lou_fine

He could probably afford this corner. No charge as he bit that one off and got it for free while it was going through the CCS process after it had already gotten graded.

Yes, Brian was really rather enthusiastic when he kept talking about the L.B. Cole books and especially some of the ones with the black covers. Although he did expressed regret at not having any of the Blue Bolt Weird Tales (which he seem to be rather passionate about) since they were after the drop dead date sometime in 1950 when the collection came to a complete dead stop, he did seem quite excited and hinted at what must be a real killer copy of Blue Bolt 105 when talking about some of Cole's classic si-fi covers. Not sure if he's aware of this uber HG copy that sold through CL a few years ago, but if they are, just maybe they'll just magically find some way to squeeze the Promise Collection copy into a CGC 9.9 graded slab: https://www.comiclink.com/auctions/item.asp?id=1269937#detail BTW: To answer some boardie's previous question here, sounds as though they do have Punch's in the collection, but both Brain and Matt were not sure if there was a Punch 12 in there or not, but did assumed there should probably be one simply because it was a book from 1945.

Exactly what book are you referring to in your post here, because as like you said, I might not want it going past my radar screen undetected?

All I'll say here is that if I ever submitted a book like this into CGC for grading, I would most likely also receive a grade with a "6" in it, but sad to say, with the "6" on the other side of the decimal point. Heck, without having the actual book in hand and knowing my luck, it would probably also come back encased in a holder with one of those nicely purple colored label of theirs. Interesting to note that this is the only copy of PL 14 that has a yellow, orange, green, orange, green stripe combination on the spine edge of the book here. All of the other copies that I just checked on both the HA and CC auction archives has the green, orange, green, orange, green stripe combination. Like usual with any of the Promise Collection visual defects noted to date, everybody seems to be very forgiving and conveniently attributing them all to production printing defects to be ignored for grading purposes. Since it's a production printing defect variant, I guess Heritage should not only be hyping this book here as not only being the single highest graded copy , but also a super super rare variant with no other existing copy in any condition in the entire universe.

I actually found this comment from Brian to be a little bit refreshing because he's simply stating a fact that everybody knows, but don't ever want to say. Need to watch that part of the video again, but did Matt cringed a bit at that point since Brian did mentioned it a couple of times and this is almost ALWAYS the type of stuff that you don't directly admit to doing yourself or to a particular book. Of course, Heritage has an in-house advantage and not the same risk here because everybody knows the work was done by CCS and as a result, any CCS incurred defects would most probably be treated by the graders "accordingly" because it's shhhh........really all in the family. Definitely found it kind of ironic though that Brian kept going on and on about the Black Hood 16 in CGC 9.6 and how it was pretty much light years above the next highest graded copy which was way way down there in the census. The first thought that came to my mind was if that's the case, then why in the world would you take the chance at putting the book through the CCS meat grinder just in case you end up damaging the book during the process which is clearly what must have happened to at least a few of the other books posted so far. Especially when he said that even if a book looked perfect and probably in 9.4, they would still pressed it and I assume to see if they could just squeezed that final bit of potential out of the book. The picture that came to my mind at that point was Halperin and Ivy and how they don't really love and care for the comic books the same way that some of us do here, but really care more for the comic books only in terms of using them as a vehicle to acquire what they really truly love, namely money itself. Being a long time comic book collector and definitely what most of you here would call a grumpy old man as compared to today's CGC label centric focused generation of collectors, I definitely would have kept the Black Hood 16 in its original already perfect condition the way it had been for the past 75+ plus years and not even think about monkeying around with it. Of course, that's just me and it's really a case of to each, their own. It's all good to me, which ever way each of us choose to collect as long as we can all get fun and joy out of this hobby while doing it.

what’s the timeline where lou_fine comes in? It just makes my heart beat to hear that some of you wake up every morning with bated breath just waiting with anticipation and desire to hear my latest musings and ramblings on this Promise Collection pedigree here. Seriously though (if that's possible), sounds like some of you need to develop a sense of humour here. Especially since I have already clearly stated that I consider this Promise Collection to be an once in a lifetime generational GA OO collection, and like they said in the video here, at this late stage of the comic book collecting life cycle that we are in, possibly (but hopefully not) the last true major GA OO collection to come out. All I am really doing is taking scans that other boardies have pointed out from a negative point of view, and restating it in a more light-hearted way to bring a bit of levity to these rather dour takes on some of these gorgeous books here. After all, if you didn't have at least a chuckle in terms of the S&M girl with the CGC grading whip or the CGC Promise Collection grading train barreling down on you at full speed whilst your HG GA book gripped firmly in hand, then you must truly be a CGC acolyte who's overdosing on your hourly dose of CGC juice. Reminds me of how upset boardies were when I used to make jokes about some of Jason Ewert's books way back in the day when almost all boardies here thought that was absolute sacrilege as he was pretty much deemed to be God's gift to uber HG comic books back then. Anyways, back to the video that was posted here by Allan. Although it was certainly nice to watch 4 comic book guys geeking out over comic books, I thought it would have been even better if they had spiced it up with at least a bit of humour here for us. Esspecially when they already acknowledged seeing the posts from some of the boardies here on their very own CGC boards. Perfect examples being when Brian was talking about not even being able to afford a corner of these first group of books posted here and Matt going on about the perfect square corners, it would have been a nice touch if they could have flashed pictures of the covers and zoomed in on the corners of the 2 Subby's and the Sun Girl at that point. Or when Matt was talking about how the books were pristine because they had not been handled in the past 70 years except for being mylared and boarded about 20 years ago, they really should have flashed an exceprt of that informational video with Matt doing a page count on a GA book while seemingly bending the corners of some of the pages at the same time. Although certainly hilarious, I guess that would have been a bridge too far for them though. After all, these are the four color funny books that we are dealing with here and we may as well have some fun and laughs while talking about them here, instead of being a sourpuss and getting your undies all in a knot whenever anything negative is ever mentioned about CGC and their grading, because it's all really meant more as constructive criticism.

