The Crowley Copies - Pedigree or Time Warp?

[whomerjay]

I'm not sure how much of this thread is serious, but I've gotten the impression that Cowley is a nice but mid-tier pedigree, known for having a lot of books not all great and many with lesser PQ. And I believe they only command a small premium, whereas MH commands 2-5X. I sense Timely is correct in that many (most?)MHs are prob not read, but regardless, that a Cowley copy would be unread would not make it any more competitive with a MH copy. ??

[Forbush-Man]

If you offered me the same book in the same grade from either pedigree, I'd take the MH every time.

[Thegoldenage]

I don't think he is missing the point. Most MH's are still unread even 30 years after they were found. Most MH's have always been too expensive to be reader copies. I owned numerous MH's that had the pages still stuck together from the printing process and were unread.

West

 

I think LearnedHands point was that there was very little to no chance that the Fawcett Crowley's have been read, which makes them virgin copies. The chain of possession is also well known. This is not so with Mile High's, which were scattered for many years. As a result, some of the Mile High's were damaged, restored, now have rusted staples, you name it. I too have owned many Mile High's, and with the small exception of your stuck pages example, there is no way to know which ones were read and which ones weren't.

[adamstrange]

There are thousands and thousands of Dell File Copies. Same with Harvey.

 

Not sure what this thread is really about but if un-readedness is important to you then I guess these and the Crowleys are a good thing.

[Scrooge]

There are thousands and thousands of Dell File Copies. Same with Harvey.

 

Not sure what this thread is really about but if un-readedness is important to you then I guess these and the Crowleys are a good thing.

 

And don't forget to put the Gaines file copies in that category.

[rodan57]

To return to the time warp concept for just a moment .. one would need to argue that the slabbed books remain unread, but not untouched in the unopened sense, as every book needed to be opened for a completeness/page count check at CGC... might take away some of the mystique.

 

Then again one might argue that grading a submission is not the same as enjoying a comic book. To be the first to read a book, using it in the way intended by the publisher, can take you back in time.

 

I also collect Nero Wolfe HCs and opening and reading a copy (even a BCE) makes me think of a time when readers eagerly awaited the newest installment from Rex Stout.

 

Dennis

[LearnedHand]

Lou Fine - Yes, two substantial releases is a fair description. The majority were Fawcetts and, as I mentioned, litigation between the purchaser and the Crowley estate meant that the Fawcett books only changed hands approximately 1.5 years ago. As many know, Wendell Crowley purchased (from the newsstand) books from most other publishers, so those books do not represent the cream of the crop. The Fawcetts, however, are very different. Pristine copies went into stacks directly from the print shop. That’s why very many are technically flawless and represent the highest graded copies.

 

Timely – I am curious about your comments relative to the MHs also being “untouched” en masse. Clearly, Rozanski, Anderson, Geppi, and Verzyl all handled, leafed through, and graded the MH collection. And don’t forget Snyder. He did all this and he also put color touch and glue on some of them. And we all know that some have been pressed and dry-cleaned too. Additionally, very many have changed hands repeatedly in the 30 years since emerging. I can tell you that I have easily flipped through several hundred MHs and own/have owned more than several – and I’ve read every single one I’ve ever owned (and I doubt I’m unique). Compare this to the Crowleys – they were never even on the newsstand; they went from the print shop into stacks; they went from the stacks into slabs. Curious how you compare the two collections as equivalent in this regard.

 

And yes, ciorac IS missing the point, as are a few others. I own MHs and know what they are/represent. But this isn’t another “what pedigree is the best” thread. So saying the MHs are “better” is a popular but irrelevant statement. My point simply was that it was a slight head-trip to think I may have been the first person to ever read the 65-year old book sitting in my hands. I had that same feeling when I bought my first Gaines books, except I knew that Cochran and Overstreet both pawed over each book and that many traded hands before being slabbed.

[nochips]

I have owned hundreds of Pedigree boks. I never read one of them. If I want to read a book, I find a mid grade copy and crack it open. That's just me.

