Obadiah Oldbuck vs. Superman

[ArnoldTBlumberg]

No, not at all Bob, it's OK. I don't think it's my place to comment on things Gemstone per se anymore, but as I'm still the co-author of the Grading Guide and aware of the fact that there was never any intent as some have claimed on the boards, I thought it worth clarifying. People always love conspiracies; they even see them where there aren't any.

[Aman619]

yeah. I know what you mean. Im wondering how you always manage to pop up only when these questions are asked. You got a hot line somehwre tells you wake up and squash that "rumor"???

[ShoNuff-migration]

I am not after sensationalism.

 

I imagine you found it much easier to spend 20 grand than a bunch of sensationalism.

 

 

no offense, but so what? i know who i am, i am what i am

 

Straight from the horses mouth...it's official.

 

Bob Beerbohm is Popeye.

 

 

...and i have no agenda to try to force prices up on anything in the comics world.

 

[Earl Davis]

Giffle IS stating the rules as they existed before Bob's new research. It has been Bob's ten year journey that has unearthed new, much earlier examples that have satisfied him that they trylu are comicbooks. But Giffle and others are not yet convinced. And, lets face it, both camps paint themselves intp corners that , I feel, lead to explanations like the ones about GIJoe etc that are strained at best.

 

IMO, Bob has proven a progression to the comic book format we enjoy today. And dated it way further back than was thought 60 years ago when the GA surge of success led to questions and answers to explain the new comics phenomenon. And it is their (often self-serving) statements that were handed down unchallenged til now. But, I still see this as a missing link kind of situation. Im not convinced its OO. But it seems it may not ne Yellow Kid either since it doesnt look remarkably different from OO to me.

 

But, if we are talking first comic book as we see it NOW in 2006 Im leaning to somewhere or something in the 1930s when the physical product finally settled on the format that has lasted since then. Everything before in an ancestor of varying resemblance.

 

And, I came up with this opinion after doing absolutely no hands on research!!! aint I grand?

 

None of this is new. I was reading about all this stuff in the comics history books I read in the 70’s and 80’s as a kid. What Bob did is put the early comics into the Overstreet guide, which had previously been out of line with the books by Kunzle, Horn, Gifford, Clarke, Seissine and many others that had already covered the early comics.

[Scrooge]

What Bob did is put the early comics into the Overstreet guide, which had previously been out of line with the books by Kunzle, Horn, Gifford, Clarke, Sesine and many others that had already covered the early comics.

 

Speaking of, what is you guys' opinion on the quality of the Seissine book?

[ArnoldTBlumberg]

yeah. I know what you mean. Im wondering how you always manage to pop up only when these questions are asked. You got a hot line somehwre tells you wake up and squash that "rumor"???

 

It's not hard to find, and if you'd been paying attention you'd know I've already been participating on this thread before.

 

Besides, the kind of weird garbage some people spout on here is so painfully predictable I could set my watch by it.

[Aman619]

see, thats why I hate that laughing emoticon. Its too harsh and reads like a baiting laugh AT someone. I typed l o l which appears as but (to me) just means Im kidding. Im not well versed in them, so I suppose I should use the other one I know, the simple : ) from now on. But I was asking in a friendly way, not attacking you. But I just wonder sometimes why many people here are content to mostly just read and occasionally post a response. And that they must keep up pretty well cause they seem to know just when to speak up... so it sseems (kinda) that they get some kind of beeper going that alerts them to respond... cause anytime Oversteet is talked about, you are there in a Flash! thats all.

[BLBcomics-migration]

Arnold was my editor on the first 8 or 9 of the Plat and then Plat and expando Vict history articles a swell as the history of the modern comic book, which no one seems to mind it being in the Guide,

 

Nor has any one ever disputed the origin stories presented therein re the 1933 up comic book companies. So i must be doing something correct in that era.

 

Likewise, no one has ever disputed very much (other than minor technicalities) about the Plat history article and price index.

 

Only when we extended the history back even further, after so much stuff from the 1800s was being unearthed, dusted off and figured out where why who it came from have minor outcries erupted. And the most vocal have come on these CGC boards.

 

Arnold and I went round & round as he patiently explained the concept of leding the lines and other tricks of the trade to make the book look uniform. [i have asked him to come back to the Guide and edit the section i compile, but i am sure he has his hands full with GEM, Geppi's Entertainment Museum, which is doing a Grand Opening the day before the upcoming Baltimore Comicon.]

 

Me, i wanted to cram in as much data, pics and stuff into each essay as humanly possible, most of the time laboring for hours to figure out what to leave out.

 

And he would listen as i explained each year why i needed more space to expand the story - only once did i have to go to John Snyder to get the page expansion i needed - and that was the year before the OPG expanded into its larger size, when space was at a dire premium

 

I think it logical that the small grading section in OPG be bumped out and a stand alone grading guide be the way to go. But i see the argument to be made that new collectors might be clueless and at a loss -

 

Arnold's last post here last week was wondering what color the sky is -

 

bob beerbohm

[BLBcomics-migration]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...A%3AIT&rd=1

 

THE ADVENTURES OF OBADIAH OLDBUCK (#320020507032)

 

2nd printing 1849 missing just the front cover

 

After a discussion on my Plat list, we figured out this is complete,

it never came with a hard cover originally - the page count will read 84 next Guide

 

- the 92 page count data in the current Guide was from counting a hard cover and blank end papers in a rebound copy that had a hard cover added

 

- a mistake had been made back when we were first creating the Victorian section

 

- and I will fix it in the next Guide

 

I might bid on it now - it is truly rare, maybe rarer than the 1842 first printing

[ShoNuff-migration]

[comicdonna]

You stated, that you are willing to pay $25,000 for an OO in VG condition. If I find one, are you giong to give me a $5,000 finders fee?

