Anyone with any exp. with comickeys?

[sfilosa]

A quick question:

 

If a seller uses a private auction, how could a bidder have any idea if the highest bidder is a shill?

 

 

Restoration issue aside, with a private auction you would never know if you paid the next highest price, or if shill bid happened.

 

This is not directly related to comic-keys but,

 

1) Assume you sell some restored books and some not.

2) You use a private auction

3) You use a shill bidder on those books not restored so that you never sell them below the price you would want to.

 

 

Hmmmmmmmmmmm!

 

 

[OldGuy]

with a private auction you would never know if you paid the next highest price, or if shill bid happened.

 

You are correct.

[COI]

People on the board have moaned and groaned about this touchy subject for a long time, but nobody seems to have direct history. I do!

 

Please go back and see my post.

[hammer-migration]

At the time that I sold Andrew the Avengers 1, I had approx SIX (6) DIFFERENT Avengers 1 auctioned on Ebay over approx. a 7 week period. All OBVIOUSLY different books by examining staple placement.

 

As I've stated in another thread (and I'm not going to waste time searching for it. You're the tribunal...you do it):

 

I don't just sell on Ebay.

Approx. 90% of my sales are RAW books

I've logged over 650 SALES of individual books on Ebay (the rest of the feedback numbers are purchases) over a three year period.

I've logged over 3000 SALES of individual books OFF Ebay.

I've had AT LEAST:

30 or more Spiderman 1

25 or more AF 15

20 or more FF 1, X-Men 1, Avengers 1&4, FF 25

I have had, to date, approx. 20 books returned that were found to have restoration.

Sounds like ALOT, doesn't it? 20 books with restoration.

 

Now, let's look at the actual breakdown:

 

3650 total books sold X approx. 90% raw = 3285 total books raw

approx 20 books returned with restoration

3285 divided by 20 (or 3285 X .05) = 164.25

 

ONE book in every 164 has been returned for restoration. That's a RAW unrestored success rate of WELL OVER 99%!!!!!

 

Can ANY seller on Ebay of predominantly UNSLABBED books claim the same success rate???

 

PS: The SHOWCASE 22 that everyone is concerned about WAS DESCRIBED IN THE TITLE AND DESCRIPTION SECTION AS RESTORED (color touched...which was the way I PURCHASED it). And the buyer was extremely pleased with the item, so as far as a disgruntled buyer story on this book...forget it! He won a minimally color touched Showcase 22 in approx. VF for approx. $700. About a seventh of what a blue label 8.0 would have cost him, and all resto was disclosed.

 

 

[Foolkiller]

Hammer:

You should know how people are going to respond to these statistics... most people will ask why then, you hide the feedback (which I know you'll say you've explained it before) and that there's no independent backing for the numbers... and the statistics... my own rationale is as I've said before, you've got to have some repeat business, so not everyone can be getting ripped off.

 

I can't believe how long this thread has gone for.

[hammer-migration]

The point is that NOBODY is getting "ripped off". Here I am, still battling with the same people over the same thing for the past year, and with the same people over the same thing in emails over the past three years. STILL selling under the same one handle I have despite all my needless enemies. Some folks started this bologna BEFORE I EVEN SOLD MY FIRST BOOK ON EBAY!!!! When I was just beginning to buy on Ebay!!! THAT's Paranoia. Nothing more. Like I said, there were 20 items sold in total that refunds were IMMEDIATELY made on LONG AFTER THE 7 DAY RETURN EXPIRED. According to scans I keep, two of the books returned were MUTILATED and I STILL took them back. Andrew said that he to return a book and HE WAS GIVEN AN IMMEDIATE REFUND. And Kevin, likewise. It happens. Thank God that such an unbiased company that is NEVER wrong about what is and what isn't restored, just as they are NEVER wrong about grade assignment (even when they reassign a different grade to a book that they've already graded before, by as much as THREE GRADES) is there to protect us all from ourselves with such unerring, machine like precision and absolute accuracy far above the abilities of mortal men.