[The Black Hand ®]

Interesting....this whole mystique around being the first to read a copy of a book doesn't resonate with me. When I read a golden age comic, I often wonder how many different people have read it before me....who bought it off the newstand...who did it get loaned or traded to....did a serviceman carry it overseas....how many escapes...how many day dreamers read and loved the comic. Where are they now...what became of them...do their children read comics.Having said all that...I'd love to have a butt-load of pedigrees and be the first to read them.

[Ivanko]

I guess I see the value in both sides.

 

Being able to be the first and only to read a 60 yo book is pretty special, yet so is reading a mid-low grade book that is probably in the shape it's in because it brought a kid happiness.

 

At least that's how I'd like to think anyway!

[lou_fine]

Most MH's are still unread even 30 years after they were found. Most MH's have always been too expensive to be reader copies. I owned numerous MH's that had the pages still stuck together from the printing process and were unread.

 

West

 

West;

 

How did you know the pages were still stuck together?

 

Did you go and popped open those virgin pages in all your Edgar Church books.

[Timely]

Most MH's are still unread even 30 years after they were found. Most MH's have always been too expensive to be reader copies. I owned numerous MH's that had the pages still stuck together from the printing process and were unread.

 

West

 

West;

 

How did you know the pages were still stuck together?

 

Did you go and popped open those virgin pages in all your Edgar Church books.

 

Obvoiusly every CGC graded MH has been opened, page by page, but none have been read.

 

Gary Carter told me once about a guy who went behind his both in San Diego and started looking at somwe of his MH's on the wall. Gary was talking to other people when the guy said, "Hey Gary, the pages are sticking together...this book has never been opened."

Gary's reply was, "Not anymore."

 

TEASER....

 

In the Pedigree book I am writing on MH's I'll tell you what book it was

 

West

[bluechip]

You're right about the time warp thing. I read a crowley book and accidentally prevented myself from being born

[batman_fan]

You're right about the time warp thing. I read a crowley book and accidentally prevented myself from being born

 

wait, if you were never born how did you just post this, oh man my mind is being blown.

[PUNYHUMAN]

Interesting tidbit. thanks for the info.

[Straw-Man]

Mile Highs are the pinnacle.

 

I think you are missing the point of LearnedHand's comments.

 

I don't think he is missing the point. Most MH's are still unread even 30 years after they were found. Most MH's have always been too expensive to be reader copies. I owned numerous MH's that had the pages still stuck together from the printing process and were unread.

 

West

 

west, if you're talking about those ones i had, it wasn't from the printing process.

[ciorac]

Mile Highs are the pinnacle.

 

I think you are missing the point of LearnedHand's comments.

 

I don't think he is missing the point. Most MH's are still unread even 30 years after they were found. Most MH's have always been too expensive to be reader copies. I owned numerous MH's that had the pages still stuck together from the printing process and were unread.

 

West

 

west, if you're talking about those ones i had, it wasn't from the printing process.

 

[bluechip]

You're right about the time warp thing. I read a crowley book and accidentally prevented myself from being born

 

wait, if you were never born how did you just post this, oh man my mind is being blown.

 

 

I am postrig from an alternate universe in which I was not prevented from being born. Things are pretty much the same here except posting is more trouble because we only have dial up. You'd think president gore would have done something about internet speeds but I guess he's busy what with the artificial ozone shield and all..

[skybolt]

Mile Highs are the pinnacle.

 

I think you are missing the point of LearnedHand's comments.

 

I don't think he is missing the point. Most MH's are still unread even 30 years after they were found. Most MH's have always been too expensive to be reader copies. I owned numerous MH's that had the pages still stuck together from the printing process and were unread.

 

West

 

west, if you're talking about those ones i had, it wasn't from the printing process.

 

 

Yeah, that was a good one!

[SuperBird]

do Crowley Copies represent the most PRISTINE (= untouched/unread) GA books known to exist?