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RESTORED COMICS..WHATS ALL THE HYPE ABOUT??

Started by ablue,

112 posts in this topic

comicinvestor-migration

comicinvestor-migration

Posted
Posted

FYI Matt Nelson currently does 'conservation' on books to include cleaning/pressing. He indicates that CGC does not consider his conservation work to be restoration...you may have some cleaned and/or pressed books in your CGC collection and not even know it!

 

Thanks Scottish, but I really don't need any more help in bursting the CGC bubble. grin.gif

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murph0

murph0

Posted
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ablue, try contributing something to the forum rather then just complaining..if you don't like what I'm saying go prove me wrong and show me all the restored books you own. And last I checked everyone is allowed to express their opinions here, so you can kindly jump right back off my back. Could it be that cleaned and pressed books used to sell for more because people didn't understand what it was before..and not the other way around?

 

Brian

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FlyingDonut

FlyingDonut

Posted
Posted

All I can say is people are not educated enough between resto and conservation

 

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhh!

 

Why do you keep beating this dead horse? The market is dictating what the price is. Restoration. Conservation. WHATEVER you want to call it. Here's the bottom line. Ready? I'm going to try to be clear:

 

If a book is deemed restored by CGC, the market values it at 10-20% of what it would if it was not restored.

 

If you think the market is wrong and will correct itself, buy some restored books. I tend to believe that the market might be wrong because buyers may come around to the thinking that "conservation" or "restoration" or "adding pieces of rice paper to a cover" are necessary evils to make a paper collectible last longer.

 

Just a question - are you trying to pump up the value of restored books so you can sell them?

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ablue

ablue

Posted
  • Author
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I can say what I want.

I have that right don't I?? I have made a valid point and there is nothing wrong with that!

Who are you to dictate what can be said or cannot??

And no I am not trying to raise values of CONCERVED BOOKS I am trying to get a point out and I believe there are many people who feel the same way.

This is not a dead horse and it will not go away no mater how much you feel it should.

The problem with you is if books that were conserved had the same respect as the blue label you would see the value of your books fall as the supply would go up and you don't want that. wink.gif

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murph0

murph0

Posted
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Look you can have your opinion on restored books and what not..but don't try telling me I'm wrong for not wanting to own one. I don't buy books with writing on them, I know it's not restoration nor is it a real knockdown in some other people's eyes but I just don't want writing on my book..just like I don't want someone working on my book.

 

Brian

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PovertyRow

PovertyRow

Posted
Posted

I don't buy books with writing on them, I know it's not restoration nor is it a real knockdown in some other people's eyes but I just don't want writing on my book..just like I don't want someone working on my book.

 

Now that makes a lot of sense. At this level you are exactly right. It is like my own preferences. I don't mind writing (I mean, if someone pens the lyrics to LET IT BE on an EERIE #3 I won’t want it) but a name or an arrival date don't bother me. But I won’t try to convince someone that writing is OK if they don't like it. Part of what collecting is: a reflection of an aspect of your personality and preferences.

 

In reading the posts here, including my own, it does sound like some folk (including me) are saying that cleaning/pressing is ok and should not be considered a bad thing.

 

I can't speak for others but what I am saying is that there is a distinction in "invasiveness" between the cleaning and the piece replacement. And that such a distinction should be made. I would never condone a book that is just cleaned be passed of as "unrestored". Call it restoration or conservation, that book has been altered and such alteration should be disclosed. It is why I would like to see a 2nd label color for cleaned/pressed type books. It would still alert the collector that the book has been worked on, but it would separate them from the books that have had surgery as opposed to anti-biotics (so to speak.)

 

 

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PovertyRow

PovertyRow

Posted
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Oh - regarding writing - I once bought a Captain Marvel - forget the number - and it had pencil writing on the cover by apparantly the same siblings. What made me buy it - for cheap because of the writing - was one phrase: "Hide the book! Ma's coming!" It gave me a VERY vivid image of a couple of kid's, probably in their shared bedroom, hiding their precious stash of comics. And it cracked me up! I wish I still had it.

