The X-men: Deadly Genesis Mystery Villains is...(speculation/possible spoiler)

[joe_collector]

Additionally, you are speaking about something you've heard about. Not something you experienced. It just doesn't hold much weight when it's through 3rd, 4th, and 5th party information.

 

Don't worry, I find a way to read most of this bizarre retcon stuff. I've read the horrific Sins Past, slogged through absolutely terrrible "Black Captain America" schlock, read Origin, etc. and I will get around to this latest BS.

[drice6900]

JC won't be responding for a week:

 

JC Strike

 

Why not?

 

Sorry Joe, thought someone said you got a week's vacation for your strike.

[fastballspecial]

Additionally, you are speaking about something you've heard about. Not something you experienced. It just doesn't hold much weight when it's through 3rd, 4th, and 5th party information.

 

Don't worry, I find a way to read most of this bizarre retcon stuff. I've read the horrific Sins Past, slogged through absolutely terrrible "Black Captain America" schlock, read Origin, etc. and I will get around to this latest BS.

 

Your right all the above stuff was bad. Sins of the Past was the only one of the 3 that even close to being decent. Brubaker's X-men and Captain America arent to be grouped with those other books. They are at least so far written very well and the art at least the X-men art is above average and well above most modern books.

But by the same token I can pick all types of 70s and 80s books that were not only bad, but horrible. This book isnt even close so far. I am not saying the ending might blow the series, but currently its one of the top books written for a company whose average books is worthy of toilet paper only.

 

I too like the Bronze/Copper Age much better then today's books, but unlike you I recognize rare talent when I see it. Brubaker's got it. Pair him with A grade artist and you will have a blockbuster. Hell I hope DC signs him soon as I only read one monthly Marvel currently anyway.

[joe_collector]

I too like the Bronze/Copper Age much better then today's books, but unlike you I recognize rare talent when I see it.

 

That's not it at all; I just prefer literature and entertainment that looks FORWARD rather than BACKWARD. Instead of shuffling through old BA What If's for inspiration and retconning a story that was written 30+ years ago, why not create something new?

 

I don't care how talented someone is, if they're pumping out reheated leftovers from 1975. I like new rather than rehashed retcon any day of the week. And it's not just comics.

 

For example, I hated that retcon "prequel" episode of The Shield, detested it actually, as it had the same lame hass "let's rework the past" kind of fanboy angle. I want to see the story and characters move forward.

 

I don't live in the past, and that's a big reason why I don't buy Moderns.

[Illiterati-migration]

I too like the Bronze/Copper Age much better then today's books, but unlike you I recognize rare talent when I see it.

 

That's not it at all; I just prefer literature and entertainment that looks FORWARD rather than BACKWARD. Instead of shuffling through old BA What If's for inspiration and retconning a story that was written 30+ years ago, why not create something new?

 

I don't care how talented someone is, if they're pumping out reheated leftovers from 1975. I like new rather than rehashed retcon any day of the week. And it's not just comics.

 

For example, I hated that retcon "prequel" episode of The Shield, detested it actually, as it had the same lame hass "let's rework the past" kind of fanboy angle. I want to see the story and characters move forward.

 

I don't live in the past, and that's a big reason why I don't buy Moderns.

 

I agree, Joe. But, this book, to this point, is a little different. They aren't necessarily changing the past. Brubaker is looking deeper into the "text", if you will, and he's reading between the lines. There's no significant changes to the canon as yet, and I don't suspect he'll be making any at all.

 

I think you might enjoy the story when/if you get around to reading it. It's written with that same sense of urgency that is present in the more epic BA X-Men stories (and that is so sorely missing in ALL of the modern books). And sure, it's providing a nasty turn for Professor X, but as I said before, his character doesn't really make sense as a "gentle, loving instructor". It's good to see the dark underbelly of his motivation.

 

There's a reason why supergeniuses are so danged evil!

[otherworldcomics]

Additionally, you are speaking about something you've heard about. Not something you experienced. It just doesn't hold much weight when it's through 3rd, 4th, and 5th party information.

 

Don't worry, I find a way to read most of this bizarre retcon stuff. I've read the horrific Sins Past, slogged through absolutely terrrible "Black Captain America" schlock, read Origin, etc. and I will get around to this latest BS.

