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Jerry Weist auctions up on ebay

Started by spider9698,

89 posts in this topic

westform

westform

Posted
Posted
Ok, now that you have provided us with all the relevant statistics, do you actually have an opinion on whether Romita ASM panel pages are valued realistically?

 

 

 

 

The factor that makes me agree with you, and Hari, is how expensive panel pages have become compared to covers from the same era. It blows by every rule of thumb about comparitive values. That more than anything else makes the prices feel out of whack.

 

 

 

Chris

 

Hi Chris; I question this often as well. Personally and historically I use a very broad rule of thumb when looking at pages vs. covers. It's about 10 to 1. I can't put my arms around paying 15k for a panel page when covers from the same artist/title/time go for 50 to 75k. (that's even giving the covers a high range). In my 'scientific' opinion, those Romita panel pages should be 5k to 7.5k in price. I think you would see a healthy market at that price and not just one or two guys.

 

Same holds true for Byrne Xmen pages to me. The last 3 Byrne covers have sold publically I believe for 30 to 40k... actually all in the 30's. But, pages seem to go for 4 to 15k. That doesn't make sense to me.

 

Perhaps, many collectors give up on covers as they are hard to come by and do demand a big bite out of the wallet.... so, they fight over panel pages which at this point for some artists seems to be getting silly.... or at least out of whack.

 

Just my 2 cents.... disregard all you don't agree with. wink.gif

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LuckyCantor-migration

LuckyCantor-migration

Posted
Posted

 

 

 

The #40 sold for 60K or so several years ago; not sure it changed hands again at the level you're quoting, but I could be wrong. #41 was also sold for in the 40K range, from what I recall. Again, not sure if it traded hands again after that. Spider9698 may know. Small art Romita first run covers can be had for 30K, depending on image (some would be more, of course, like Woo's #69). Second run covers are still in the 15-20K range (like DF's ASM 155 cover).

 

http://scoop.diamondgalleries.com/scoop_article.asp?ai=6369&si=121

 

Hari, The #41 just sold for 60K in the Heritage auction and the #40 sold 'in the high 5 figures'.

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Durden08

Durden08

Posted
Posted

Taking out annuals...there were 67 issues of FF that were large art Kirby pencils.

 

Romita only had 13 issues of ASM before the switch to small art.

 

If you do the math there are potentially 1340 large art Kirby FF pages that exist, and only 260 Large Art Romita ASM pages that exist.

 

Simply put Large Art ASM pags may be 3 times more expensive than Kirby Large Art FF, but the FF pages are 5 times more plentiful. Kirby art is still more expensive given availability than Romita ASM.

 

If you want to make the numbers equivalent...If the amount of potentially available material were equal, Kirby Large art FF would 70% more expensive per page than Romita Large Art ASM, based on the current price points and assuming your 3 times rule is accurate.

 

There is ALOT more Kirby FF Large Art that was created than Romita ASM Large Art...and relative supply has alot to do with marketplace pricing.

 

Chris

 

I'm rather new to OA, but have seen the terms ""large" art and "small" art tossed around on Silver age stuff. I assume large art is approx 12 x 17 like modern art is, but what are the measurements of the small stuff? Also, if anyone knows why there were different sizes I'd like to hear it. Thanks.

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rob_react

rob_react

Posted
Posted

Taking out annuals...there were 67 issues of FF that were large art Kirby pencils.

 

Romita only had 13 issues of ASM before the switch to small art.

 

If you do the math there are potentially 1340 large art Kirby FF pages that exist, and only 260 Large Art Romita ASM pages that exist.

 

Simply put Large Art ASM pags may be 3 times more expensive than Kirby Large Art FF, but the FF pages are 5 times more plentiful. Kirby art is still more expensive given availability than Romita ASM.

 

If you want to make the numbers equivalent...If the amount of potentially available material were equal, Kirby Large art FF would 70% more expensive per page than Romita Large Art ASM, based on the current price points and assuming your 3 times rule is accurate.

 

There is ALOT more Kirby FF Large Art that was created than Romita ASM Large Art...and relative supply has alot to do with marketplace pricing.

 

Chris

 

I'm rather new to OA, but have seen the terms ""large" art and "small" art tossed around on Silver age stuff. I assume large art is approx 12 x 17 like modern art is, but what are the measurements of the small stuff? Also, if anyone knows why there were different sizes I'd like to hear it. Thanks.

 

11 by 17 (with an image area of around 10 by 15) IS the small stuff. Just the image area on large art is bigger than that (12.5 by 18.5.) The paper size varies, I think.

 

As to why, I've always assumed it was a cost cutting move. Larger paper is simply more expensive than smaller paper. But that is 100% just a guess.

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Durden08

Durden08

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Posted

11 by 17 (with an image area of around 10 by 15) IS the small stuff. Just the image area on large art is bigger than that (12.5 by 18.5.) The paper size varies, I think.

