Stan, Jack, and Steve - The 1960's (1964) The Slow Build 5 5

[Mmehdy]

On 4/14/2024 at 10:09 AM, Dr. Haydn said:

FF is about to enter its best 3 or 4 years.

I think the annuals 1 and 2 we fantastic buys and I agree....the best is yet to come

[Prince Namor]

ON NEWSSTANDS JULY 1964

Fantastic Four #31 - Kirby, Lee, Stone, Rosen

This one is non-stop from beginning to end!

Part ONE

[Prince Namor]

ON NEWSSTANDS JULY 1964

Fantastic Four #31 - Kirby, Lee, Stone, Rosen

This one is non-stop from beginning to end!

Part TWO

[Dr. Haydn]

On 4/14/2024 at 6:31 PM, The humble Watcher lurking said:

Kirby art was like cinematic like a movie , but you still have those guys that say it was all  Stan dialogue that brought it to another level. One guy drew the whole thing and other guy came in and basically copy and paste and got all the credit. 

Kirby (with Lee) certainly kicked it up a notch with this story. It must have been fun to watch this comic hit its stride in real time in the mid-60s.

[Hepcat]

On 4/13/2024 at 7:29 PM, The humble Watcher lurking said:

🤔Kirby art was like cinematic like a movie....

Well I certainly wouldn't pay to see any movie in which the leading ladies looked anything like the ones Jack Kirby drew:

My word! Invisible Girl looks like a hippo on the lower left!

That nurse looks like a hunchback!

Yes, Kirby was a great storyteller. But Stan Lee should have sent him back to art school for anatomy lessons.

[Dr. Haydn]

On 4/15/2024 at 10:50 AM, Hepcat said:

Well I certainly wouldn't pay to see any movie in which the leading ladies looked anything like the ones Jack Kirby drew:

My word! Invisible Girl looks like a hippo on the lower left!

That nurse looks like a hunchback!

Yes, Kirby was a great storyteller. But Stan Lee should have sent him back to art school for anatomy lessons.

To my eyes, Romita, Colan, and (even) Heck were better than Kirby at drawing women. Still, that's only part of any artist's job.

[The humble Watcher lurking]

On 4/15/2024 at 11:50 AM, Hepcat said:

in which the leading ladies looked anything like the ones Jack Kirby drew:

@Hepcat you know I love you,  but Jack Kirby says to Stan Lee hold my beer. lol.

[The humble Watcher lurking]

@Dr. Haydn

Isn`t very interesting here we are after over 60 plus years still talking about the Stan Lee, Steve Ditko and Jack Kirby dynamics. I like Curt Swan and Mort Weisinger, but no one cares to talk about those dynamics. Stan, Jack and Ditko did something special. 

[Dr. Haydn]

On 4/17/2024 at 5:29 PM, The humble Watcher lurking said:

@Dr. Haydn

Isn`t very interesting here we are after over 60 plus years still talking about the Stan Lee, Steve Ditko and Jack Kirby dynamics. I like Curt Swan and Mort Weisinger, but no one cares to talk about those dynamics. Stan, Jack and Ditko did something special. 

Absolutely!

[Dr. Haydn]

On 4/17/2024 at 5:24 PM, The humble Watcher lurking said:

@Hepcat you know I love you,  but Jack Kirby says to Stan Lee hold my beer. lol.

This splash illustrates the difference a great inker can make on the final product. Chic Stone was good over Kirby's pencils. Mike Royer was on a whole 'nother level.

[Zonker]

ORIGINS OF MARVEL COMICS to Get 50th Anniversary Re-Release

 

@Prince Namor, I'll be looking forward to reading your new forward to this re-released edition.  

 

[Dr. Haydn]

On 4/19/2024 at 8:16 AM, Zonker said:

ORIGINS OF MARVEL COMICS to Get 50th Anniversary Re-Release

 

@Prince Namor, I'll be looking forward to reading your new forward to this re-released edition.  

