Lazyboy

How much is your collection worth? Why don't you sell your collection and do something else with the money? I like comics, a lot. Like a whole lot. Who cares what they are worth? Do you want me gone or something? Night! Exactly! Why would any collector sell (part of) their collection unless they actually needed the money?

How much is your collection worth? Why don't you sell your collection and do something else with the money?

Do you actually think they are going to invest one time if with any early go-around projects they double or triple their money? They are going to push this for all they can until making money from the venture doesn't happen. It's just perspective. "9-figure investment" sounds much more impressive before you realize how much is necessary for just one project.

obviously the 2 folks I know that have "hoards" of raw copies are highly likely the exception...that much I think is reasonable...a statistical anomaly if you will...I can grant that no problem J, you are the only one in your area that has an af15....I know of 6 serious spiderman collectors in my little town...all 6 have af15's, only one of them is slabbed...other 5 have raw copies, all bought some time ago... that is one store, in one little town, not really representative, I would think, of a collecting mecca (like Ny or Los Angeles, etc) what I guess the minimalist fail to comprehend or acknowledge (not sure) is that thousands and thousands and THOUSANDS of copies were sold in the 60s-90's... that is the "pre" cgc collecting era... all of the "older" timers acknowledge the high likelihood of thousands out there... seems only the "younger" folk can't acknowledge that.... and to a degree, I guess I can see how living and collecting in a cgc era, and I suspect large portions of comic interactions are here on the cgc board, would skew one's opinion... but take it from those of us that have been around the block buying and selling for 20-40+ years... in every case (contributions to this thread), we have all concluded there are thousands and thousands of copies our there... how many, no one will ever know...but to think that there are only hundreds out there not slabbed, that simply cannot be... I guess I'm just one of those people who only likes to believe what he can see, or what can be reasonably extrapolated from a data pool. I don't believe the census to be gospel but I do believe it to be enough of a data pool to make a reasonable extrapolation. Based on that extrapolation I would put the number at 3000-5000 extant, with the vast majority of those being low grade and 33-50% of them also having some type of restoration. (thumbs u -J. Extrapolation based on what? The CGC census has no correlation to total copies. Again, believing attrition to be well over 90% is irrational.

not everything else...some of us have seen/held/counted copies... at least to me, that is "fact" and I can include those copies in my "estimate" Of course your personal observations will aid you in your estimates. That is indisputable. I would, however, ask that you also factor in the (great) likelihood that many of the raw copies you have observed in your career are now living in slabs. (thumbs u I have never stated that I think the only existing copies are the slabbed ones or that there are only a few hundred left out in the raw. I am on the record believing there are likely a few thousand still left. Maybe as many as 5000 (a large percentage with restoration). However, let it be noted that there are numerous examples of high dollar/rare modern variants with numbers on the census that exceed 50% of their entire print runs. So it is most certainly not outside the realm of possibility or even probability that half (or more than half) of all extant copies of AF 15 are present and accounted for on the census at this point. -J. I would ask you to consider that believing the attrition rate for AF15 (or any post-"Ws" book) is well over 90% is completely, ridiculously irrational.

You have to feel the rest of the elephant, blind man.

Because the goal was accomplished. They did sell, and the new owner doesn't want to sell right now. We don't even know if the copy is still encapsulated. No, but you're in the minority of people who submit comics to CGC, let alone collectors in general. You have a bad habit of overrating CGC's importance and influence. Slabbed copies of very nearly anything are a small minority.

What are you talking about? The copies that people haven't seen and don't know about are in the collections of collectors. Those copies won't be available until they need the money or they move on to a different stage in their life.

Pretty much, yeah. You're not that old and we're about the same age. You will almost certainly see most copies of the big SA keys drop - not only from whatever highs they reach, but below current prices - in your lifetime, unless you're planning on dying young. The highest grades might be able to hold their value better just because they are in a different market.

I don't see that as being as silly as it sounds. There will be a lot of SW collectors who aren't even comic collectors wanting SW 1, whereas I cant see non collectors who are fans of the X-Men movies clamoring for GSX 1. SW is a rising star (pun intended). I wouldn't disregard it so lightly. It`s that generation that grew up with GSX 1 and Uncanny X-Men 94 that has this attitude. They can`t fathom that GSX 1 and Uncanny X-Men 94 have lost some importance with the current crowd. That won`t ever admit that Star Wars #1 is a player. To them they`ll always be considered toy/movie comic book tie in, when in fact we know Star Wars #1 has a better future going forward than GSX #1. At least they will acknowledge Star Wars #1. Good luck with them ever saying anything positive about GI JOE #1 or Transformers #1. Toy tie ins. Nobody is talking about losing importance. If anyone lost importance, it wa SW and it has bounced back due to new movie buzz. Most of these movie books were more valuable as tinder than as collectibles just a few years ago. You're basically arguing that Luke, Chewbacca, Hans, Leia and Darth have a better future than Wolverine and the rest. Who ha had a better run than Wolverine alone? Not too many characters. And even more importantly, you are completely missing the point that both the SW generation and the GSX #1 generation are the same generation. They came out 2 years apart. Movie books are a flash in the pan. Comics will eventually fade slowly but those movie books will burn out quick. How does that affect Star Wars #1 from being profitable now? What is wrong with making money on a hot movie book like Star Wars #1? What the hell do those questions have to do with the discussion? Nobody is disputing that right now, Star Wars 1 is spiking.