 

As to why, I've always assumed it was a cost cutting move. Larger paper is simply more expensive than smaller paper. But that is 100% just a guess.

 

Interesting stuff. Thanks for the info thumbsup2.gif

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adamstrange

adamstrange

Posted
Posted

Taking out annuals...there were 67 issues of FF that were large art Kirby pencils.

 

Romita only had 13 issues of ASM before the switch to small art.

 

If you do the math there are potentially 1340 large art Kirby FF pages that exist, and only 260 Large Art Romita ASM pages that exist.

 

Simply put Large Art ASM pags may be 3 times more expensive than Kirby Large Art FF, but the FF pages are 5 times more plentiful. Kirby art is still more expensive given availability than Romita ASM.

 

If you want to make the numbers equivalent...If the amount of potentially available material were equal, Kirby Large art FF would 70% more expensive per page than Romita Large Art ASM, based on the current price points and assuming your 3 times rule is accurate.

 

There is ALOT more Kirby FF Large Art that was created than Romita ASM Large Art...and relative supply has alot to do with marketplace pricing.

 

Chris

 

I'm rather new to OA, but have seen the terms ""large" art and "small" art tossed around on Silver age stuff. I assume large art is approx 12 x 17 like modern art is, but what are the measurements of the small stuff? Also, if anyone knows why there were different sizes I'd like to hear it. Thanks.

 

11 by 17 (with an image area of around 10 by 15) IS the small stuff. Just the image area on large art is bigger than that (12.5 by 18.5.) The paper size varies, I think.

 

As to why, I've always assumed it was a cost cutting move. Larger paper is simply more expensive than smaller paper. But that is 100% just a guess.

 

The switch to "small art" is due to Murphy Anderson, who has incredible precision and likes drawing on smaller pages. He received permission from DC to go to a smaller size page in 66 (I may be off by year). Subsequently the printer told DC that they could prepare 2 pages of the small size art at the same time and save money. DC then switched all of their artist to the smaller size paper, followed by Marvel.

 

Art from the 40s and 50s is generally large sized, but it can vary to where some covers are drawn actual size.

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rob_react

rob_react

Posted
Posted

Taking out annuals...there were 67 issues of FF that were large art Kirby pencils.

 

Romita only had 13 issues of ASM before the switch to small art.

 

If you do the math there are potentially 1340 large art Kirby FF pages that exist, and only 260 Large Art Romita ASM pages that exist.

 

Simply put Large Art ASM pags may be 3 times more expensive than Kirby Large Art FF, but the FF pages are 5 times more plentiful. Kirby art is still more expensive given availability than Romita ASM.

 

If you want to make the numbers equivalent...If the amount of potentially available material were equal, Kirby Large art FF would 70% more expensive per page than Romita Large Art ASM, based on the current price points and assuming your 3 times rule is accurate.

 

There is ALOT more Kirby FF Large Art that was created than Romita ASM Large Art...and relative supply has alot to do with marketplace pricing.

 

Chris

 

I'm rather new to OA, but have seen the terms ""large" art and "small" art tossed around on Silver age stuff. I assume large art is approx 12 x 17 like modern art is, but what are the measurements of the small stuff? Also, if anyone knows why there were different sizes I'd like to hear it. Thanks.

 

11 by 17 (with an image area of around 10 by 15) IS the small stuff. Just the image area on large art is bigger than that (12.5 by 18.5.) The paper size varies, I think.

 

As to why, I've always assumed it was a cost cutting move. Larger paper is simply more expensive than smaller paper. But that is 100% just a guess.

 

The switch to "small art" is due to Murphy Anderson, who has incredible precision and likes drawing on smaller pages. He received permission from DC to go to a smaller size page in 66 (I may be off by year). Subsequently the printer told DC that they could prepare 2 pages of the small size art at the same time and save money. DC then switched all of their artist to the smaller size paper, followed by Marvel.

 

Art from the 40s and 50s is generally large sized, but it can vary to where some covers are drawn actual size.

 

So cool. Thanks.

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Mister Trent

Mister Trent

Posted
Posted

Taking out annuals...there were 67 issues of FF that were large art Kirby pencils.

 

Romita only had 13 issues of ASM before the switch to small art.

 

If you do the math there are potentially 1340 large art Kirby FF pages that exist, and only 260 Large Art Romita ASM pages that exist.

 

Simply put Large Art ASM pags may be 3 times more expensive than Kirby Large Art FF, but the FF pages are 5 times more plentiful. Kirby art is still more expensive given availability than Romita ASM.

 

If you want to make the numbers equivalent...If the amount of potentially available material were equal, Kirby Large art FF would 70% more expensive per page than Romita Large Art ASM, based on the current price points and assuming your 3 times rule is accurate.

 

There is ALOT more Kirby FF Large Art that was created than Romita ASM Large Art...and relative supply has alot to do with marketplace pricing.