 

Oh, that would be great!😁

[Prince Namor]

On 4/19/2024 at 8:16 PM, Zonker said:

ORIGINS OF MARVEL COMICS to Get 50th Anniversary Re-Release

 

@Prince Namor, I'll be looking forward to reading your new forward to this re-released edition.  

 

I could (and should) write a book on just the factual errors in this!

[Prince Namor]

ON NEWSSTANDS JULY 1964

Tales of Suspense #58 - Lee, Heck, Ayers, and Rosen

Lee calls himself a 'prolific script writer' despite the fact that a) he doesn't write any scripts and b) this story is hardly prolific. Kirby had a way of making these fight/teamups work... it makes sense because he was writing AND drawing them at the same time. 

This story is... not on par.

[Prince Namor]

ON NEWSSTANDS JULY 1964

Tales of Suspense #58 - Lee, Heck, Ayers, and Rosen

So, I'm going affectionately call this issue, 'Iron Man is a Dunce' (i.e. an excuse for poor writing)'.

#1: Iron Man HEARS Kraven talking to someone, even ANSWERS what he's saying to them, yet fails to have any clue that someone else was there.

Maybe when Stan made the claim that he was writing comics for a more adult crowd, instead of 'adult' he meant 'A DOLT'. 

And why... as a spy, with no real SUPER power, does he want to fight Iron Man anyway? What does Chameleon gain by that?

Edited Friday at 07:47 AM by Prince Namor

[Prince Namor]

ON NEWSSTANDS JULY 1964

Tales of Suspense #58 - Lee, Heck, Ayers, and Rosen

Question for Iron Man experts... this whole, 'Milly the Model/Patsy Walker' goofiness between Pepper and Happy... Was this the extent of it in the series? Did either of these characters grow beyond Lee's bland characterization? To me, reading this, these two are so boring and unfunny, try as he might to make them that more than that... I know Iron Man was for most of it's first 20 years, one of Marvel's least successful superhero titles, and I would suspect these two and their uninteresting interactions might have had something to do with it...

[Prince Namor]

ON NEWSSTANDS JULY 1964

Tales of Suspense #58 - Lee, Heck, Ayers, and Rosen

Oh for god's sake... more lazy writing...

[Prince Namor]

ON NEWSSTANDS JULY 1964

Tales of Suspense #58 - Lee, Heck, Ayers, and Rosen

Wait... WHAT? He knows ALL of Cap's memories from that machine? That means he knows Iron Man is Tony Stark. And Cap is Steve Rogers. And all the security codes to Avengers Mansion. Is that what he's after.

LOL. No.

[Prince Namor]

ON NEWSSTANDS JULY 1964

Tales of Suspense #58 - Lee, Heck, Ayers, and Rosen

Page 6 panel 3 Cap says, in flashback, "But by then my head had cleared... The vapors had worn off... and I quickly made my move!" but in the NEXT panel, he says, "Still weak as a result of the strange experiment" but then jumps out a SIXTH STORY WINDOW, despite the fact he can't fly, because... "It's certain death to remain there!"

MORE than jumping out the window? I only saw two people, and you knocked their heads together life Larry and Curly, leaving only the Chameleon, who is just a regular guy. A weakened Cap could knock the Chameleon's head off. More bad writing.

Then in the next panel Cap says, "If the Chameleon should take my place in the Avengers, unsuspected... ANYTHING can happen!!"

You think THAT is what his purpose is? OMG, this is NOT written for adults.

[Prince Namor]

ON NEWSSTANDS JULY 1964

Tales of Suspense #58 - Lee, Heck, Ayers, and Rosen

"Don't know where to reach Thor... or Giant-Man..."

You DON'T???

Doesn't Giant-Man have a small, easy to get to LAB, as opposed to Iron Man in this huge Stark Industries complex that's under heavy guard...

And isn't every other issue of the Avengers, where they send out a call to Thor or Iron Man or Giant-Man to have them meet at HQ...?