Another Heritage/CGC book reaches "Full Potential"

[tth2]

I'd rather have a 9.4 copy of a PC book that arrived unmessed with, than a 9.6 or 9.8 that had been pressed to that grade level. That's not a complicated position to understand, is it?

I thought that's what I was saying when I disagreed with Jason.

[jbud73]

I'd rather have a 9.4 copy of a PC book that arrived unmessed with, than a 9.6 or 9.8 that had been pressed to that grade level. That's not a complicated position to understand, is it?

I thought that's what I was saying when I disagreed with Jason.

 

No you disagreed with me to be difficult

 

And yes Tim there are a few nuts out there who wouldn't even want you to breath on the books let alone touch them with your hands. My point was that I don't think the average collector would call it inapproprite to expect disclosure when some other nut case takes an eraser and 1000psi to a book with some slight heat to increase a fine exmaple, with 60 years of history behind it, by one fraction of a grade with an arbitrary panel of enthusiasts where the criteria for establishing that bastion of viginity is ILL DEFINED.

[FFB]

1000psi

 

How many times have we had this discussion on here? The pressure is nowhere near 1000 psi. If you think a comic book could withstand that, then take out a ball peen hammer and smack some comic books on the staples and see how easily they bust through the centerfold and all the way to the cover.

[jbud73]

1000psi

 

How many times have we had this discussion on here? The pressure is nowhere near 1000 psi. If you think a comic book could withstand that, then take out a ball peen hammer and smack some comic books on the staples and see how easily they bust through the centerfold and all the way to the cover.

 

I was ranting at Tim and threw in an arbitrary number. Please feel free to amend with a proper numerical notation.

[jbud73]

I think we've had the discussion about as many times as I've debunked the Pressing is the same as the Church books being stacked vertically analogous myth.

[action1kid]

Of the Overstreet 10 top goldenage books[The ones that are Mile High] My Qustion is how many of them have restoration? Forget the blue labels,How many have any degree of resto at all? i know its noT goona be good news.But can you name each one?

[tth2]

I'd rather have a 9.4 copy of a PC book that arrived unmessed with, than a 9.6 or 9.8 that had been pressed to that grade level. That's not a complicated position to understand, is it?

I thought that's what I was saying when I disagreed with Jason.

 

No you disagreed with me to be difficult

 

And yes Tim there are a few nuts out there who wouldn't even want you to breath on the books let alone touch them with your hands. My point was that I don't think the average collector would call it inapproprite to expect disclosure when some other nut case takes an eraser and 1000psi to a book with some slight heat to increase a fine exmaple, with 60 years of history behind it, by one fraction of a grade with an arbitrary panel of enthusiasts where the criteria for establishing that bastion of viginity is ILL DEFINED.

I'm lost. Maybe I misunderstood your statement. I thought you were saying collectors don't want books to be untouched for 60 years, which is why I was disagreeing with you. For the record, I'm on the non-pressing, non-resto side, okay? I don't think there's anything special about a perfect book that is that way because of artificial manipulation, anymore than I think there's anything special about a world record 100 meters being run by someone who's been artificially manipulated to run faster.

[The Black Hand ®]

Hey, does anyone know who owns that cosmic Airplane copy of Top Notch #9. Also, has anyone here ever resubed a Pedigree after having work done on it, or a non pedigree for that matter?

[action1kid]

I'd rather have a 9.4 copy of a PC book that arrived unmessed with, than a 9.6 or 9.8 that had been pressed to that grade level. That's not a complicated position to understand, is it?

 

And i would rather have Metros 9.4 All star 3 than the Mile High[9.6] All star 3 with color touch.

[Timulty]

Hey, does anyone know who owns that cosmic Airplane copy of Top Notch #9. Also, has anyone here ever resubed a Pedigree after having work done on it, or a non pedigree for that matter?

 

No, I don't know of anyone but I will probably turn in my Captain Marvel Adventures 71 Church for cleaning and pressing. Also, to get a mis-staple pulled through. I wonder how you tell CGC please put on the label the work done? If not, I will have to make sure the work info is kept with the comic unless it ever leaves my collection. I definitely want disclosure on this one!!!!

[The Black Hand ®]

Hey, does anyone know who owns that cosmic Airplane copy of Top Notch #9. Also, has anyone here ever resubed a Pedigree after having work done on it, or a non pedigree for that matter?

 

No, I don't know of anyone but I will probably turn in my Captain Marvel Adventures 71 Church for cleaning and pressing. Also, to get a mis-staple pulled through. I wonder how you tell CGC please put on the label the work done? If not, I will have to make sure the work info is kept with the comic unless it ever leaves my collection. I definitely want disclosure on this one!!!!

 

 

Call up CGC, tell them what you want to do and ask if they would note that on the label. But if I remember correctly, your book is already pretty nice looking. But it's your book to do with what you want.

[Timulty]

I might not end up doing it. I would like to have the staple worked on though. I don't like to screw with staples!!!