We have 4 to 6 books mentioned in total, by Forum members, that were returned for restoration out of the TWENTY that MY records show were returned in total for found restoration (imagined or real) and ALL WERE REFUNDED UPON. And we're STILL talking about the term "ripping off"? If that don't beat all!

[lighthouse]

Hammer:

You should know how people are going to respond to these statistics...

 

Not only does Hammer know that... he also knows exactly how this thread was going to go from the start... and he is far from the only one...

 

There are at least two dozen forum members who could have quoted you play-by-play for this entire thread as soon as it began... We've all seen it before... we've all been over this again and again... A couple of us have even taken to switching sides in the discussion from thread to thread just to avoid boredom...

 

The appeal of these discussions is roughly equivalent to bad synchronized swimming... You know nothing is going to be accomplished... you know that the process will be chockful of minor miscues... and you hope deep down that at some point someone will lose it and major carnage will ensue... but you just know you're not that lucky... And at the end of the day, you are forced to wonder why you wasted so much time watching an event where the outcome was never really in doubt...

 

I'm as guilty as the next guy of channel-surfing looking for a drunk insufficiently_thoughtful_person in a wife-beater... but these hammer-meth-koos-keys threads aren't even on that level of entertainment... more like watching a Portuguese game show hoping to see accidental nipple...

[hammer-migration]

....which is why I chose to limit my involvement here in addressing every nuance of every question that has been asked and answered directly dozens of times before and just stick to a few key points that ARE provable.

[Foolkiller]

I agree that I can't believe that this is still going on... but to someone who hasn't been involved with all the emails, doesn't know you or these other guys on the board, not a dialed in heavy hitter with tens of thousands (although I probably spend $10,000 a year on comics, paltry by many of your standards, but a lot for me) to blow on a single book, don't have the vast experience that most of these guys have, still learning (even after 6 or 7 years of serious collecting) a lot...

 

I have to say that there's a lot on both sides of this story. I've heard of you being referenced before, and from many dealers I trust, that you are someone they don't trust. I've heard it on the board. When I qualify my answers it's because there's a whole lot of info floating, but to me it's just rumor until I have personal knowledge or have a front row seat with someone I know very well who goes through a transaction with you. When I say "not everyone" can be getting screwed and you respond "nobody" I question it only because to an outsider, there's stories on every side.

 

But what does it matter what I think? It really doesn't. I think people are curious about this topic (and hence why it's lingered) because they've heard your name bandied about and obviously you bring out strong emotions in people... some of whom claim you are disreputable.

 

I've repeatedly said that for purposes of this board, I'm the kind of person who prefers (maybe naively) to believe the best in people. I have no reason to doubt you, but a lot of people I trust in the comic world do... so I have to say that I remain skeptical... but again, I'm no force in the comic world just one voice... and I think the way this whole thing got started was because people were curious what the deal was.

[sfilosa]

Two questions for you Hammer:

 

1) Obviously you have sold "restored" books before as you acknowledge that fact. Assuming I believe you didn't know these were "restored", why would you continue to say in your listing "Unrestored"? Are you say you are infallible now, and that you can identify all restoration, everytime?

 

2) How would I (a bidder) ever know if you used a shill on an auction. I could buy a book from you, unrestored, and send it to CGC. If it comes back as "unrestored", than I have proof (or at least a lot of proof) that I own an unrestored book. But, I would still never know if you used a shill bidder.

 

Thanking you in advance for your response.

[chrisco37]

) Obviously you have sold "restored" books before as you acknowledge that fact. Assuming I believe you didn't know these were "restored", why would you continue to say in your listing "Unrestored"? Are you say you are infallible now, and that you can identify all restoration, everytime?

 

C'mon. This is a silly question. Put yourself in that situation. You buy a HG book from someone (with plans of flipping on eBay) who tells you nothing of any restoration. List the item with a description as you bought it, in "Unrestored Condition" (remember, the person you bought it from said nothing of restoration). You'd do the same thing.

 

Hammer has never said he is "infallable" or that he has an eagle-eye for restoration. There are hardly any of us on these boards (besides perhaps the CGC guys, and they miss it too) that could identify really good restoration. I'm not talking about taking a VG to a VF. I'm talking about minute resto. VF- to a VF/NM.