 

Chris

 

I'm rather new to OA, but have seen the terms ""large" art and "small" art tossed around on Silver age stuff. I assume large art is approx 12 x 17 like modern art is, but what are the measurements of the small stuff? Also, if anyone knows why there were different sizes I'd like to hear it. Thanks.

 

11 by 17 (with an image area of around 10 by 15) IS the small stuff. Just the image area on large art is bigger than that (12.5 by 18.5.) The paper size varies, I think.

 

As to why, I've always assumed it was a cost cutting move. Larger paper is simply more expensive than smaller paper. But that is 100% just a guess.

 

The switch to "small art" is due to Murphy Anderson, who has incredible precision and likes drawing on smaller pages. He received permission from DC to go to a smaller size page in 66 (I may be off by year). Subsequently the printer told DC that they could prepare 2 pages of the small size art at the same time and save money. DC then switched all of their artist to the smaller size paper, followed by Marvel.

 

Art from the 40s and 50s is generally large sized, but it can vary to where some covers are drawn actual size.

 

Johnny Craig and John Severin's later EC art (from the 1950s) was illustrated at a smaller size (image size of 12" x 9"). I've also had a Jack Davis story from MAD # 18 (comic-book) that was illustrated 12" x 9".

 

Craig and Severin actually preferred illustrating at this smaller size, and with the advent of both artists assuming greater Editorial responsibility of the titles they took over (VAULT OF HORROR, EXTRA! [Craig] and THE NEW TWO-FISTED TALES [severin]), they allowed themselves to illustrate their own art on smaller-sized art boards.

 

And outside of the USA, British artist Frank Hampson switched from illustrating DAN DARE at a Large Size, to Same Size (as the printed page) during the latter half of the 1950s. If you really want to see cameo-like precision in a piece of small-sized original art, have a look-see at some of the late-1950s Hampson DARE originals (examples are up in my CAF Galleries) . . .

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adamstrange

adamstrange

Posted
Posted

Taking out annuals...there were 67 issues of FF that were large art Kirby pencils.

 

Romita only had 13 issues of ASM before the switch to small art.

 

If you do the math there are potentially 1340 large art Kirby FF pages that exist, and only 260 Large Art Romita ASM pages that exist.

 

Simply put Large Art ASM pags may be 3 times more expensive than Kirby Large Art FF, but the FF pages are 5 times more plentiful. Kirby art is still more expensive given availability than Romita ASM.

 

If you want to make the numbers equivalent...If the amount of potentially available material were equal, Kirby Large art FF would 70% more expensive per page than Romita Large Art ASM, based on the current price points and assuming your 3 times rule is accurate.

 

There is ALOT more Kirby FF Large Art that was created than Romita ASM Large Art...and relative supply has alot to do with marketplace pricing.

 

Chris

 

I'm rather new to OA, but have seen the terms ""large" art and "small" art tossed around on Silver age stuff. I assume large art is approx 12 x 17 like modern art is, but what are the measurements of the small stuff? Also, if anyone knows why there were different sizes I'd like to hear it. Thanks.

 

11 by 17 (with an image area of around 10 by 15) IS the small stuff. Just the image area on large art is bigger than that (12.5 by 18.5.) The paper size varies, I think.

 

As to why, I've always assumed it was a cost cutting move. Larger paper is simply more expensive than smaller paper. But that is 100% just a guess.

 

The switch to "small art" is due to Murphy Anderson, who has incredible precision and likes drawing on smaller pages. He received permission from DC to go to a smaller size page in 66 (I may be off by year). Subsequently the printer told DC that they could prepare 2 pages of the small size art at the same time and save money. DC then switched all of their artist to the smaller size paper, followed by Marvel.

 

Art from the 40s and 50s is generally large sized, but it can vary to where some covers are drawn actual size.

 

Johnny Craig and John Severin's later EC art (from the 1950s) was illustrated at a smaller size (image size of 12" x 9"). I've also had a Jack Davis story from MAD # 18 (comic-book) that was illustrated 12" x 9".

 

Craig and Severin actually preferred illustrating at this smaller size, and with the advent of both artists assuming greater Editorial responsibility of the titles they took over (VAULT OF HORROR, EXTRA! [Craig] and THE NEW TWO-FISTED TALES [severin]), they allowed themselves to illustrate their own art on smaller-sized art boards.

 

And outside of the USA, British artist Frank Hampson switched from illustrating DAN DARE at a Large Size, to Same Size (as the printed page) during the latter half of the 1950s. If you really want to see cameo-like precision in a piece of small-sized original art, have a look-see at some of the late-1950s Hampson DARE originals (examples are up in my CAF Galleries) . . .

 

I almost mentioned that Severin seemed to like the small size as well. I saw three Atlas 50s stories by him that were all different sizes of art paper, none of them 2x. The Raboy cover of Cap Jr tearing up a Japanese aircraft carrier was the same size as the comic cover.

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