 

sure....but I wouldn't go around thinking you're $5k richer too quickly. There is nothing harder to find in the entire comic book marketplace than Victorian and Platinum Age keys. You could look for an Oldbuck 1st printing for the rest of your life and never find one ( not that you would do that...just an example ).

 

I get asked by other collectors from time to time why I don't just buy Golden or Silver Age books...easier to find, pricing is easy to figure out, they can be graded by CGC as their size is standardized, etc, etc. The answer is, I've been down that road, and it was very unrewarding for me.(mentally - not finacnially) Books that exist in the hundreds, thousands, and 10,000's of thousand do not excite me. What excites me is a 100+ year old key ( very important--I only deal in keys), that may have 6-8 copies known to exist, and after years of searching, 1 comes on the market...that's what really does it for me.

 

So go out there and find me an 1842 Brother Jonathan Obadiah Oldbuck, and you will have your finders fee.....you will have earned it, that's for sure. I'll keep my eyes open.

[comicdonna]

Giffle IS stating the rules as they existed before Bob's new research. It has been Bob's ten year journey that has unearthed new, much earlier examples that have satisfied him that they trylu are comicbooks. But Giffle and others are not yet convinced. And, lets face it, both camps paint themselves intp corners that , I feel, lead to explanations like the ones about GIJoe etc that are strained at best.

 

IMO, Bob has proven a progression to the comic book format we enjoy today. And dated it way further back than was thought 60 years ago when the GA surge of success led to questions and answers to explain the new comics phenomenon. And it is their (often self-serving) statements that were handed down unchallenged til now. But, I still see this as a missing link kind of situation. Im not convinced its OO. But it seems it may not ne Yellow Kid either since it doesnt look remarkably different from OO to me.

 

But, if we are talking first comic book as we see it NOW in 2006 Im leaning to somewhere or something in the 1930s when the physical product finally settled on the format that has lasted since then. Everything before in an ancestor of varying resemblance.

 

And, I came up with this opinion after doing absolutely no hands on research!!! aint I grand?

Ok aman you have chose a decade. Now, which book?

[Aman619]

well, I'd have to do some reading and research, wouldnt I? I'd rather fly by the seat of my pants, so somewhere in there when comics arrived at their "final" format: glossy covers, newsprint interiors, stories with dialogue and panels, and sold on newstands. Makes sense to me.... even while acknowledging that stories with "comics" were appearing for decades already before this format came along. (after all, mankind learned to tell stories with words and pictures centuries ago...) My strongest reasons are based on the fact that this format has not changed in 70 years; which sounds to me like the mutating had finally settled on a successful format. And it's the same format we have all collected, and have been called "comics" by everyone... isnt it?

 

You know it when you see it!

[comicdonna]

You have always been one to play it safe. Step out on the limb just this once.

[BLBcomics-migration]

 

Oh, come on now, Li'l Sho'Nuff, such a LAME Popeye shot. We can do better than that:

 

See the Li'l Feller wit one toof in the lower right corner, sez he be Li'l Sho'Nuff, yucking it up

 

and then when Li'l Sho'Nuff got bigger, badder and older, he got into the ring with Popeye:

[ShoNuff-migration]

Here's a comic about the first American comic collector. I've recently determined it's worth about a bazillion dollars. How many should I put you down for?

 

[BLBcomics-migration]

i do not collect over-printed new stuff - gotsa ta be pre 1940

 

That must be you in the lower left corner?

[ShoNuff-migration]

i do not collect over-printed new stuff - gotsa ta be pre 1940

It's not over-printed new stuff. It's a comic about the first American Comic collector. It's actually worth about $3,000...but I'll let you have a copy for a measly $20,000.

 

That must be you in the lower left corner?

Actually, I'm not sure who that is.

 

He's not acting like a pompous windbag and spewing childish insults, so at least we know it's not supposed to be you.

[esquirecomics]

I think it has been made perfectly clear that some posters, particularly in this thread, do not especially like one another. So be it.

 

But the fact of the matter is that FINALLY the thread is now more of a substantive discussion so how about knocking it off with the insults and intentionally picking fights. And I am directing this at multiple people.

 

Take it to the General Section or via PMs if you want to continue the childish behavior.

 

 

[rodan57]

well, I'd have to do some reading and research, wouldnt I? I'd rather fly by the seat of my pants, so somewhere in there when comics arrived at their "final" format: glossy covers, newsprint interiors, stories with dialogue and panels, and sold on newstands. Makes sense to me.... even while acknowledging that stories with "comics" were appearing for decades already before this format came along. (after all, mankind learned to tell stories with words and pictures centuries ago...) My strongest reasons are based on the fact that this format has not changed in 70 years; which sounds to me like the mutating had finally settled on a successful format. And it's the same format we have all collected, and have been called "comics" by everyone... isnt it?

 

You know it when you see it!

 

I have been reading this for awhile and this post sums up my understanding.

 

I see the word 'book' as problematic in this discussion. If what we know today as comic books had been called comic 'magazines' since the thirties, would all these very early Victorian and platinum comic publications simply be comic 'books' and prototypes to the comic 'magazine'?