 

Your right all the above stuff was bad. Sins of the Past was the only one of the 3 that even close to being decent. Brubaker's X-men and Captain America arent to be grouped with those other books. They are at least so far written very well and the art at least the X-men art is above average and well above most modern books.

But by the same token I can pick all types of 70s and 80s books that were not only bad, but horrible. This book isnt even close so far. I am not saying the ending might blow the series, but currently its one of the top books written for a company whose average books is worthy of toilet paper only.

 

I too like the Bronze/Copper Age much better then today's books, but unlike you I recognize rare talent when I see it. Brubaker's got it. Pair him with A grade artist and you will have a blockbuster. Hell I hope DC signs him soon as I only read one monthly Marvel currently anyway.

 

Though I have to agree on the "Sins of the Past" storyline, I have to disagree with the "Truth" series (Black Captain America) sense this falls perfectly in line with what has been historically done in America. So it was definitely a plausible story line and still didn't change the story of the Steve Rogers Captain America at all. Origins was okay. It was an interesting story. And it still leaves open a lot as to what happened to Logan inbetween then and when he first appears in Hulk 180. I mean, it wasn't a retcon as others have complained about since his origin was never written before. This series so far has been pretty good.

[Hobgoblin]

I mean, that's like stopping TV watching in 1990 and then turning on the TV today and being mad cause the shows aren't the same as The Wonder Years.

 

 

That was awesome. Why didn't I see that before.

[joe_collector]

I agree, Joe. But, this book, to this point, is a little different. They aren't necessarily changing the past. Brubaker is looking deeper into the "text", if you will, and he's reading between the lines.

 

Funny, that's what Joe Q and JMS said about turning Gwen into a wanton 'ho.

 

No matter what way you look at it, this is still looking back at a comic event that was written over 30 years ago, rather than creating something new for 2006. I just don't go for that kind of "back to the past" kind of stuff.

[Hobgoblin]

I don't live in the past, and that's a big reason why I don't buy Moderns.

 

Then someone forgot to tell you that this is a MODERN COMICS area of the boards. You might want to spend your time elsewhere.

[joe_collector]

I mean, that's like stopping TV watching in 1990 and then turning on the TV today and being mad cause the shows aren't the same as The Wonder Years.

 

 

That was awesome. Why didn't I see that before.

 

And the comparison couldn't be farther off if you triend. As I stated earlier:

 

Not at all, it's actually like turning on the TV and seeing "Wonder Years 2" where they retcon Kevin and Paul into having a hidden homosexual relationship, Winnie is sleeping with Mr and Mrs Arnold, Wayne is a serial killer, and Winnie's brother (who died in Viet Nam) comes back as a bad guy.

 

That's Marvel comics in 2006.

[Lazyboy]

I don't live in the past, and that's a big reason why I don't buy Moderns.

 

How about this one?

[joe_collector]

I don't live in the past, and that's a big reason why I don't buy Moderns.

 

Then someone forgot to tell you that this is a MODERN COMICS area of the boards.

 

Anyone else see the irony in the above exchange? I get more "new story ideas" out of buying back issues.

[Hobgoblin]

I mean, that's like stopping TV watching in 1990 and then turning on the TV today and being mad cause the shows aren't the same as The Wonder Years.

 

 

That was awesome. Why didn't I see that before.

 

And the comparison couldn't be farther off if you triend. As I stated earlier:

 

Not at all, it's actually like turning on the TV and seeing "Wonder Years 2" where they retcon Kevin and Paul into having a hidden homosexual relationship, Winnie is sleeping with Mr and Mrs Arnold, Wayne is a serial killer, and Winnie's brother (who died in Viet Nam) comes back as a bad guy.

 

That's Marvel comics in 2006.

 

Oh I saw that post too. It didn't change how I felt about the first post.

 

Now that I think about it; I think I saw those episodes of the Wonder Years. They were a better than the original.

[Hobgoblin]

I don't live in the past, and that's a big reason why I don't buy Moderns.

 

Then someone forgot to tell you that this is a MODERN COMICS area of the boards.

 

Anyone else see the irony in the above exchange? I get more "new story ideas" out of buying back issues.

 

Say what?

 

You don't buy moderns, so I'm suggesting you leave the Modern Boards and never return. It would let everyone live better lives.

