 7/27/2023 at 7:52 PM, MIL0S said:

current Heritage weekly has a Bob Kane Batman sketch: 

https://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/sketches/bob-kane-batman-and-robin-sketch-original-art-undated-/a/322331-46110.s?ic4=GalleryView-Thumbnail-071515

 

thoughts?   looks appropriately aged, but on the other hand, the lines are where they should be. 

[Will_K]

For how it appears and its size (about a 5 x 7 index card), it looks "nice".  But who can really be sure.  Also, if you remove it from the frame, maybe there's a stamp on the back that says, "If found, please return to the Louvre". 

Edited July 29, 2023 by Will_K