 

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murph0

murph0

Posted
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Is it possible to detect erasing if you do it carefully enough and get the writing removed beyond being able to see it?

Curious because I think I have some erasing on the back of one of my books.

 

Brian

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PovertyRow

PovertyRow

Posted
Posted

Maybe they could put it under the qualified grade, don't you have to take the book apart to clean it?

 

It depends on the cleaning. For a dry cleaning - no. For removal of ink transfer stain, yes. For a wet cleaning or a float rinse, yes.

 

Oh - I have to add another caveat. I do not consider float washing or other wet cleaning non-invasive. It impacts the cover's coating, removing some of the gloss and hardness. I would like to see a "Dry cleaning/pressed/spine roll removed" qualifier.

 

Yes, for spine roll removal the book has to be dismantled. I have dismantled several books in my day and when done properly is very easy and changes nothing. When done improperly it will knock a grade or three off for those spine tears that weren't there before. Now I appreciate that dismantling opens up a new can of worms and I can also appreciate someone who does not wnat there book dismantled. But having done it I know that the spine roll removal is better for the book in the long run.

 

I thikn your idea of using the qualified grade is not a bad one. But since qualified can imply that "this book would be higher grade except for one point", I'd rather see the fact that it has been cleaned or pressed or spine removed etc have its own "color". I think it is only fair to the buyer. And it will help to really nail down grading concepts.

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PovertyRow

PovertyRow

Posted
Posted

Is it possible to detect erasing if you do it carefully enough and get the writing removed beyond being able to see it?

 

Yes, it often can be detected. The hardest area to erase is those fine black type ads on the back cover. If you erase enough to remove even a light pencil, some of that text is going to lighten and very slightly "smear". Invest a few dollars in a couple of good ground glass magnifiers. The ones about 10 power that fold into a metal casing (usually called "loupes" are great and about $25 or so - well worth it to detect a previously undetected restoration on a book you are considering - restoraiton could knock off a lot more than that price of the loupe if you bought it and eventually tried to sell it.

 

You can also get a pocket microscope - usually about 20-30X - these are GREAT for examing fine detail in small areas and you can - well - carry it in your pocket like a pen.

 

If the erasing is on a white border area, there are a couple of tihngs you can do. First angle the book to the light and look for a difference in reflectivity around the area you suspect. Next, look at the same area FROM THE BACK. Sometimes you can erase the pencil but the impression is left behind as is often more easily seen from the back of the page. Again, angle it to the light.

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PovertyRow

PovertyRow

Posted
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Your idea of "removing" something kinda becomes real hazy when you’re talking about removal of a spine roll..that's sort of a defect that is part of a comic’s history..

 

Well, it is in the same class as writing by a previous owner or a water stain, etc. Something part of the history of the book's life (which is why I loved so much that "Ma's Coming!" writing! lol

 

Anyway - I'm sure you know (some may not) that spine roll occurs through two main circumstances: rolling up the book and sticking it in your back pocket as you ride your Schwinn bike down the street with that Ted Williams baseball card clothespinned to the axle so it rubs against the spokes and sounds (with a bit of imagination) like a motorcycle (I actually had a 50's Williams card I did that with!)

 

Or it can be caused by reading the way a non-collector or just a plain old kid reads: folding the book over while reading.

 

It is bad for the structural integrity of the book because it re-arranges the pressure points away from the spine itself, which, because of the folding and the staples, is the books strongest point.

 

Spine roll removal shifts the pressure back to its rightful place and this does help the book's longevity without adding to the book. The process is definitely the most "invasive" of the non-invasive processes but the fact that nothing is added does, I believe, qualify it for a different category than the really invasive processes like painting or taping/sealing. piece replacement etc. Again, full disclosure should be made so the buyer knows exactly what they are getting.

 

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murph0

murph0

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Posted

I made a lot of money in the stock market back in undergrad school...and I come from a pretty well to do family. I don't have much money to spend on comics anymore due to my car purchase, which I posted a pic of...and btw, I still wanna race you rick.

Back to the topic, how do you detect erasing if it's extremely clean?

 

Brian

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