I don't see that as being as silly as it sounds. There will be a lot of SW collectors who aren't even comic collectors wanting SW 1, whereas I cant see non collectors who are fans of the X-Men movies clamoring for GSX 1. SW is a rising star (pun intended). I wouldn't disregard it so lightly. It`s that generation that grew up with GSX 1 and Uncanny X-Men 94 that has this attitude. They can`t fathom that GSX 1 and Uncanny X-Men 94 have lost some importance with the current crowd. That won`t ever admit that Star Wars #1 is a player. To them they`ll always be considered toy/movie comic book tie in, when in fact we know Star Wars #1 has a better future going forward than GSX #1. At least they will acknowledge Star Wars #1. Good luck with them ever saying anything positive about GI JOE #1 or Transformers #1. Toy tie ins. I really don't think SW 1 has a better future going for it, especially long term. Right now It looks that way, but GSX 1 has been an incredibly solid book for such a long time that it's not even fair to compare the two. The way SW 1 has shot up in price recently just reeks of long term instability. I'll also add that I do think SW 1 is a player. It's just not in the same league as GSX 1. Why, just because all these hardcore Star Wars fans who don't care about comics have had 38 years to pick up relatively cheap copies? Or just because SW1 is following the same pattern as all the other movie related books being jumped on by the legion of insufficiently_thoughtful_person speculators? Or... oh...

What many of you seem to be missing is that price eventually becomes a limiting factor for relevant demand.

If you know what you`re doing Magic and Lego will get you quick profits! Don't know about Lego but I could definitely see MTG being this generations comics (at least as far as collectibles go.) My son (and a bunch of other nerdy sons) are playing and talking Magic now like I talked and traded comics when I was his age. When they grow up and have disposable income I could see the old cards picking up. The only issue is that the cards are "collected" now so there will be many high grade examples. So I guess maybe not. Pure "collectors" are a tiny part of the fan base for M:tG, as they should be. But do you have any idea of the difference between print runs of recent sets and early sets? Regardless, playability is still the main driving force behind M:tG prices.

Yeah but in 646 posts you have proven that your opinion is asinine But this may be the first time he's ever been right.

There is nothing aggressive about breaking down a conversation and responding to each comment separately. It's internet debate 101. If you don't feel like replying in like manner then just say that, but he did nothing wrong other than address all of your thoughts cleanly and neatly. I respectfully disagree. The approach is a scare tactic and not necessarily a logical one. An argument is more that the individual sentences it contains. However, I did note that my frustration with him was encompassing more than this specific discussion. So when you have multiple points worth responding to you are saying someone can only respond to them all together? I don't understand. All he did was address your points individually. There was nothing aggressive about it. I am suggesting he uses it as a tactic to overwhelm the discussion, cause frustration and in many cases as a way to demean people by insinuating that their POV is inferior by breaking it down to a level where it no longer makes sense (almost a form of argumentum ad absurdum). That is what I am describing as aggressive. No, you're just

If I was a real bully I'd hump the button on this and your other post. Don't know if you realize it, but you've called me a name four times ('the worst', a "top tier" jerk and a bully twice) and made accusations about my character three times, both actions of which are against the rules of behavior of this forum. I have thick skin though. Another bizarre aspect of this place are the number of people who just make random generalizations about the character of someone based upon anywhere from 100 to 20,000 posts and figure that's gosh darned enough for them to make that call. It's NOT. You don't know me in the slightest. So really, you have NO RIGHT to make those claims against me. ESPECIALLY while in the process of calling me names and libelling me!!!! I didn't make a random generalization about you, I made direct statements that were supported by my personal opinion and observations. The mods and pretty much anyone who's been here for some time will tell you - just because you observe something and have an opinion about it, doesn't mean you have a free pass to say what you want. I've seen strike's for less, and yes, it is. Especially since you did it twice. Calling people names, regardless of it's your opinion is a strikeable offense. How am I bullying you? You started this, and continue to point the finger as if I did something wrong. You've already admitted that my post wasn't a good example of it. The post counts had nothing to do with MY opinion, or toward anyone's POV on here. You may have misunderstood what was written. The only one who is pushing vehemently is you. From your very first response. who first engaged who here? You engaged everyone by posting ridiculous statements and questions on a public message board. Then, when your post was simply questioned, you responded with name calling.