[joe_collector]

Oh I saw that post too. It didn't change how I felt about the first post.

 

Ummmm, yeah. I am going to assume you actually did not think before writing that.

 

If I am a longtime comic reader, who stopped in the 1980's/90's and come back to Gwen Stacy as a 'ho giving birth to Norman Osborne's twins, A black Captain America, Wolverine with bone claws and his real name being Jimmy Howlett , the Spider-man totem retcon, pulling a "new dead team of X-Men" out of a writer's butt, and all manner of other bizarre "look to the past" storytelling...

 

How is that even remotely the same as screaming that TV is no longer the same as the Wonder Years.

 

The only valid comparison would be if the Wonder Years totally retconned their characters in a "new series".

[joe_collector]

You don't buy moderns, so I'm suggesting you leave the Modern Boards and never return. It would let everyone live better lives.

 

I was referring to the "I don't live in the past..." - "so don't post in the Modern section" exchange. Hilarious when you think about it.

 

If comics were actually moving forward, rather than just regurgitating old Bronze Age stories and characters, then I should never even have an interest in posting here.

[Hobgoblin]

If I am a longtime comic reader, who stopped in the 1980's/90's and come back to Gwen Stacy as a 'ho giving birth to Norman Osborne's twins, A black Captain America, Wolverine with bone claws and his real name being Jimmy Howlett , the Spider-man totem retcon, pulling a "new dead team of X-Men" out of a writer's butt, and all manner of other bizarre "look to the past" storytelling...

 

 

I am a reader who read mid-80's to mid-90's book, stopped reading, and then came back in the last couple of years.

[Hobgoblin]

You don't buy moderns, so I'm suggesting you leave the Modern Boards and never return. It would let everyone live better lives.

 

I was referring to the "I don't live in the past..." - "so don't post in the Modern section" exchange. Hilarious when you think about it.

 

And yet you're still here posting because of something someone said last week.

[Illiterati-migration]

I agree, Joe. But, this book, to this point, is a little different. They aren't necessarily changing the past. Brubaker is looking deeper into the "text", if you will, and he's reading between the lines.

 

Funny, that's what Joe Q and JMS said about turning Gwen into a wanton 'ho.

 

No matter what way you look at it, this is still looking back at a comic event that was written over 30 years ago, rather than creating something new for 2006. I just don't go for that kind of "back to the past" kind of stuff.

 

So, where should the line be drawn for "back to the past"? I mean, they're essentially mining FOR continuity at this point. It's a shame about Gwen, but the story wasn't entirely out of the realm of possibility, was it? She was treated as some "sacred cow" by previous generations of comic readers... most of whom do not even buy modern books.

 

But I digress. I think Brubaker is looking backward to move forward. He's advancing the "Professor Xavier is a megalomaniacal jerk" story by employing pieces from his history... same as you would in many, many, many other narrative forms. This is backstory. His backstory. Who's to say that ALL of Xavier's story had been told up to this point? There is no LINE of continuity that cannot be crossed. You can't say, "Well, that wasn't established before 1987, so you can't move the character in that direction."

 

I guess I'm just saying that none of these characters are static. Retcons are one thing, what is being done here is another.

[blutobc]

I mean, that's like stopping TV watching in 1990 and then turning on the TV today and being mad cause the shows aren't the same as The Wonder Years.

 

 

That was awesome. Why didn't I see that before.

 

And the comparison couldn't be farther off if you triend. As I stated earlier:

 

Not at all, it's actually like turning on the TV and seeing "Wonder Years 2" where they retcon Kevin and Paul into having a hidden homosexual relationship, Winnie is sleeping with Mr and Mrs Arnold, Wayne is a serial killer, and Winnie's brother (who died in Viet Nam) comes back as a bad guy.

 

That's Marvel comics in 2006.

 

I've waited to see if anyone else wanted to point out actual events, but they haven't so here we go.

 

The New Wonder Years aka 2006 TV... Kevin of Wonder Years is on a new sitcom called "crumbs" where he IS GAY. This week's episode had him teamed up with some other previous saturday night must see TV actor from the 90s(can't remember his name).

And I think that the last year or so Winnie came out of acting limbo and portrayed a hooker or some other type of wayward gal.

I don't know about the rest of the crew....and maybe I'm afraid to know too.....