Dragon Magazine stops publishing

[Scrooge]

About 15 years ago I was offered $75 for this book, but I declined. I didn't need the money and figured that if it was something "special", I might as well own it. (Same went for my 1979 Alien figure with the workable jaws. )

It was a must have for us at the time. We we're all fans of Michael Moorcock's Elric series. So to see some of our favorite stats on them was very cool.

 

I never bought that one. A friend of mine did but I thought it was a waste since we'd never use the entities listed inside. Now, if only I could remember which edition it was. Oh, and of course, we're talking about us, what, 13 or 14 year-old in France buying this book entirely in English and barely slogging through the descriptions This whole experience warped my perception of the English language such that I thought the use of words like scabbard, sheath, smite, skulk, ... was common-place. That surprised a few people when I landed in Oklahoma

[jordanscott]

who doesn't skulk every now and then?

[drice6900]

About 15 years ago I was offered $75 for this book, but I declined. I didn't need the money and figured that if it was something "special", I might as well own it. (Same went for my 1979 Alien figure with the workable jaws. )

It was a must have for us at the time. We we're all fans of Michael Moorcock's Elric series. So to see some of our favorite stats on them was very cool.

 

I never bought that one. A friend of mine did but I thought it was a waste since we'd never use the entities listed inside. Now, if only I could remember which edition it was. Oh, and of course, we're talking about us, what, 13 or 14 year-old in France buying this book entirely in English and barely slogging through the descriptions This whole experience warped my perception of the English language such that I thought the use of words like scabbard, sheath, smite, skulk, ... was common-place. That surprised a few people when I landed in Oklahoma

 

[Sal]

About 15 years ago I was offered $75 for this book, but I declined. I didn't need the money and figured that if it was something "special", I might as well own it. (Same went for my 1979 Alien figure with the workable jaws. )

It was a must have for us at the time. We we're all fans of Michael Moorcock's Elric series. So to see some of our favorite stats on them was very cool.

 

yeah, i always wanted one of my characters to get ahold of Mournblade, but alas i had the copy without that stuff in there

[Shadow]

I wonder if TSR was threatened with a lawsuit for some of these. Funny thing, you never hear about Elric now but I swear he was bigger back in the early 80's. Must have been due to all those songs Michael Moorcock wrote for Blue Oyster Cult.

[drice6900]

I wonder if TSR was threatened with a lawsuit for some of these. Funny thing, you never hear about Elric now but I swear he was bigger back in the early 80's. Must have been due to all those songs Michael Moorcock wrote for Blue Oyster Cult.

 

From Wiki:

 

TSR, Inc. obtained permission from Michael Moorcock for inclusion of the Melnibonéan material (from his Elric series of books). The Cthulhu Mythos was believed to be in the public domain, so TSR assumed they could legally use it without any special permission. However, Arkham House, who held the copyright on most Cthulhu books had already licensed the Cthulhu property to the game company Chaosium to create a Mythos-based game. Furthermore, Chaosium had also licensed the Melnibonéan copyright from Moorcock. Chaosium became upset that TSR was apparently violating its license. The first printing was halted and the two companies agreed on a compromise: TSR could use the Cthulhu material, but needed to include a special "thank you" note to Chaosium for both the Cthulhu mythos and Melnibonéan information. TSR added the special thank you note and the printing continued.

 

When the time came for a third printing of the book, TSR felt its material should not contain such an overt reference to one of its competitors in the "Special Thank You" note. So they removed the Cthulhu and Melnibonéan pantheons, thus negating the need for the "Thank you" note. For this reason, the first and second editions were (and are, among collectors) in greater demand than later printings. (Ironically, the "Thank you" note was still included in the first printing to contain the shortened list of pantheons — though this oversight was remedied in subsequent printings.)

 

Except for some color shifting of the cover artwork and different TSR logos on the cover, subsequent printings through the fifth remained largely unchanged.

 

For the sixth printing in 1985, the name was changed to Legends & Lore to avoid potential conflicts with fundamentalist Christian groups such as Patricia Pulling's BADD. Despite the name change and new cover artwork (by Jeff Easley), the interior material was nearly identical to the fifth printing.

 

Deities & Demigods for D&D version 3.When the second edition of the Advanced Dungeons & Dragons game was released, a new Legends & Lore was written for it. This edition had pared-down content in comparison to the original; the sections on Babylonian, Finnish, Sumerian and nonhumanoid deities were wholly excised. However, a separate sourcebook, Monster Mythology, later covered the non-human deities in much greater detail than any previous source, introducing several new deities in the process. Furthermore the late 2e Planescape book, 'On Hallowed Ground', gave a virtually comprehensive look at the various pantheons present in the D&D shared universe up to that point, and a level of detail not since exceeded.

 

For the current editions of the book, the name has been changed back to Deities & Demigods and the cover artwork has been changed again to bring it more in line with other modern D&D manuals. The interior material bears little resemblance to the previous printings of the book (first through sixth). Additionally, this current edition presents the various historical pantheons in something of a vacuum, without any reference to or inclusion of their development in previous D&D sources, opting instead to detail them as one-off campaign options.

