ComicLink charging illegal fees

[Kevin Boyd]

Perhaps you misunderstood me, I was sot saying that he should SAY that he will accept credit cards if the buyer offers to pay the surcharge.

 

I'm saying he should say he is not accepting cc payments because he can't afford to lose revenue to cc surcharges. That's it.

 

The buyers who desperately want to pay by credit cards can contact him and offer to cover the surcharges if they want the convenience. They know why he won't do it, and they know how to get around it if they really want to.

 

Kev

[shadroch]

Tomega

Please clarify: Does NY State law ban vendors in Ny from charging exta fees on transactions or does it ban vendors anywhere from charging the fees to NYS residents. Or both?

Couldn't this be made legal by simpy Josh stating he will give 3% discounts for any nonCC transaction. This is how I did it in my store- Cash transactions over $100 got a 4% discount as that is what my CCC charged me. It used to be that if you complained to your CC company after the fact, they would rescind the charges.

[cicamen]

I don't think it matters where the buyer is located. It matters where the seller is located. He is located in New York so it is illegal.

[joe_collector]

Please clarify: Does NY State law ban vendors in Ny from charging exta fees on transactions or does it ban vendors anywhere from charging the fees to NYS residents. Or both?

 

It's a combination. The seller's state of residence is an obvious one, but there was also a big hue and cry about California residents being jacked by out-of-state sellers, and it helped prompt a clean-up of such practices on EBay.

[Kevin Boyd]

Both e-bay and Paypal policies strictly forbid sellers of any state (or country for that matter) from introducing credit card surcharges in their auctions.

 

Any auction which has a credit card surcharge (specified as such) may be cancelled by e-bay at any time and the seller may be banned from selling items on e-bay.

 

Kev

[COMICLINK]

I would like to address the recent concerns raised on the forum about ComicLink. I understand the issues raised and the concerns are valid but please note the following:

 

ComicLink charges the lowest brokerage fees in the industry for the services it provides (currently 10% total). This is in contrast to similar auction and brokerage houses that typically charge up to 30% total commission (buyer + seller commissions). A vintage comic book business simply cannot be run on less than a 10% gross margin. If ComicLink has to absorb another 3%, that is a 7% commission. Of that 7%, the net profit is much less after expenses of running the business and taxes. ComicLink keeps the cost of using the service low for both buyer and seller. In addition to a zero buyer commission and a low 10% seller commission, sellers do not have to pay any listing costs or reserve fees. That is another benefit for users and still less money to pay for ComicLink expenses.

 

Paying by credit card on ComicLink is an OPTION, not a requirement, and it is only one of many payment options available. If a buyer does not wish to pay 3% extra, he or she does not have to pay by credit card. The buyer may pay by check or money order or by paypal balance. ComicLink is also a bid/ask system so the buyer that wishes to pay by credit card but does not want to absorb the fee can also reduce the amount of his bid by 3%.

 

If the surcharge is removed and credit card remain a payment option, ComicLink will need to raise the seller commission or institute a buyer commission like many other companies do. This would only hurt consumers and sellers across the board in the form of higher prices for buyers and lower sales for sellers.

 

I sincerely hope that I have addressed all of your concerns.

 

-Josh Nathanson, ComicLink

 

[DiceX]

Paying by credit card on ComicLink is an OPTION, not a requirement, and it is only one of many payment options available. If a buyer does not wish to pay 3% extra, he or she does not have to pay by credit card.

 

Not charging the customer the extra 3% is a LAW.

Not an "option".

 

Big difference.

[Kevin Boyd]

ComicLink charges the lowest brokerage fees in the industry for the services it provides (currently 10% total). This is in contrast to similar auction and brokerage houses that typically charge up to 30% total commission (buyer + seller commissions). A vintage comic book business simply cannot be run on less than a 10% gross margin. If ComicLink has to absorb another 3%, that is a 7% commission. Of that 7%, the net profit is much less after expenses of running the business and taxes. ComicLink keeps the cost of using the service low for both buyer and seller. In addition to a zero buyer commission and a low 10% seller commission, sellers do not have to pay any listing costs or reserve fees. That is another benefit for users and still less money to pay for ComicLink expenses.

