Are Gerber or Bill Cole backing boards still really the best? 0

[Hepcat]

For some 25 years I've been bagging and boarding my best comics in Mylites or Arklites backed by Half-Backs or Thin X-Tenders:

With shipping costs so brutally high I recently decided to top up my supplies at a local comic shop instead of ordering an economic quantity of 500-1000 from Gerber or Bill Cole directly. But I was given the hard sell on acid-free backing boards ostensibly superior to those from Gerber or Bill Cole at several of the biggest shops. I am however reluctant to switch. For one thing the competing boards don't have the same texture/finish and mixing a different product line into my existing storage system would bother me.

But my real question I suppose is whether Gerber and Bill Cole still offer acid free backing boards superior to the others.

[Tec-Tac-Toe]

You have likely seen this thread:

Are "acid-free" backing boards truly acid-free? Time to pH test & find out!

Link did not take. I'll try:

 

Edited June 18 by Tec-Tac-Toe

[HighRadArt]

Gerber is only coating one side of their boards now to save money and I'm too OCD to use them.  I've been using the 56 point boards from Comic Proline lately.  Extra thick boards and free shipping for orders over $100 (Canada and US).

[Tec-Tac-Toe]

On 6/18/2024 at 8:32 AM, HighRadArt said:

Gerber is only coating one side of their boards now to save money and I'm too OCD to use them.  I've been using the 56 point boards from Comic Proline lately.  Extra thick boards and free shipping for orders over $100 (Canada and US).

35 pt, acid-free, 3% buffered backing board.

• Genuine acid-free, cellular fiber.
• Meets strict U.S. Government standards for archival storage.
• 3% calcium carbonate buffer throughout, maintains a neutral pH.
• One side white.
• The highest quality backing board available anywhere.

[Hepcat]

On 6/18/2024 at 6:51 AM, Tec-Tac-Toe said:

You have likely seen this thread:

Are "acid-free" backing boards truly acid-free? Time to pH test & find out!

 

I tried a Search here yesterday evening but Searches here don't typically yield anything useful to me. So just fifteen minutes ago this morning I had the bright idea of doing a Google search with the words "Are Gerber acid free backing boards the best test? CGC" and it was the first hit! Very good info indeed.

Edited June 18 by Hepcat

[Hepcat]

On 6/18/2024 at 8:32 AM, HighRadArt said:

Gerber is only coating one side of their boards now to save money and I'm too OCD to use them.  

That if true is disturbing to hear. About Gerber that is. I'm fine with your OCD as well as my own.

On 6/18/2024 at 8:32 AM, HighRadArt said:

Extra thick boards and free shipping for orders over $100 (Canada and US).

Extra thick!!!  That's the last thing I want. I hoping to keep my comic and magazine collection confined to those two lateral filing cabinets you see for the next thirty years.

[HighRadArt]

On 6/18/2024 at 6:27 AM, Tec-Tac-Toe said:

35 pt, acid-free, 3% buffered backing board.

• Genuine acid-free, cellular fiber.
• Meets strict U.S. Government standards for archival storage.
• 3% calcium carbonate buffer throughout, maintains a neutral pH.
• One side white.
• The highest quality backing board available anywhere.

My OCD can't get past "The one side white" cardboard look. 

[HighRadArt]

I'd go with Comic Prolines clear plastic boards if they were cheaper.

[Tec-Tac-Toe]

On 6/18/2024 at 11:02 AM, Hepcat said:

That if true is disturbing to hear. About Gerber that is. I'm fine with your OCD as well as my own.

Extra thick!!!  That's the last thing I want. I hoping to keep my comic and magazine collection confined to those two lateral filing cabinets you see for the next thirty years.

Gerber and BCE boards are acid free. E. Gerber is merely not coating them white on one side, but leaving the natural brown color.

[Tec-Tac-Toe]

On 6/18/2024 at 11:05 AM, HighRadArt said:

My OCD can't get past "The one side white" cardboard look. 