 

Another large difference between the old Legends & Lore and Deities and Demigods, is that the new edition book is presented with actual stats of deities, which were included in the original Deities & Demigods manual as well. This has created debate on Wizards own forum[citation needed], as many fans perceive deities to be beyond stats, while others believe they should have stats as well. Those who prefer the deities to be beyond stats, tend to use the stats presented in the book as Avatar stats instead of actual deity stats.

[Ringfinger]

I was just at my parents a few weeks ago. I still have the below copy from 1979, my die, and my DungeonMasters Guide. Wow, brings back the memories.

 

Based on the first rules published in 1974. This one was the 3rd edition from 1979. AD&D was already around at this time, but they were also still pushing the basic game.

 

I was trying to find my copy of this when this thread started. I haven't given up hope in finding it yet.

[deathlok]

Here is the Melnibonean Mythos from Deities & Demigods

[Shadow]

Just like in my book. I always liked the artist that did most of those, plus others for TSR. Didn't he go on to do comics? The Elementals or something like it?

[HouseofComics.Com]

Elementals. Fables. Etc.

 

Wow, I didn't realize that early issues of Dragon were strong again. They'd been weak and I picked up issues right around this one for $8-$10 at Half Price Books a month ago.

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/Dragon-Magazine-12_W...1QQcmdZViewItem

 

This guy has a string of early issues all going for similar money.

 

I think I may start "making a market" in Dragon magazines on the website. As a sideline since I'm so interested in them. OTOH, I hate shipping magazines since they don't fit in my standard comic box mailers. Hmm, maybe I should hold off.

[Sal]

Just like in my book. I always liked the artist that did most of those, plus others for TSR. Didn't he go on to do comics? The Elementals or something like it?

 

daaaamn, son, that is JEFF DEE!

 

he did a short-lived series called "Villains & Vigilantes" for an Indy publisher (Eclipse, maybe?) back in the 80s.

 

 

Dee was always my favourite D&D artist.

 

 

the guy you're thinking of is Bill Willingham...yes, the Fables Bill Willingham. He wrote and drew the Elementals - which is a great series, btw

[HouseofComics.Com]

Oh man, it's definitely due to the news of the magazine being terminated. This cd-rom set of Dragon 1-250 used to go for $40 or so and now it's heading over $100. I kept trying to pick it up a few years ago for $30-35 and always failed.

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/DRAGON-Magazine-Arch...1QQcmdZViewItem

[deathlok]

Just like in my book. I always liked the artist that did most of those, plus others for TSR. Didn't he go on to do comics? The Elementals or something like it?

 

daaaamn, son, that is JEFF DEE!

 

he did a short-lived series called "Villains & Vigilantes" for an Indy publisher (Eclipse, maybe?) back in the 80s.

 

 

Dee was always my favourite D&D artist.

 

 

the guy you're thinking of is Bill Willingham...yes, the Fables Bill Willingham. He wrote and drew the Elementals - which is a great series, btw

 

Villains and Vigilantes RPG

 

[Sal]

Just like in my book. I always liked the artist that did most of those, plus others for TSR. Didn't he go on to do comics? The Elementals or something like it?

 

daaaamn, son, that is JEFF DEE!

 

he did a short-lived series called "Villains & Vigilantes" for an Indy publisher (Eclipse, maybe?) back in the 80s.

 

 

Dee was always my favourite D&D artist.

 

 

the guy you're thinking of is Bill Willingham...yes, the Fables Bill Willingham. He wrote and drew the Elementals - which is a great series, btw

 

Villains and Vigilantes RPG

 

 

yes, and issue one of the comic that was based on same, including characters developed - iirc - by Dee and others

[deathlok]

Don't get so defensive Sal, I wasn't correcting you.

[deathlok]

[deathlok]

[Sal]

Don't get so defensive Sal, I wasn't correcting you.

 

easy, now. i didn't take it that way

[HouseofComics.Com]

IIRC, Willingham did a lot of the art for the second Top Secret module, including a very sexy female agent in wetsuit.

 

If you do a google search for Gary Gygax you can find some terrific, extensive interviews with the man that really goes over a lot of the infighting and corporate struggles in the 80s. The two brothers come off looking like complete clowns. He also reveals some of the financials, including that in the mid-80s Dragon magazine was making a profit of a million a year.

 

Marc

[deathlok]

IIRC, Willingham did a lot of the art for the second Top Secret module, including a very sexy female agent in wetsuit.

 

If you do a google search for Gary Gygax you can find some terrific, extensive interviews with the man that really goes over a lot of the infighting and corporate struggles in the 80s. The two brothers come off looking like complete clowns. He also reveals some of the financials, including that in the mid-80s Dragon magazine was making a profit of a million a year.

 

Marc

Yeah, I remember Gygax had some very vocal things to say about TSR.