Are OA prices out of control? 7 7

[Pedro Cruz]

On 6/18/2024 at 7:05 PM, MyNameIsLegion said:

Are we overlooking the fact that at a charity auction the entire point is to nudge up the price? To cajole, dare, collude, pool, whatever it takes to keep the bidding up? All other side motives, real or perceived are irrelevant. If the birther contingent were more upset they didn’t win whatever the hell it was for their perceived FMV so they can invest, flip, hype or whatever seem to have given themselves away as Felix correctly stated. It’s about the money, not the art, much less the charitable cause. This is not a good look for you guys in the art community as you so often like to say in PMs when you think someone spoke out of line.  

Exactly.  Btw, it happened 3 times that night, which Xatari never called out, he simply made a mention that it had happened, didn’t even add details.  Then one of the guilty parties started justifying the bad behavior with shady reasoning and accusations.  
 

If it’s for charity, let it go.  Most of the people in the room were hoping to bid on art they couldn’t afford otherwise.  Who cares if a commission that was donated goes for high or low.  
It’s Charity!!!! No one is going to demand that the artist charge less.  
 

in fact many pieces went for twice or 3 times what artist charge for their commissions, for example Dekal only charges $700 and yet his piece went for $1,800 (because it’s for charity) and no one shilled that one, it was fair and square.  Just let the system work itself.  

[LamboLGM]

On 6/18/2024 at 1:49 PM, dinesh_s said:

First, I was there, this is not what happened.

Second, Whatever the narrative, you should know better than to bid on pieces from artists you represent. It's a bad look in any circumstance and erodes customer trust. 

Dinesh_s:

You were there? Really? Were you sitting on my lap looking into my smartphone when Albert texted me? Were you also there with me and Shelton Drum and his employee as we entered in Albert's credit card information to pay for the piece? Were you also with me as I frantically tried to figure out with Shelton on how the hell was I going to get this humongous 20x30 painting back to Albert on a Sunday when FedEx is closed? You may have been in the room but that does not mean you know what the happened. I don't know you well but I do know what you look like and you weren't anywhere around me when Albert texted me. So I'm not sure on what basis are you and Xatari making these reckless accusations about me. 

You don't even know me. I am just a collector. I'm not a dealer nor someone with a world famous collection. I have zero ownership in any dealer or entity that sells or deals art. I have been a collector of comic art since 1987. I've been around for most of the growth and development of this hobby. Maybe not Pete Koch OG but maybe in the wave after that.  I've seen it all. I've heard about all the various fads (some may say scams) and goings on that my collecting brethren have engaged in like this or that hot artist, indy boon, weird sketch themes, getting OA published pages colored, first appearance, and lately mystery sketches (I'm still not sure how that works!). I've never indulged in them but at least I understood why someone would. This whole shilling up a piece and then actually winning it is a new one on me. Why would anyone do that? and why would you and Xatari so quickly think that I would engage in this? Like who thinks of this stuff??? Yes, I am friends with Felix and help him at shows. I am also friends with Albert and help him at shows. Other reps I've helped at shows include Spencer Beck at the Artists Choice and Jason Schachter at Essential Sequential. I am friendly with and respected by most dealers because I do what I promise. A lifetime of paying on time and honoring my commitments has afforded me that respect and trust. This wasn't even the first time this year I've helped a friend bid on something at an auction he couldn't be at. Don't we all do that? I don't get why, unless you two have an agenda with Felix, you would bend over backwards and accuse me of being dishonest about a simple proxy bid that we all have done for friends. 

I don't have anything but my reputation. Many of the posters here know me. They know I'm honest to a fault sometimes (ok always) people off with my opinion. For you two to go around making statements like "I was there, this is not what happened" is reckless since you were NOT there with me when I was asked by Albert on my phone to bid. I was the one who did the auction bidding. I was the one who went to the table to pay. Nobody else. Felix had nothing to do with it at any point other than posting it on IG before the auction. And now he's being accused of something only because I'm his friend. and THAT is really awful . 

I can back up what I'm saying with my phone text records and both Albert and Heroescon have receipts of payment. I also have various witnesses who can attest to various parts of the events as things unfolded down to finally finding an art mule who drove to bring the art back for him to give to Albert at another con later this month. None of this was planned. If it were, I'd have been far better prepared. 

Lambo

(sorry guys, I've been off here for so long that I forgot my old log in, feel free to msg me and i"ll insult you so you can be sure it's me). ;)

Edited June 19 by LamboLGM

[exitmusicblue]

Are we dealing with burners in here, too?

Some CAF burners are common knowledge by now, sadly.  Having dealt with one myself.

[Real Elijah Snow]

The Heroes art auction is NOT for charity overall. This year they made mention that certain pieces were being auctioned for charity, but it was just a few that I saw. Not sure if the DWJ piece was for charity or not. 

[LamboLGM]

On 6/18/2024 at 7:38 PM, Pedro Cruz said:

What is hilarious to me is that no one called you out.  Yet, you felt you had to add all this justifications for your actions.   BTW, I saw you walk to the underbidder and heard your BS answer.  Also you were standing right next to the winner the whole time.  
 