I know what you mean, but check (you may have already done so) because:

 

THIN-X-TENDERS™ is a white 24 mil thick acid free backing board, economically priced to be competitive with the so called acid free at time of manufacture backing boards. Thin-X-Tenders™ is an inexpensive alternative without sacrificing archival quality protection.

 

 

https://www.bcwsupplies.com/blog/2014/02/16/are-bcw-backing-boards-really-acid-free/

 

 

Are BCW Backing Boards Really “Acid Free”?

Posted on February 16, 2014 by blogbcwsupplies

 

 

 

Comic book collectors are serious about keeping their comics in mint condition. Protecting their comics by bagging and boarding is common practice. So when BCW Supplies claims our backing boards are “acid free”, collectors say “prove it”. BCW welcomes the challenge.

Originally posted by BCW Supplies on a Collectors Society forum on June 9th, 2011, the article below shows the results of an independent test performed by the Chicago Paper Testing Laboratory. The “SBS” boards mentioned below are solid bleached sulphate, a virgin fiber grade of paperboard.

---

Once again we would like to thank mschmidt for his thought provoking study which you can find here; http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=4534727&fpart=1

Based on Mike’s data and conclusions we decided to have the products that are represented in his experiment tested at an independent laboratory. Mike had concluded “that [SBS] boards will actively contribute, on a molecular level, to the decay of your comic book from the moment they’re placed inside the bag” based on the results of his testing using a pHydrion pH pencil. Mike stated that the calcium carbonate coating of the SBS board was absorbing only the acid from the board itself and that over time the SBS board would become completely acidic. However, we at BCW stated that we believe Mike’s conclusion is in error. We suggested that the fact that the coated side of the BCW board became more acidic with use over a two year period indicates that some of the residual acid from the comic book is being absorbed by the calcium carbonate coating on the board. Further, we suggested that the fact that the uncoated side of the BCW board did not change in pH over a period of two years of use meant that acid was not migrating from the SBS board to the comic book. As you will see, the data below supports our position.

We submitted samples to Chicago Paper Testing Laboratories, Inc. on 20 July 2011 and I was present in the laboratory on Tuesday 2 August 2011 for some of the testing. We had the lab perform TAPPI T-435 (pH) on a comic book (Marvel Comics Presents #61), E. Gerber Half-Back, BCW Comic Backing Board, Bill Cole Thin X-Tender, Miller Hobby Comic Backing Board, and an Ultra Pro Comic Backing Board. We also had them perform ASTM D-4988 (Alkaline Reserve) on an E. Gerber Half-Back, BCW Comic Backing Board, Bill Cole Thin X-Tender, Miller Hobby Comic Backing Board, and an Ultra Pro Comic Backing Board. In addition, we had them perform TAPPI T-401 (Fiber Analysis) on an E. Gerber Half-Back, BCW Comic Backing Board, and Bill Cole Thin X-Tender. And finally, we had the laboratory perform ASTM D-776 (Artificial Ageing) on a comic book (Marvel Comics Presents #61) and backing boards from both E. Gerber and BCW for 10 and 20 years.

Let’s look at the results of TAPPI T-435 (pH) from the samples submitted;

Comic Book pH 5.4
E. Gerber Half-Back pH 8.52
BCW Comic Backing Board pH 8.47
Bill Cole Thin X-Tender pH 8.57
Miller Hobby Comic Backing Board pH 9.36
Ultra Pro Comic Backing Board pH 7.94

As you can see, the comic book is acidic as expected. The boards all have relatively the same pH with Miller Hobby at the top of the scale and Ultra Pro at the bottom.

Now let’s look at the results of ASTM D-4988 (Alkaline Reserve);

E. Gerber Half-Back 7.69%
BCW Comic Backing Board 3.64%
Bill Cole Thin X-Tender 6.57%
Miller Hobby Comic Backing Board 4.45%
Ultra Pro Comic Backing Board 4.72%

From the data we can see that the E. Gerber Half-Backs and Bill Cole Thin X-Tenders actually have more than twice the Alkaline Reserve as advertised. The SBS boards all have about the same Alkaline Reserve with Ultra Pro at the top of the scale and BCW Supplies on the bottom.