Plus Dean would've burst a blood vessel. What issue 3 are you guys talking about here? Are you guys talking about the Promise Collection copy of Mystery Men 3 being a 10.0 because that would be perfect timing to see a CGC 9.6 Church copy square off against a CGC 10.0 Promise copy?

Thanks for posting this as I watched this video last night and thought it was rather fun and enjoyable to watch. I found it to be a complete contrast to that video by Darren Adams on his Action 1 where I felt it was just 2 carnival barkers with shifty eyes trying to pull a fast one on you by leaving out big gaps in their timeline of what took place with the book. Definitely had to go into the shower and give myself a deep cleansing after watching that one there. I was initially turned off by the title of the show, "Old School Comics", as that always brings up images of raw comics like what Bangzoom was posting in his thread at the start. I thought it would have been more like "New School Comics" with all of the CGC 9.6's and CGC 9.8's posted slabs because that's really more like the CGC generation of comic book collecting. In the end, I found it fun and enjoyable to watch because instead of the "hard sell" approach like Adams, it was more just like 4 comic book guys geeking out over what I have already called on more than one occasion here as a once in a lifetime generational OO collection. This Promise Collection here will definitely be a watershed moment in terms of the GA collecting marketplace. A bit similar in vein to the Jon Berk Collection which I sort of thought as an once in a lifetime generational opportunity for all types of comic book collectors (i.e. big time investors and small time bottom feeders) to purchase truly HTF GA books in all condition levels that they might not otherwise ever see again in any type of condition. Yet quite different in the sense that the Promise Collection books are in pure HG condition, and coupled with the way they are going to be rolled out, really geared much more for the comic book whales and deep pocketed collectors and investors only. The one part that I found to be very interesting and rather informative (or disinformative) was at the 11 and 12-minute mark where there seem to be some question as to which one of the brothers was the comic book collector and which one had survived the war. I guess this still needs to cleared up since Brian's take on it was the complete opposite of the way they ran the story in Bleeding Cool with Junie (supposedly the younger brother) being the comic book collector. I guess this story will all work itself out in time.

Yes but the camp Okajimas that go for 10 times what equivalently graded copies go for have generally been lesser desired mid grade books with low base value, not highest graded, key, or classic books with a lot of built in value to begin with. If it's 10 times, they are clearly referring to the Camp copies with all of that writing on the cover, as opposed to the regular Okijima copies without the obtrusive writing which sells for a much lower multiple. Like they say, I guess it's the story behind the pedigree that's currently bringing up the prices, as opposed to the obtrusive writing all over the cover that would otherwise bring the prices down. On the other hand, I like Matt's reference to the Recil Macon pedigree and in one case writing his name on every single page as being a little bit too much. I guess this is why the Macon's are probabluy knocked down to the mid-grade range as they are seen more as a defect as opposed to a positive pedigree trait. I guess they also don't have as strong of a story behind them like the Camp copies which recently have been able to overcome the excessive writing defects to sell for 10X multiple guides. Like the Camp copies, maybe the sun will come out one day and shine their bright light onto the Macon's but that day has not yet come.

Need to listen to it again, but I believe they said it was about 20 years ago. Absolutely love their condition grading of the books to be as VG copies only and found that to be rather hilarious. Now, that is what I would call clear and definite UNDERGRADING in terms of this Promise Collection here.

You might be right but it seemed to me he was talking about this collection. I am quite sure that I heard Brian's comment being past tense as from a few months ago and I am also quite sure they were referring to this newsbreaking HA sale here: https://comics.ha.com/itm/golden-age-1938-1955-/batman-1-dc-1940-cgc-nm-94-white-pages/a/7239-91027.s?ic4=ListView-ShortDescription-071515 Sold for $2,220,000 in a Heritage Signature Auction back in January of 2021.

I remember reading Keith's market reports in the Overstreet Updates because that was always a rather uplifting positive read. Heard he got himself into some hard times after that and was wondering if he was still wandering God's green Earth or has he gone down under?

Well, I guess that really depends upon how much you are willing to pay, as I am always open for business here.

