Grading by the Ages

[Black Hawk]

Do you tend to grade differently depending on the age of the book?

For example do you have different standards for GA vs SA vs BA vs MA?

Are you more forgiving of early Marvels than you are DC's from the same period?

Is color gloss not as important on GA books as it is BA books?

Do you knock down a soiled BA book more then you would a GA book?

I know my feeling on the subject but I'd like to hear from some of you as to your thoughts on this.

[thedarkknight]

Some people might, but I don't. I personally believe a Near Mint (9.4) is a Near Mint (9.4) no matter how old.

 

I think the reason there is a sliding scale because there are some people who can't accept that older books may not exist in higher than Very Fine 8.0 or lower. This causes them not to buy some beautiful copies because it is not Near Mint (9.4). That would cause some dealers to be more forgiving on older books.

 

Personally, I don't think it should matter. Comics are fragile and will age no matter what we do.

[Pirate]

Some people might, but I don't. I personally believe a Near Mint (9.4) is a Near Mint (9.4) no matter how old.

 

I think the reason there is a sliding scale because there are some people who can't accept that older books may not exist in higher than Very Fine 8.0 or lower. This causes them not to buy some beautiful copies because it is not Near Mint (9.4). That would cause some dealers to be more forgiving on older books.

 

Personally, I don't think it should matter. Comics are fragile and will age no matter what we do.

 

agree

[KingOfRulers]

I grade all comics on the same scale, where 1 day old or 80 years old. I agree that people are just in denial because there is no Action Comics #1 above VF. Really, if you think about it that would just make the true higher graded copies (if there are any out there above the current top copy) all that more valuable when they are found. It doesn't matter what type of paper they were printed on, or whatever these guys try and pedal us. Grade a book what it is.

 

To skew a grade for a book because of age is to purposely give it the incorrect grade.

[Comicdey]

I grade all comics on the same scale, where 1 day old or 80 years old. I agree that people are just in denial because there is no Action Comics #1 above VF. Really, if you think about it that would just make the true higher graded copies (if there are any out there above the current top copy) all that more valuable when they are found. It doesn't matter what type of paper they were printed on, or whatever these guys try and pedal us. Grade a book what it is.

 

To screw a grade for a book because of age is to purposely give it the incorrect grade.

 

I've seen people skew grades my entire time collecting. I never realized you could screw them. No wonder there are so many 40 year old virgin comic collectors out there. There all too busy with their hobby. Be careful with this hobby King.....you'll be 40 someday.

 

Oh yeah, I grade them all the same.

 

A NM GA book is an amazing thing of beauty. A NM SA book is a treasure to behold, A NM bronze is a nice surprise out of the comic box, and a NM Copper is better than investing in bullion (copper that is). If the Moderns aren't NM, then you'd better be enjoying the hobby by reading, because that's the true value of comic anyway.

[the blob]

well, given that nowadays CGC decides these things, there definitely is a sliding scale in that they're much more lenient for GA books. I look at some GA books I bought from tight grading dealers like 10-12 years ago that say "Good+" or "G/VG" on the mylar and I seriously wonder if they wouldn't come back 4.5 - 6.5 if I sent them in. Whereas some people got burned buying "high grade" BA and late SA books 10 years ago that turn out to be VF+ses now, the opposite is arguably true for people buying low/mid grade GA from the right sellers back then.

[Comicdey]

well, given that nowadays CGC decides these things, there definitely is a sliding scale in that they're much more lenient for GA books. I look at some GA books I bought from tight grading dealers like 10-12 years ago that say "Good+" or "G/VG" on the mylar and I seriously wonder if they wouldn't come back 4.5 - 6.5 if I sent them in. Whereas some people got burned buying "high grade" BA and late SA books 10 years ago that turn out to be VF+ses now, the opposite is arguably true for people buying low/mid grade GA from the right sellers back then.

 

I'll have to submit quite a few to see the sliding scale, and that's not something I need/want to do. At least I understand their approach with more surface area on a GA book that can handle more defects and still grade the same or better than it's modern, tiny page count counterpart. Also the production issues of the ages makes some sense. As I said GA

[Guest]

Whereas some people got burned buying "high grade" BA and late SA books 10 years ago that turn out to be VF+ses now, the opposite is arguably true for people buying low/mid grade GA from the right sellers back then.

 

Ain't that the all too painful truth!!

[drbanner]

Do you tend to grade differently depending on the age of the book?

For example do you have different standards for GA vs SA vs BA vs MA?

Are you more forgiving of early Marvels than you are DC's from the same period?

Is color gloss not as important on GA books as it is BA books?

Do you knock down a soiled BA book more then you would a GA book?