Let’s take a look at the results of ASTM D-776 (Artificial Ageing);

Aged 10 years

Comic Book pH 5.45
E Gerber Half-Back pH 8.07

Comic Book pH 5.44
BCW Comic Backing Board pH 7.62

Aged 20 years

Comic Book pH 5.27
E Gerber Half-Back pH 8.07

Comic Book pH 5.26
BCW Comic Backing Board pH 7.34

From the data we can see that the E. Gerber Half-Back’s pH level does not change over a 10 year period which suggests that the E. Gerber Half-Back does not absorb any residual acid from the comic book. This is the conclusion that we drew from Mike’s data originally, and it is also the position of E. Gerber that their product does not absorb any residual acid from a comic book. It only acts as a stiffener. As the BCW Comic Backing Board absorbs some of the phenolic acid that migrates from the pages of a comic book the pH level of the board naturally decreases as the buffer reaches the saturation point (which is why we recommend that you change your boards every 3 to 5 years). Phenolic acid is released as lignin breaks down in the pages of a comic book and exhibits itself as the yellow residue that you see on a comic backing board after several years of use.

Please note that ASTM D-776 does not allow for the micro-environment that is created when sealing a comic book in a bag with a backing board. Therefore, we were not able to confirm our hypothesis that a comic book will deteriorate more quickly if the phenolic acid is not absorbed.

Now let’s look at the results of TAPPI T-401 (Fiber Analysis);

E. Gerber Half-Back

Bleached Kraft Softwood 12.1%
Bleached Kraft Hardwood 55.9%
Groundwood 32%
Unbleached Kraft Hardwood 0%

BCW Comic Backing Board

Bleached Kraft Softwood 9.6%
Bleached Kraft Hardwood 90.4%
Groundwood 0%
Unbleached Kraft Hardwood Trace

Bill Cole Thin X-Tender

Bleached Kraft Softwood 17.2%
Bleached Kraft Hardwood 61.1%
Groundwood 21.7%
Unbleached Kraft Hardwood 0%

SBS is stabilized paper board, meaning that it is made using a chemical process (also known as bleaching) where the lignin is removed from the pulp. This process does leave some residual acid in the SBS from bleaching and a buffer of calcium carbonate is added to stabilize the sheet. The paper mills have a target pH level of between 6.5 and 7.2 which means that the lower the buffer the less residual acid that remains in the paper. Bill Cole Thin X-Tenders and E. Gerber Half-Backs and Full-Backs are made of VAT board which has a coating on both sides that is bleached, but the core of the VAT board is made using mechanical pulp and contains lignin. The reason that this is important is that the lignin will eventually break down and the board could become acidic depending on how much calcium carbonate is in the board and how much phenolic acid is released.

There is between 32% and 21.7% Groundwood in the E. Gerber Half-Backs and Bill Cole Thin X-Tenders respectively. Because Groundwood contains lignin, the VAT board requires a greater Alkaline Reserve to remain stable. Note that the Alkaline Reserve of the E. Gerber Half-Back is greater than that of the Bill Cole Thin X-Tenders. This is because there is more Groundwood in the E. Gerber Half-Back and therefore requires more calcium carbonate to achieve roughly the same pH level as the Bill Cole Thin X-Tender.

Attached are copies of the documentation that we received from the laboratory for your reference.

Chicago Paper Testing Laboratory – Report 45892

Chicago Paper Testing Laboratory – Report 45892- DATA

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[HighRadArt]

On 6/18/2024 at 8:15 AM, Tec-Tac-Toe said:

I know what you mean, but check (you may have already done so) because:

 

THIN-X-TENDERS™ is a white 24 mil thick acid free backing board, economically priced to be competitive with the so called acid free at time of manufacture backing boards. Thin-X-Tenders™ is an inexpensive alternative without sacrificing archival quality protection.

 

 

https://www.bcwsupplies.com/blog/2014/02/16/are-bcw-backing-boards-really-acid-free/

 

 

Are BCW Backing Boards Really “Acid Free”?