If the shoe Fits!!! 

Ooooh another "I was there" guy. Felix was not standing next to me. Why? because I was sitting in the row with empty seats next to me. Felix was nowhere near me. In fact, I was wondering where in tarnation was he while I was bidding. 

[Aaron]

On 6/18/2024 at 6:53 PM, Nexus said:

Interesting. Who was this "someone" who came down the aisle and said $14K would win it? That didn't come from me and also, $14K wouldn't have done it. So this is total fantasy.

It was true cause I was sitting there also 🤣

[Bronty]

On 6/18/2024 at 4:03 PM, Michael Browning said:

Which dealer are you working for? Because, man, you’re fierce and steadfast in your defense of them. Someone struck and nerve with the Godfather and sent you out to take care of business for the family. 😃😉

What can I say, I don’t want to sleep with the fishes!

My main point is that, as blazingbob said on these forums 10+ years ago, there’s barely even such a thing as a dealer anymore.   There’s buyers, and there’s sellers, and the same guy is one on Monday and the other on Tuesday.   
 

I think they get a rough ride around here sometimes and as collectors, it’s not like our own poop doesn’t stink.   Plenty of “collectors” behave badly (and plenty behave well).    
 

Flad to hear you’re sometimes taking the other side because I don’t think there is enough of that here.   Seeing things from someone else’s perspective usually changes the conversation. 

[Aaron]

On 6/18/2024 at 7:06 PM, dinesh_s said:

[rsonenthal]

On 6/18/2024 at 6:06 PM, dinesh_s said:

I don't know who you are, but if you're going to jump on the boards and say something like this, you should back it up. 

I wasn't there and honestly, I don't care about a charity auction, but jumping into a discussion and making unsubstantiated accusations isn't helping.  As I said, I don't think we've met, but you should think about what these kinds of posts say about the poster.

Ron 

[comix4fun]

On 6/18/2024 at 6:38 PM, Pedro Cruz said:

What is hilarious to me is that no one called you out.  Yet, you felt you had to add all this justifications for your actions.   BTW, I saw you walk to the underbidder and heard your BS answer.  Also you were standing right next to the winner the whole time.  
 

If the shoe Fits!!! 

I didn't see any "justifications". I've read all these posts and the only person actually posting details is Felix.
Given their responses to Felix's detailed account of the the sale of the Transformers piece that was EXACTLY who they were referencing. 

I also didn't see any "actions" taken by Felix. I heard of another art dealer, not present, asking a friend of his for decades to bid for him on a piece he wanted. That wasn't Felix. 
It's pretty frustrating to read all this, all the puffed up chests, and finger pointing, without a single detail of what the crime allegedly committed was. 
What are you alleging Felix did? 

I've asked a few people now to explain what they think happened or specifically what accusation they are making and nothing has been forthcoming.  Right now this is the most opaque, fuzzy and ambiguous smear campaign I can think of. I've heard "liar", "unprofessional" "not good human"  "sad" and "gross" and nothing of any real substance. Someone summon the bravery to say what they mean and back it up. 

Given Felix's response that he wasn't next to the winner and was instead with DWJ in another part of the auction room, I have to ask, have you ever seen Felix in person? 
 

[comix4fun]

On 6/18/2024 at 7:22 PM, Aaron said:

Two total posts and you come out of hibernation to post this? 

[MyNameIsLegion]

On 6/18/2024 at 6:52 PM, exitmusicblue said:

Are we dealing with burners in here, too?

Some CAF burners are common knowledge by now, sadly.  Having dealt with one myself.

No, Pedro is a newbie that Xatari and Dinesh have been “advising” on investing in art. He got a cover recently that was a recreation of a cover Malvin owns and had a hard time accepting it wasn’t the published art. There’s a whole thread about it. 

[Bronty]

On 6/18/2024 at 8:26 PM, comix4fun said:

I didn't see any "justifications". I've read all these posts and the only person actually posting details is Felix.
Given their responses to Felix's detailed account of the the sale of the Transformers piece that was EXACTLY who they were referencing. 

I also didn't see any "actions" taken by Felix. I heard of another art dealer, not present, asking a friend of his for decades to bid for him on a piece he wanted. That wasn't Felix. 
It's pretty frustrating to read all this, all the puffed up chests, and finger pointing, without a single detail of what the crime allegedly committed was. 
What are you alleging Felix did? 

I've asked a few people now to explain what they think happened or specifically what accusation they are making and nothing has been forthcoming.  Right now this is the most opaque, fuzzy and ambiguous smear campaign I can think of. I've heard "liar", "unprofessional" "not good human"  "sad" and "gross" and nothing of any real substance. Someone summon the bravery to say what they mean and back it up. 

Given Felix's response that he wasn't next to the winner and was instead with DWJ in another part of the auction room, I have to ask, have you ever seen Felix in person? 
 

Well said Chris 

[Bronty]

On 6/18/2024 at 8:26 PM, comix4fun said:

I didn't see any "justifications". I've read all these posts and the only person actually posting details is Felix.
Given their responses to Felix's detailed account of the the sale of the Transformers piece that was EXACTLY who they were referencing. 