 

I'm sure you are worried about raising the brokerage fees and possibly losing your status as having the lowest fees but I don't think you have any real choice other than to raise the brokerage fee to 13-15% to absorb credit card fees instead of making the zero buyer commission 3% for buyers who want to pay by credit card.

 

You could offer a rebate to sellers if the buyer doesn't pay by credit card.

 

Kev

 

 

[HooDeeDoo]

I always pay by check.

[joe_collector]

Paying by credit card on ComicLink is an OPTION, not a requirement, and it is only one of many payment options available. If a buyer does not wish to pay 3% extra, he or she does not have to pay by credit card.

 

 

As Batman says, if you can't do the time, don't do the crime.

[DiceX]

 

As Batman says, if you can't do the time, don't do the crime.

 

Wasn't that Baretta?

[joe_collector]

 

As Batman says, if you can't do the time, don't do the crime.

 

Wasn't that Baretta?

 

My humor is lost on these peons!!!

[linmoth]

Hi All: I don't understand what all the bitc**ng is about. I can understand using a CC for some form of security but Comiclink is not a fly by night dealer. If the 3% really makes a difference in your economic situation and the only way you can afford to buy a high grade book is by paying your CC company an inflated interest rate for a year or more, don't buy the book. Keep looking on ebay for all those high grade Bronze age books that have been hoarded in stacks. I don't agree with Mr. Nice on many issues ( As I have been duped by Mr Dupcak ) but it does appear that many on these boards want to give the appearance of BSD's, but don't have the wherewithall to back up their attitudes. If you want it pony up to the bar and try a new concept, like cash, check or money order. It is widely accepted and there is no 3%, 5% or 9.9% or higher fee.

 

Ok, I see your point, it's illegal. So is speeding, pot, and lying on your tax return he who is innocent cast the first stone.

 

Sorry for my rant, but that is the reason why most of the books you covet never see the light of day!

 

Best, Tom

 

 

[stynxno]

it's illegal WHERE YOU LIVE. Not where I am. You tell me I should follow the law, yet you miss the simple point that it's NOT ILLEGAL IN IOWA.

 

It doesn't matter where you live. It only matters where the business is based. If a business is based in New York, they HAVE to follow New York State Laws. And when I say "based" I mean where the business has filled papers with the state government saying that they will be headquartered at a certain location.

 

I know this because I am in the process of setting up my business and I've been taking a lot of things into consideration.

 

If the surcharge is removed and credit card remain a payment option, ComicLink will need to raise the seller commission or institute a buyer commission like many other companies do. This would only hurt consumers and sellers across the board in the form of higher prices for buyers and lower sales for sellers.

 

It might Josh, but you can get really hosed right now. If your previous customers learn that the credit card fees they were charged were illegal, they can file a complaint with the state of new york and if enough people complain, you can be shut down. I don't know how your business is set up, but if you are sole owner, then your personal finances could also be in jeopardy.

 

If I were you, I would go talk to an attorney and talk to the new york business offices and see how you can rectify the situation. It might be that you'll only have to refund the credit card charges but that's better than being completely shut down.

 

 

 

 

 

[Tomega]

I would like to address the recent concerns raised on the forum about ComicLink. I understand the issues raised and the concerns are valid but please note the following:

 

ComicLink charges the lowest brokerage fees in the industry for the services it provides (currently 10% total). This is in contrast to similar auction and brokerage houses that typically charge up to 30% total commission (buyer + seller commissions). A vintage comic book business simply cannot be run on less than a 10% gross margin. If ComicLink has to absorb another 3%, that is a 7% commission. Of that 7%, the net profit is much less after expenses of running the business and taxes. ComicLink keeps the cost of using the service low for both buyer and seller. In addition to a zero buyer commission and a low 10% seller commission, sellers do not have to pay any listing costs or reserve fees. That is another benefit for users and still less money to pay for ComicLink expenses.