Posted on February 16, 2014 by blogbcwsupplies

 

 

 

Comic book collectors are serious about keeping their comics in mint condition. Protecting their comics by bagging and boarding is common practice. So when BCW Supplies claims our backing boards are “acid free”, collectors say “prove it”. BCW welcomes the challenge.

Originally posted by BCW Supplies on a Collectors Society forum on June 9th, 2011, the article below shows the results of an independent test performed by the Chicago Paper Testing Laboratory. The “SBS” boards mentioned below are solid bleached sulphate, a virgin fiber grade of paperboard.

---

Once again we would like to thank mschmidt for his thought provoking study which you can find here; http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=4534727&fpart=1

Based on Mike’s data and conclusions we decided to have the products that are represented in his experiment tested at an independent laboratory. Mike had concluded “that [SBS] boards will actively contribute, on a molecular level, to the decay of your comic book from the moment they’re placed inside the bag” based on the results of his testing using a pHydrion pH pencil. Mike stated that the calcium carbonate coating of the SBS board was absorbing only the acid from the board itself and that over time the SBS board would become completely acidic. However, we at BCW stated that we believe Mike’s conclusion is in error. We suggested that the fact that the coated side of the BCW board became more acidic with use over a two year period indicates that some of the residual acid from the comic book is being absorbed by the calcium carbonate coating on the board. Further, we suggested that the fact that the uncoated side of the BCW board did not change in pH over a period of two years of use meant that acid was not migrating from the SBS board to the comic book. As you will see, the data below supports our position.

We submitted samples to Chicago Paper Testing Laboratories, Inc. on 20 July 2011 and I was present in the laboratory on Tuesday 2 August 2011 for some of the testing. We had the lab perform TAPPI T-435 (pH) on a comic book (Marvel Comics Presents #61), E. Gerber Half-Back, BCW Comic Backing Board, Bill Cole Thin X-Tender, Miller Hobby Comic Backing Board, and an Ultra Pro Comic Backing Board. We also had them perform ASTM D-4988 (Alkaline Reserve) on an E. Gerber Half-Back, BCW Comic Backing Board, Bill Cole Thin X-Tender, Miller Hobby Comic Backing Board, and an Ultra Pro Comic Backing Board. In addition, we had them perform TAPPI T-401 (Fiber Analysis) on an E. Gerber Half-Back, BCW Comic Backing Board, and Bill Cole Thin X-Tender. And finally, we had the laboratory perform ASTM D-776 (Artificial Ageing) on a comic book (Marvel Comics Presents #61) and backing boards from both E. Gerber and BCW for 10 and 20 years.

Let’s look at the results of TAPPI T-435 (pH) from the samples submitted;

Comic Book pH 5.4
E. Gerber Half-Back pH 8.52
BCW Comic Backing Board pH 8.47
Bill Cole Thin X-Tender pH 8.57
Miller Hobby Comic Backing Board pH 9.36
Ultra Pro Comic Backing Board pH 7.94

As you can see, the comic book is acidic as expected. The boards all have relatively the same pH with Miller Hobby at the top of the scale and Ultra Pro at the bottom.

Now let’s look at the results of ASTM D-4988 (Alkaline Reserve);

E. Gerber Half-Back 7.69%
BCW Comic Backing Board 3.64%
Bill Cole Thin X-Tender 6.57%
Miller Hobby Comic Backing Board 4.45%
Ultra Pro Comic Backing Board 4.72%

From the data we can see that the E. Gerber Half-Backs and Bill Cole Thin X-Tenders actually have more than twice the Alkaline Reserve as advertised. The SBS boards all have about the same Alkaline Reserve with Ultra Pro at the top of the scale and BCW Supplies on the bottom.