I also didn't see any "actions" taken by Felix. I heard of another art dealer, not present, asking a friend of his for decades to bid for him on a piece he wanted. That wasn't Felix. 
It's pretty frustrating to read all this, all the puffed up chests, and finger pointing, without a single detail of what the crime allegedly committed was. 
What are you alleging Felix did? 

I've asked a few people now to explain what they think happened or specifically what accusation they are making and nothing has been forthcoming.  Right now this is the most opaque, fuzzy and ambiguous smear campaign I can think of. I've heard "liar", "unprofessional" "not good human"  "sad" and "gross" and nothing of any real substance. Someone summon the bravery to say what they mean and back it up. 

Given Felix's response that he wasn't next to the winner and was instead with DWJ in another part of the auction room, I have to ask, have you ever seen Felix in person? 
 

In my experience when these smear campaigns start the people smearing are frustrated in some way, and it’s usually about money.     The facts are tossed aside pretty quick because what serves the purpose is a narrative.

[exitmusicblue]

On 6/18/2024 at 5:26 PM, comix4fun said:

Two total posts and you come out of hibernation to post this? 

Literally less than half an hour after my post on burners... can't make this stuff up 🤣🤣🤣

Thank you, cgc boards, for being an unlikely source of comedy for the day.  I'll take it.

[Chris K.]

On 6/18/2024 at 6:06 PM, dinesh_s said:

This is a juvenile post...unless you change the name on the sign to yours. I see one person providing details - and it's not you. 

[Grendel72]

I don't know about OA but this has truly gone out of control. There wont be any worthwhile outcome coming out of this.  All that can be said has been said. Both sides will not be budging.  Some of you guys bat in the major leagues. Surely you can play the bigger person and stop posting on this anymore. If not can you start your own 'Heroes Con" topic. This thread.has been crapped on enough.

[comix4fun]

On 6/18/2024 at 6:47 PM, Pedro Cruz said:

Exactly.  Btw, it happened 3 times that night, which Xatari never called out, he simply made a mention that it had happened, didn’t even add details.  Then one of the guilty parties started justifying the bad behavior with shady reasoning and accusations.  
 

If it’s for charity, let it go.  Most of the people in the room were hoping to bid on art they couldn’t afford otherwise.  Who cares if a commission that was donated goes for high or low.  
It’s Charity!!!! No one is going to demand that the artist charge less.  
 

in fact many pieces went for twice or 3 times what artist charge for their commissions, for example Dekal only charges $700 and yet his piece went for $1,800 (because it’s for charity) and no one shilled that one, it was fair and square.  Just let the system work itself.  

This is perhaps the worst "hot take" of the thread. 

 Anyone who walked into a Heroes Con Saturday Night Art Auction and thought they were going to get a piece of art at a bargain price, or even a retail price, they haven't been to a Heroes Con Saturday Night Art Auction, or they haven't been paying attention. That's not on the artists, or Felix, or the winners of the art, or the underbidders....that's on whatever neophyte didn't ask a veteran how these auctions go and went bargain hunting in the wrong place. 

I just have to comment on how reckless this post his though...."guilty parties", allegations of "shilling", "bad behavior", "Shady reasoning"....and not a single shred of specific detail or fact.

Making allegations that defame people's reputations, private and professional, should be approached from a reasoned, careful, diligent, comprehensive and detailed position and backed up with corroborated facts put forth in support of that allegation. You're batting .000 across the board. 
 

[glendgold]

On 6/18/2024 at 5:53 PM, Grendel72 said:

I don't know about OA but this has truly gone out of control. There wont be any worthwhile outcome coming out of this.  All that can be said has been said. Both sides will not be budging.  Some of you guys bat in the major leagues. Surely you can play the bigger person and stop posting on this anymore. If not can you start your own 'Heroes Con" topic. This thread.has been crapped on enough.

I might agree with this if there were two sides. So far there aren't. There's a couple of guys laying out a series of events and then there's this weird, vague, ad hominem, conspiracy theory pastiche alternating with whispers about...something that some posters are trying to pretend adds up to...something bad? I'm especially intrigued by a poster who attacked Felix, has had many chances to explain what he meant and instead only participated again by liking the posts that slammed his posts. In a normal world, yeah, we're done, but now I'm intrigued.

[MyNameIsLegion]

On 6/18/2024 at 8:13 PM, glendgold said:

I might agree with this if there were two sides. So far there aren't. There's a couple of guys laying out a series of events and then there's this weird, vague, ad hominem, conspiracy theory pastiche alternating with whispers about...something that some posters are trying to pretend adds up to...something bad? I'm especially intrigued by a poster who attacked Felix, has had many chances to explain what he meant and instead only participated again by liking the posts that slammed his posts. In a normal world, yeah, we're done, but now I'm intrigued.

I wonder which artist Xatari is targeting that Felix reps in the hopes of getting access to his art? They seem to want his artists to see this dust up. This is all very contrived. 

Edited June 19 by MyNameIsLegion