 

Paying by credit card on ComicLink is an OPTION, not a requirement, and it is only one of many payment options available. If a buyer does not wish to pay 3% extra, he or she does not have to pay by credit card. The buyer may pay by check or money order or by paypal balance. ComicLink is also a bid/ask system so the buyer that wishes to pay by credit card but does not want to absorb the fee can also reduce the amount of his bid by 3%.

 

If the surcharge is removed and credit card remain a payment option, ComicLink will need to raise the seller commission or institute a buyer commission like many other companies do. This would only hurt consumers and sellers across the board in the form of higher prices for buyers and lower sales for sellers.

 

I sincerely hope that I have addressed all of your concerns.

 

-Josh Nathanson, ComicLink

 

Josh -

I was hoping you would see this and respond. I understand the margins you operate on are slim ( at least from what you told us) but surcharging in NY State is illegal. Paying by credit is indeed an option, agreeing to the terms you accepted by running a business in NY State is not. There are laws in place for a reason and there is no room for interpretation here. From what I gather , you are telling us that you are fully aware that you are violating law and will continue to do so? A lot of the sellers have their own businesses that use your web site take credit cards and Paypal and do not charge fees because it is against NY state law, perhaps you should pass that along to the sellers since they would normally pay these fees anyway. Do you know what will happened if somebody purchases from you , pays the 3%, and complains to the credit card company ? Those 3% will be reversed and you may have a big problem on your hands. All it will take is a few complaints and your entire transaction history can be reviewed. That type of audit can end up costing you a lot of money. It is only a matter of time before it happens and I would suggest altering your policies. Frankly, I think it is only a matter of time before your business and finances may end up being is serious jeopardy. Speak to your lawyer and accountant - see what they say, I am betting they would agree with me.

 

Tom

[Crowzilla]

One other point that I think many people have overlooked is that to stay out of trouble of the laws in the states that have passed them, Visa/MC THEMSELVES require that all merchants sign an agreement stating that they will not add a surcharge for accepting credit card payments.

Comiclink is in violation of their merchant agreement by doing this and could lose their merchant account if reported.

 

The only option Visa/MC allow is a discount for cash purchases. So Josh could certainly raise his overall fee to 13% and then offer a 3% discount for cash/money order payments.

This would not only make good sense, it would encourage people to try to pay with cash and would keep him from encountering the negative press that he is receiving for his current policy.

 

 

[joe_collector]

Comiclink is in violation of their merchant agreement by doing this and could lose their merchant account if reported.

 

Assuming they have a merchant account....

[C3Galaxia-migration]

I can back Zillatoy on this one. Working in the realm of credit card, debit card, EBT, check processing and giftcard industries, I can tell you that Visa and Mastercard regulations prohibit surcharges in the U.S. for merchant account registrations. This has nothing to do with what state the merchant is operating or where the customer is located. I am not sure if this Visa/Mastercard regulation applies to all merchant accounts pre-existing to this regulation. I would think the business in question would have gotten a notice from his merchant account provider. Now, there is a technical loop hole that may be employed known as "service fees", but I thought these were reserved for government and education use. But, all of this is assuming the merchant is using a merchant account...

 

[murph0]

Personally, I'd prefer not to see a 3 percent buyer's premium. But realistically I don't expect you to absorb the 3 percent yourself. And obviously, the higher seller commission goes the lower the # of high quality books (of which you seem to get a ton of). I've had no problem buying from you plus the 3 percent, and I'd agree with what linmoth said that if the extra 3 percent is gonna kill you.. maybe you shouldn't buy the book.

 

Brian

[otis-migration]

and I'd agree with what linmoth said that if the extra 3 percent is gonna kill you.. maybe you shouldn't buy the book.

Brilliant. Spoken like a true spoiled collector whose parents pay for all his comics. Get the silver spoon out of your mouth Rickster!