Let’s take a look at the results of ASTM D-776 (Artificial Ageing);

Aged 10 years

Comic Book pH 5.45
E Gerber Half-Back pH 8.07

Comic Book pH 5.44
BCW Comic Backing Board pH 7.62

Aged 20 years

Comic Book pH 5.27
E Gerber Half-Back pH 8.07

Comic Book pH 5.26
BCW Comic Backing Board pH 7.34

From the data we can see that the E. Gerber Half-Back’s pH level does not change over a 10 year period which suggests that the E. Gerber Half-Back does not absorb any residual acid from the comic book. This is the conclusion that we drew from Mike’s data originally, and it is also the position of E. Gerber that their product does not absorb any residual acid from a comic book. It only acts as a stiffener. As the BCW Comic Backing Board absorbs some of the phenolic acid that migrates from the pages of a comic book the pH level of the board naturally decreases as the buffer reaches the saturation point (which is why we recommend that you change your boards every 3 to 5 years). Phenolic acid is released as lignin breaks down in the pages of a comic book and exhibits itself as the yellow residue that you see on a comic backing board after several years of use.

Please note that ASTM D-776 does not allow for the micro-environment that is created when sealing a comic book in a bag with a backing board. Therefore, we were not able to confirm our hypothesis that a comic book will deteriorate more quickly if the phenolic acid is not absorbed.

Now let’s look at the results of TAPPI T-401 (Fiber Analysis);

E. Gerber Half-Back

Bleached Kraft Softwood 12.1%
Bleached Kraft Hardwood 55.9%
Groundwood 32%
Unbleached Kraft Hardwood 0%

BCW Comic Backing Board

Bleached Kraft Softwood 9.6%
Bleached Kraft Hardwood 90.4%
Groundwood 0%
Unbleached Kraft Hardwood Trace

Bill Cole Thin X-Tender

Bleached Kraft Softwood 17.2%
Bleached Kraft Hardwood 61.1%
Groundwood 21.7%
Unbleached Kraft Hardwood 0%

SBS is stabilized paper board, meaning that it is made using a chemical process (also known as bleaching) where the lignin is removed from the pulp. This process does leave some residual acid in the SBS from bleaching and a buffer of calcium carbonate is added to stabilize the sheet. The paper mills have a target pH level of between 6.5 and 7.2 which means that the lower the buffer the less residual acid that remains in the paper. Bill Cole Thin X-Tenders and E. Gerber Half-Backs and Full-Backs are made of VAT board which has a coating on both sides that is bleached, but the core of the VAT board is made using mechanical pulp and contains lignin. The reason that this is important is that the lignin will eventually break down and the board could become acidic depending on how much calcium carbonate is in the board and how much phenolic acid is released.

There is between 32% and 21.7% Groundwood in the E. Gerber Half-Backs and Bill Cole Thin X-Tenders respectively. Because Groundwood contains lignin, the VAT board requires a greater Alkaline Reserve to remain stable. Note that the Alkaline Reserve of the E. Gerber Half-Back is greater than that of the Bill Cole Thin X-Tenders. This is because there is more Groundwood in the E. Gerber Half-Back and therefore requires more calcium carbonate to achieve roughly the same pH level as the Bill Cole Thin X-Tender.

Attached are copies of the documentation that we received from the laboratory for your reference.

Chicago Paper Testing Laboratory – Report 45892

Chicago Paper Testing Laboratory – Report 45892- DATA

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Do you use the Thinxtenders?  I've never heard of them until now.  Always great information on this site.

[Tec-Tac-Toe]

On 6/18/2024 at 12:11 PM, HighRadArt said:

Do you use the Thinxtenders?  I've never heard of them until now.  Always great information on this site.

Yes, for many modern age comic book that are frequently worth less than the boards.  I also use the E. Gerber Half-Backs for such books. Thankfully, over several years I purchased about 25,000 acid free boards, primarily E. Gerber (almost all 750FB), to use on my purchases from around 2003 to present. I also purchased a corresponding number of Archives and Mylites.

I have not purchased BCE boards, etc., since the 1990s.

[Gonzimodo]

My advice is to read that thread again and don't go anywhere near those "acid free at time of manufacture and coated on one side" boards.  Stick with E Gerber, Bill Cole, or any other fully buffered board.