Or how about sending ALL OF THEM to the boys across the street for finalized grading in order to ensure some consistency in the grades?

Or this CGC 9.6 graded copy of Punch Comics 19 since I never realized all of these staple issues and spine crapola was allowed on a CGC 9.6: https://comics.ha.com/itm/golden-age-1938-1955-/punch-comics-19-the-promise-collection-pedigree-chesler-1946-cgc-nm-96-off-white-to-white-pages/p/7244-175062.s?ic4=ListView-ShortDescription-071515

Would your short list of 15 that you are aware of include this CCS "mouse chewed" copy of Subby 23 here: https://comics.ha.com/itm/golden-age-1938-1955-/sub-mariner-comics-23-the-promise-collection-pedigree-timely-1947-cgc-vf-85-off-white-to-white-pages/p/7244-175249.s?ic4=ListView-ShortDescription-071515

From a distance only, because if you are like me, probably still haven't gotten around to opening many of the posted scans that's on the HA site yet. I was only made aware of this Subby 23 by a PM which I had received from @MasterChief last night along with a couple of other scans as he also can't figure out how CGC is coming up with some of these grades on some of these books from the Promise Collection. It's too bad he's swamped at work right now, because his usual detailed analytical input here would indeed be both highly valued and greatly appreciated.

Well, I believe if you go by the Overstreet grading standards since nobody knows what CGC's undisclosed and shifting grading standards are, a missing piece like that going through the ENTIRE BOOK would probably bring the grade down much lower than a 7.0. Then again, since it was most likely done during their "maximization of potential" process, pay no attention to it and we are good to go.

In this case, can you please provide us all with a phone pic of this CGC 8.5 graded copy of Subby 23 AD (After Destruction) because this is indeed ALL THAT MINUS THE "MOUSE CHEW" ON THE BOTOM: https://comics.ha.com/itm/golden-age-1938-1955-/sub-mariner-comics-23-the-promise-collection-pedigree-timely-1947-cgc-vf-85-off-white-to-white-pages/p/7244-175249.s?ic4=ListView-ShortDescription-071515 With all of the increased fees that's now being charged for their services, I hope they can use some of it to pony up the cash to hire a real professional exterminator because that "rodent infestation" problem they seem to be having down at CCS appears to be getting totally out of control here.

This reconfirms my initial thinking even more as this Church copy here is perfectly cut from the top and bottom edge point of view.

Not as much as that copy of Punch Comics 19 from my previous post just up above, that's for sure. Something for you to comtemplate while you lay awake at night thinking about the meaning of life..................."One book's defects are another book's pedigree characteristic traits". Another food for thought just for you..............if you are thinking of opting for a Heritage scanned book because of the brightness and freshness of the cover, I most certainly hope that you have a light table at home to view your books, similar to the one that HA has.

Well, since no one else has bothered to answer your question here, I will try to fathom a guess and say "Yes", there should most likely be a Punch 12 in there since this would be from the prime 1945/46 time period. I guess we can only wait and see to find out though. My best guess though is that it's pretty likely considering that they already have a copy of Punch 19 in there, with the 2 problem staple areas and that fugly looking spine as per usual: https://comics.ha.com/itm/golden-age-1938-1955-/punch-comics-19-the-promise-collection-pedigree-chesler-1946-cgc-nm-96-off-white-to-white-pages/p/7244-175062.s?ic4=ListView-ShortDescription-071515 With respect to the Punch run, I believe the only ones they might not have in there might be Punch 1 and 2 since it's prior to 1943, and even if they did, might not be in the usual "high grade" condition that the majority of the Promise books would be in.

What is this............are you doing a rewrite of the grading definitions for VF/NM here in preparation for Overstreet's new guide? And what the frig is going on with that top staple area for the Promise Collection copy or is this simply just nothing more than CCS's signature confirmation mark that additional revenue has already been generated from this book and this defect signature should therefore be taken into consideration accordingly by the graders. Bottom-line: After careful visual consideration and since I am not a label chaser, I would take the Mile High copy since the cover looks pretty white to me and presents nicely as compared to the Promise copy with that misaligned cut along the top which is a definite eyesore, plus you can never go wrong with a Church pedigree since it's the absolute top rung of the pedigree ladder:

Hey, since I love playing games..........................then how about this already gorgeous sure to be highest graded copy by a long shot: How much unnecessary work will they still try to do on this already "no more need for improvement" book here and how high into the 9's will they dare to be brave enough to score this book here, given it's rather obvious spine and corner issues and the fact that Lon had made the Corporate mistake of pre-emptively providing a scanned copy of the raw book here?

Yeah, this is sort of getting closer to what I really meant, but probably works more like this: Boy, I am getting tired and my eyes really need a break here, but not quite sure about this pedigree book here as clearly evident by its code, but hmmm.................since I also don't want to be seen by my boss as a potential bad grader and this is a pedigree and hence must be good, so UP you go. Boy, I am getting tired and my eyes really need a break here, but not quite sure about this nice looking HG book here, but hmmmm...................since I want to be seen as a good grader by my boss and a good grader must be a tough grader, so DOWN you go.