No one suggested that. No one suggested that. So now we're only talking about the 'top tier'? What exactly is 'top tier'? Is it the same as the 'Top Tier' was in 1974? No one suggested that. Are you suggesting there is no ceiling to the value an AF15 can reach that people no longer can afford it or choose to try to? Safe? Are we talking safe or growth? Dude, you are the worst. Seriously, do you feel the need to purposefully dissect anything said on the boards to the 1,000th degree? We are all capable of this behavior occasionally (I am definitely included), but man you seem to be hard-wired to push and push and push. Many of the points were meant to be sarcastic and the balance topline personal position. I understand that there are arbitrary details, but without a post consisting of 10,000 words to clarify everything, I felt it okay to leave some interpretation out there. You seem to be only interested in picking fights on here and are clearly a "top tier" jerk and a bully. See now here I thought I was being polite. This is what I find most peculiar about these boards. Nowhere did I call you a name. Nowhere did I try and pick a fight. I took a post you wrote on a public forum and I made statements in regard to your SPECIFIC statement, and asked questions. Why is that considered a bad thing? You made statements on a public forum. I responded. What do I get in return for this desire to continue the dialogue? I'm told "Dude, you are the worst", accused of being 'hard-wired to push and push and push', and 'picking fights' and then called "a "top tier" jerk and a bully." I'M the one out of line? Yes, you are. Maybe this specific line of posts isn't the best example, but there are plenty of instances to draw on. However, no amount of conversation between the two of us will change how you view your approach, attitude or their impact on others in the forum. Good day sir.

This isn't about the past, it's about the future. If you think prices will be higher in 10-20 years - when the people currently holding the majority of these books will be selling and nobody buying will be trying to buy back their childhood - than they are now, you could be in for a rude awakening.

I doubt that. Look at IH 180 & 181, for a prime example of why not. -slym Did Gambit only appear in one panel of Annual 14? I thought we proved that he appeared in multiple panels across multiple pages.

(thumbs u I think it's funny when I raise the price and the book sells. Best price is not always the buyer's motivation. More often, it's the right place at the right time. Which makes it essentially useless information for anybody looking at the market, just like if I find a Hulk 181 for $10, or manage to sell a Darkhawk 1 CGC 5.5 for $1000.

Oak, it's not good when you're in the running for most ridiculous post in a thread that contains a post from 1950's war comics.

One of my favourites not yet posted

I read just the right amount of romance novels. Side Rant: 50 Shades of Grey was one of the worst books in the history of writing. I take no issue with the 'controversial' content, people can write/read about what they like. But its written like a 14 year old girl who is struggling at continuation school who is fantasizing about what it must be like to (but obviously will never) attend university. The sentence and paragraph composition, the trite descriptions, the awkward pacing of the 'spicier' scenes, its all trash through and through, and not at all innovative in terms of content or in any other way. I have no idea why it caught on with anyone. I don't feel dirtier for having read it, just dumber, and sadder than anyone likes it, let alone everyone. It doesn't make you want to tie any one up, unless you count wanting to tie up the author so they can't write any more of these drivel books. If you're into that type of stuff but also into well written books, go read old Anne Rice stuff. What do you expect from garbage that started out as Twilight fan fiction? I have no idea how it ended up being picked up and published by a real book publisher. Anyway, events that occurred previous to the formation of a team can be important and relevant, but a team does not exist until it's officially formed.

The Scourge of the Underworld was not a unique character. EDIT: To expand on that, the Scourge was captured by Captain America after the massacre at the Bar with No Name. He was then shot and killed by someone with a familiar catchphrase ("Justice is served!", obviously) when he was about to talk. As far as first appearance discussion goes, the only thing really relevant for the Scourge is when we first see the costume.

Chuck was making some valid points about not taking advantage of unknowing collectors. Nobody should. But making it sound like they shouldn't put in the time to educate themselves - that I don't agree with. I have a feeling someone had been sitting back waiting to make that point for a while. It just all came out - on me. I have a feeling some sales guru somewhere said, 'don't make the customer work and you'll have better success'. I do agree in the seller putting the time in to demonstrate they care enough about the buyer experience. That is why stores that practice this approach in and outside of the comic book hobby build a loyal fanbase. We are in agreement there. I just like to encourage knowledge as well so even when that buyer is not dealing with me, they remember who helped them out later on if a not-so-nice seller attempts to take advantage. I hate hearing of someone being treated like a sucker. And I think someone should be able to enjoy the simplicity of a single issue without having to feel like they have to read the equivalent of Proust's À la recherche du temps perdu (In Search of Lost Time), to enjoy comics. Sure, but if they're spending any kind of real money on that single comic without really knowing much about it, they are insufficiently_thoughtful_persons. That doesn't come even close to excusing a seller who tries to take advantage of them, but the quality of the seller doesn't make the buyer any less stupid.