[Gonzimodo]

On 6/18/2024 at 12:25 AM, Hepcat said:

For some 25 years I've been bagging and boarding my best comics in Mylites or Arklites backed by Half-Backs or Thin X-Tenders:

With shipping costs so brutally high I recently decided to top up my supplies at a local comic shop instead of ordering an economic quantity of 500-1000 from Gerber or Bill Cole directly. But I was given the hard sell on acid-free backing boards ostensibly superior to those from Gerber or Bill Cole at several of the biggest shops. I am however reluctant to switch. For one thing the competing boards don't have the same texture/finish and mixing a different product line into my existing storage system would bother me.

But my real question I suppose is whether Gerber and Bill Cole still offer acid free backing boards superior to the others.

Out of curiosity, what brand(s) were people trying to push on you as being superior to E Gerber and BCE?

[musicmeta]

On 6/18/2024 at 7:32 AM, HighRadArt said:

Gerber is only coating one side of their boards now to save money and I'm too OCD to use them.  I've been using the 56 point boards from Comic Proline lately.  Extra thick boards and free shipping for orders over $100 (Canada and US).

Yes. Same here.  I like the sturdiness of these 56pt boards.  I also don't like the board coated on just one side.  

[Hepcat]

On 6/18/2024 at 4:11 PM, Gonzimodo said:

Out of curiosity, what brand(s) were people trying to push on you as being superior to E Gerber and BCE?

The ComicPro Line SBS boards. They're smooth and glossy though which is very much unlike the Gerber Half-Backs and Bill Cole Thin X-Tenders I've been using.

[Hepcat]

On 6/18/2024 at 8:32 AM, HighRadArt said:

Gerber is only coating one side of their boards now to save money and I'm too OCD to use them.

Ugghhhh! You'd think Gerber or any business would know and understand their customer base. Here Gerber carved out a leading market share with their premium backing boards and maintained it for 35+ years selling to a customer base of those with OCD. (If they didn't have OCD, they wouldn't be collecting old comics now would they?) And by their very nature OCD individuals don't like change. So what does the "brain trust" at Gerber do? They change the product which is a move sure to annoy/anger their OCD customer base.

And why? Saving a small percentage on the production cost of the product isn't going to offset losing even a tiny percentage of sales because the top line dwarves production costs. Gerber's biggest expense has to be advertising followed by employee salaries.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

Edited June 19 by Hepcat

[ttfitz]

On 6/18/2024 at 10:47 PM, Hepcat said:

On 6/18/2024 at 8:32 AM, HighRadArt said:

Gerber is only coating one side of their boards now to save money and I'm too OCD to use them.

Ugghhhh! You'd think Gerber or any business would know and understand their customer base. Here Gerber carved out a leading market share with their premium backing boards and maintained it for 35+ years selling to a customer base of those with OCD. (If they didn't have OCD, they wouldn't be collecting old comics now would they?) And by their very nature OCD individuals don't like change. So what does the "brain trust" at Gerber do? They change the product which is a move sure to annoy/anger their OCD customer base.

Just thought I would point out, since you said you were using halfbacks, that the halfbacks are still white on both sides.

[Domo Arigato]

On 6/18/2024 at 8:27 AM, Tec-Tac-Toe said:

35 pt, acid-free, 3% buffered backing board.

• Genuine acid-free, cellular fiber.
• Meets strict U.S. Government standards for archival storage.
• 3% calcium carbonate buffer throughout, maintains a neutral pH.
• One side white.
• The highest quality backing board available anywhere.

Their "Full-Backs" went from 42 pt thickness down to 35 pt.....and they now leave one side brown.

Two asinine decisions that keep me from using them.

 

[Tec-Tac-Toe]

On 6/19/2024 at 4:05 AM, Domo Arigato said:

Their "Full-Backs" went from 42 pt thickness down to 35 pt.....and they now leave one side brown.

Two asinine decisions that keep me from using them.

 

Yes, unfortunately. Thankfully, I purchased so many of the previous E. Gerber boards that they will last me for a while.