I know my feeling on the subject but I'd like to hear from some of you as to your thoughts on this.

The question is both an oldie, and a goodie! Click here if you want to read more on the subject from a previous thread, but here's my take on it:

 

I believe the apparent differences in grading standards has more to do with the physical construction of the book than the age of the book.

 

For example, on an otherwise NM book, what do you think the grade falls to with a 1/4" corner crease for an early GA (big!) book, a SA book, a Modern, and what about a Treasury? Is the affect on the grade related to the absolute magnitude of the crease, or the relative magnitude? I think it's the relative magnitude.

 

In addition to size differences, there are also differences in the quality of the paper and ink layers, the printing/production method (squarebounds, page count, # of staples), how the materials degrade, and numerous other factors which make the set of defects (and their affect on grade) for each genre/age unique.

 

Some argue that grading standards should not change based on age, but the reality is that the set of defects which must be considered when assigning a grade is different from book to book (mostly due to the age, but not by definition), so by necessity, the grading criteria is different.

[Anfield Fox]

Everytime i see this thread i keep mis-reading the title as "Grading by the Apes"

[drbanner]

Everytime i see this thread i keep mis-reading the title as "Grading by the Apes"

 

You looking for the PGX thread?

[KingOfRulers]

 

I've seen people skew grades my entire time collecting. I never realized you could screw them. No wonder there are so many 40 year old virgin comic collectors out there. There all too busy with their hobby. Be careful with this hobby King.....you'll be 40 someday.

 

Oh yeah, I grade them all the same.

 

A NM GA book is an amazing thing of beauty. A NM SA book is a treasure to behold, A NM bronze is a nice surprise out of the comic box, and a NM Copper is better than investing in bullion (copper that is). If the Moderns aren't NM, then you'd better be enjoying the hobby by reading, because that's the true value of comic anyway.

 

, woops. I edited that out.

 

But that does raise a good question. Do you screw your books all the same?

[Black Hawk]

Some argue that grading standards should not change based on age, but the reality is that the set of defects which must be considered when assigning a grade is different from book to book (mostly due to the age, but not by definition), so by necessity, the grading criteria is different.

My observations on this supports your statement. Almost everyone states that they don't grade differently based on age, but a little bit of time going back through the threads here shows a different story. An early Marvel with blunted corners will often be graded high whereas a bronze or modern book would be more heavily dinged for such a defect.

[burntboy]

i believe that there is a curve whether done purposely or not...........

 

and i don't personally have a problem with that. someone just popped an Action 30 or something up in the grading forum and it just stopped me cold, the FC was so well preserved..............i would definitely cut a book, almost 70 years old, a small break.................

[Korvac Saga]

Everytime i see this thread i keep mis-reading the title as "Grading by the Apes"

 

You looking for the PGX thread?

 

 

[Comicdey]

i believe that there is a curve whether done purposely or not...........

 

and i don't personally have a problem with that. someone just popped an Action 30 or something up in the grading forum and it just stopped me cold, the FC was so well preserved..............i would definitely cut a book, almost 70 years old, a small break.................

 

was that my action 30 or someone else recently?

[Black Hawk]

Everytime i see this thread i keep mis-reading the title as "Grading by the Apes"

[divad]

Everytime i see this thread i keep mis-reading the title as "Grading by the Apes"

 

[Anfield Fox]

LMAO! CLASSIC!!

[whomerjay]

well, given that nowadays CGC decides these things, there definitely is a sliding scale in that they're much more lenient for GA books. I look at some GA books I bought from tight grading dealers like 10-12 years ago that say "Good+" or "G/VG" on the mylar and I seriously wonder if they wouldn't come back 4.5 - 6.5 if I sent them in. Whereas some people got burned buying "high grade" BA and late SA books 10 years ago that turn out to be VF+ses now, the opposite is arguably true for people buying low/mid grade GA from the right sellers back then.

 

I agree we have CGC to blame for instituting a slding scale with age, with the result being we have some dealers now grading like CGC and calling G books 4.0-5.0 whereas others are still calling a G a G. Why not just grade all books the same way and recognize that many GA books in 8.0 are tough to come by? That's much easier to figure out than guessing why CGC would inflate a grade on one book and not another.

 

I am totally dumfounded by some of the grades CGC assigns GA books. Particularly with keys. Books with a significant piece of the cover torn off or a cup of coffee spilled on them getting 3.0-3.5. Sorry, nice structure can't make up for what looks like someone took a dump on the book. I can understand a book that looks undergraded- there's the possibility that the insides of the book have a problem one cannot see through the slab. But certainly visible flaws on a book equate to a maximum grade which is often exceeded, especially on GA and on keys.