[Davenport]

 

I think the thing that people love about the Church collection is that fact that DESPITE THE ODDS, the books emerged in the shape they did.

 

I can't believe that collectors would be as impressed ( or consider as valuable) a collection that had been pressed, cleaned and generally "massaged" up to an artificially attained grade.

 

I'd rather have a 9.4 copy of a PC book that arrived unmessed with, than a 9.6 or 9.8 that had been pressed to that grade level. That's not a complicated position to understand, is it?

 

Red

Bingo. It's the odds-defying condition that raises the desire to posses. Right? Like this: Same comic issue, same high grade condition, but in person ...

 

...an old man walks you toward a closet saying "let me show you something I've had since I was a kid."

 

...a top notch conservator walks you toward his workbench saying "let me show you something I just completed".

 

Even if conservation damages nothing the desire-to-posses reaction would probably be quite different. I think that's what people are complaining about. Collectors want to have an honest reaction / personal value judgement (price they'll pay) experience and it's getting lost with how encapsulation has played out.

[nearmint]

The only thing that bothers me about this is that I am concerned about the effect it could have on the long-term health of the back issue market. It seems like since the Ewert scandal broke that people have a lot more suspicion about games being played. It also seems that these individual examples are now having a far more damaging effect on the overall collector psyche than they used to have. (In other words, people didn't seem to mind as much about dry cleaning and pressing as they do now. Arty has had his resubbed Church list available for years and no one has really made a huge stink about those books. They've been more of a curiosity than anything else.)

 

While I am extremely concerned and maybe even downright worried about the effect that the crack/dry-clean-and-press/resub game will have on the long-term health of the market, dry cleaning and pressing a comic book does not bother me personally. I would not hesitate to buy a dry cleaned and pressed book, so long as the work were done by someone like Matt Nelson who knows what he is doing. But I realize not everyone feels that way and I'm not trying to impose my beliefs in that regard on anyone else.

 

This is exactly where I'm at right now. If I ever become king of the world, Scott can be my spokesman.

[nearmint]

or a non pedigree for that matter?

 

Non-pedigree, yes.

[The Black Hand ®]

or a non pedigree for that matter?

 

Non-pedigree, yes.

 

So where do you stand on disclosure? Would it be a toss up for you interms of buying and paying the same price for a nm never touched and a nearmint cleaned and pressed with same PQ and eye appeal?

[nearmint]

or a non pedigree for that matter?

 

Non-pedigree, yes.

 

So where do you stand on disclosure? Would it be a toss up for you interms of buying and paying the same price for a nm never touched and a nearmint cleaned and pressed with same PQ and eye appeal?

 

If I were the only person on the planet, it would be a toss-up. I couldn't care less. But, since I know there are collectors who won't go near a pressed book, I feel the need to protect my investment(should I ever want to sell it) and go for the never touched copy.

[The Black Hand ®]

I guess I would prefer the non pressed just because of the weakness that may result in the spine area and around the staples but if it was a book I wanted and it cost less I would have no problem. My problem is with people who do it and don't disclose it and in the case of pedigrees with CGC not disclosing the work. I find the whole slab cracking resubmission angle highly suspect because of the non disclosure aspect and also because there may be more work done then we think. I think it's a growing problem and I no longer have any trust in slabbed books. I didn't put a higher bid on a mile high Top Notch 27 on Heritage because I kept wondering if the book was tweaked, if a year ago it was an 8.0 and not a 9.2. I kept wondering and I don't like getting taken and I don't like being lied to and I don't like the direction CGC and Heritage and the non disclosing resubmitters have taken this hobby and I'm not going to go elsewhere and find another hobby, I'm going to continue to speak out about what I feel is wrong with this hobby.

[Scheradon]

I guess I would prefer the non pressed just because of the weakness that may result in the spine area and around the staples but if it was a book I wanted and it cost less I would have no problem. My problem is with people who do it and don't disclose it and in the case of pedigrees with CGC not disclosing the work. I find the whole slab cracking resubmission angle highly suspect because of the non disclosure aspect and also because there may be more work done then we think. I think it's a growing problem and I no longer have any trust in slabbed books. I didn't put a higher bid on a mile high Top Notch 27 on Heritage because I kept wondering if the book was tweaked, if a year ago it was an 8.0 and not a 9.2. I kept wondering and I don't like getting taken and I don't like being lied to and I don't like the direction CGC and Heritage and the non disclosing resubmitters have taken this hobby and I'm not going to go elsewhere and find another hobby, I'm going to continue to speak out about what I feel is wrong with this hobby.

 

[esquirecomics]

I kept wondering and I don't like getting taken and I don't like being lied to and I don't like the direction CGC and Heritage and the non disclosing resubmitters have taken this hobby and I'm not going to go elsewhere and find another hobby, I'm going to continue to speak out about what I feel is wrong with this hobby.

 

Nothing more need be said.