 

Why should you expect Hammer to be any different? Why should he be held to a higher standard than the rest of us. Any of us would list a HG Key as "Unrestored" if we listed it on eBay.

 

Chris

[supapimp]

But, I would still never know if you used a shill bidder.

 

best thing to do is steer clear of sellers with private feedback and private auctions, otherwise....YOU'LL BE SORRY

[supapimp]

) Obviously you have sold "restored" books before as you acknowledge that fact. Assuming I believe you didn't know these were "restored", why would you continue to say in your listing "Unrestored"? Are you say you are infallible now, and that you can identify all restoration, everytime?

 

C'mon. This is a silly question. Put yourself in that situation. You buy a HG book from someone (with plans of flipping on eBay) who tells you nothing of any restoration. List the item with a description as you bought it, in "Unrestored Condition" (remember, the person you bought it from said nothing of restoration). You'd do the same thing.

 

Hammer has never said he is "infallable" or that he has an eagle-eye for restoration. There are hardly any of us on these boards (besides perhaps the CGC guys, and they miss it too) that could identify really good restoration. I'm not talking about taking a VG to a VF. I'm talking about minute resto. VF- to a VF/NM.

 

Why should you expect Hammer to be any different? Why should he be held to a higher standard than the rest of us. Any of us would list a HG Key as "Unrestored" if we listed it on eBay.

 

Chris

 

BOLLOCKS chris! do you see any of us here that have private feedback and auctions? that's what i thought, & sborock won't even vouch for him. NUFF SAID

[chrisco37]

Chill, Pimpy. I didn't even mention the "Private Auction" issue. I simply addressed the previous poster's question about "Unrestored" in the Auction Listings.

 

Chris

[PovertyRow]

sborock won't even vouch for him. NUFF SAID

 

I knew this would be used like that, which is why I think it was stupid of Sborok to even post such an open-ended statement. If someone has some facts to back up an accusation I say use them. If not, don't make open-ended statements like this. Completely unfair and against what this board should be.

[hammer-migration]

How ironic coming from Supa-Pimp. Supa was SUSPENDED, NARUed from Ebay for SHILLING his own auctions with MULTIPLE Ebay handles. This is FACT. ASK him if you don't believe me why he was red-flagged by Ebay. Did lack of Private auctions keep Supa from shilling his own books and leaving himself STELLAR feedback on his own auctions stop him? Did lack of Private feedback stop him? NO IT DIDN'T!!

I'm shilling my own auctions...PLEASE! With what? One account? One handle?

[ArAich]

I knew this would be used like that, which is why I think it was stupid of Sborok to even post such an open-ended statement. If someone has some facts to back up an accusation I say use them. If not, don't make open-ended statements like this. Completely unfair and against what this board should be.

 

 

Ditto...

[lighthouse]

sborock won't even vouch for him. NUFF SAID

 

Actually, I doubt Steve would vouch for more than a dozen people on this forum... not that he thinks the rest are crooks, but I doubt he throws around his reputation lightly...

 

There are probably only six or seven people here whose checks I would personally guarantee at a show to another dealer... There are a good deal more than that whose checks I would accept and whose packages I would ship before those checks cleared. But it's a whole other level of trust to stake your bank account and personal reputation on someone else's rep...

 

Not a comment on hammer, supa... just a comment on how important reputation really is...

[hammer-migration]

..and I wouldn't vouch for Steve Borock (I know, a sacreligious statement to some, like RUDD, who would have been the first on line for the Kool-Aid in Jonestown!) or anyone else that I don't KNOW and have NEVER dealt with on a continued basis. That's common sense. Funny thing is, I don't remember asking for anyone's blessing, for someone to vouch for me. I don't feel the NEED to seek acceptance from "higher powers". I get along quite well without a "brown" nose. Matter of factly, I'd feel a little self-conscious walking around in public with a brown nose, but some, apparently aren't bothered in the least by it!!

[lighthouse]

I get along quite well without a "brown" nose.

 

I was gonna reply with something related to your taste in strippers... but that would have ruined the synchronized swimming that is this thread... so I'll let it go this time...