The Lions Den

On 3/31/2024 at 1:43 PM, Yorick said:

I'd say that's another bit of evidence that points towards the dot being an error and subsequently removed for later prints.  The plate should be perfect when it's created.  When someone is tasked with making alterations to the plate, it would be easy to mishandle it (especially at the top edge of the plate) and create tiny trenches on the raised letters which, in-turn, create pools of ink which bleed over.  Those bleed points are all in the same spots...  so it does not seem to be an operator error.

This is along the lines of what I was thinking---a little bit of ink bleed.

And while I'm certainly honored to be held in such high esteem, I've never actually worked with printing plates, though I once worked in a printing factory. But I certainly have worked with various types of ink (and paint) over the years, mostly as an aspiring artist.  

Still, ink is ink, and sometimes it can be pretty darn messy...  

On 3/31/2024 at 1:02 AM, OtherEric said:

The Tower of Demon Dooms:  Mike Ploog only does four stories for Warren.  He's one of those creators whose impact in comics is huge relative to how much work he actually did, including co-creating Ghost Rider, Werewolf by Night, and Weirdworld for Marvel.  His art here is excellent, except... the main character looks like D**k Tracy cosplaying as Conan, and I find it terribly distracting.

I do see the resemblance, but I suppose it could be partly because of Ploog's style---very Eisner-like.  

On 3/31/2024 at 1:02 AM, OtherEric said:

Overall, a great issue, starting with a spectacular cover and continuing with a bunch of stories ranging from very good to excellent.  I would have felt my 60 cents were very well spent if I bought this one off the racks.

I agree completely. One of the best issues in the run...    

On 3/29/2024 at 7:33 PM, Axe Elf said:

I didn't get the same disconnected feeling about "Prelude to Armageddon" that @OtherEric described.  In fact, I really liked this story a lot--between the Wood art and a script that actually made sense all the way through, it could be the best story of the issue--though perhaps not the most weighty or thought-provoking.  As a general fan of fantasy, though, the sprawling epic of centaurs and minotaurs and nymphs and ogres illustrated by Wood was a fabulous read, and then to tie it to the pre-history of Earth, before the ogres evolved into mankind, was a nice twist.

These are many of the same reasons I enjoy Wally's work so much---he has a way of bringing you into his world (and what a wonderful world it is)...    

On 3/28/2024 at 12:45 AM, OtherEric said:

Thank you, Axe Elf.  I think my appreciation for the story has gone up seeing your comments.  I agree that the Music Festival seems like an odd target in isolation; the only way it really makes sense to me is as a reaction to Altamont. 

Completely agreed that Corben seems inherently suited to color more than B&W, there's a reason that a huge percentage of the Color Sections we eventually get in the Warrens are by Corben. 

He's one of my favorites... 

Very sad news. In my dealings with him, he was always honest and informative. My deepest condolences to his family and friends. May he rest in peace...   

On 3/25/2024 at 6:43 AM, KCOComics said:

@The Lions Den explained this once. 

I think it's basically used at the graders discrepancy, when they feel a comic needs to be stabilized. 

I can't explain why some comics would need it and other nearly identical comics wouldn't.  

To be honest, the encapsulation team usually makes the call on whether a book requires a wedge or not. And while many comics may appear to be identical, there are often slight differences in the cut and overall size of a particular book which can result in the book being able to shift inside the inner well. It's also possible that the slab crew simply ran out of the right wells and had to improvise. Either way, just think of the wedge as an additional safety device and you've got the right idea... 

On 3/24/2024 at 1:08 AM, OtherEric said:

The Thing in Loch Ness:  The Warren debut of Bruce Jones, who is better known as a writer but has a lot of art credits as well. 

I always thought his art style was heavily influenced by EC artists like Frazetta and Williamson. Still, it's always nice to see his artwork, and his storytelling became first rate as time went on...   

On 3/17/2024 at 1:35 PM, Mr. Zipper said:

It's a mistake to think that grading is a derived from a mathematical formula or there are flaws that absolutely limit grade, e.g., if it has a piece out over x size, it can't grade higher than y.

Grading is a science AND an art, and overall eye appeal weighs heavily.

Granted, the X-Men 1 CGC 4.5 is not a strong 4.5, but I also think it's not unrealistic. Overall eye appeal is decent, no significant creasing and it's fairly bright. And I do think major keys are sometimes graded on a slight curve. 

For me, the 4.5 seems generous due to the variety of different flaws in the notes...but that's just my opinion.  

On 3/16/2024 at 10:33 PM, KCOComics said:

And you are one of those people I often consult! 

Every time we discuss a book, I learn something new and I greatly appreciate your willingness to share your knowledge! 

You're very welcome... 

On 3/16/2024 at 7:09 AM, KCOComics said:

I participated pretty actively for four years or so and learned a lot. And I'm still not an expert. I often reach out to people here for advice and thoughts. 

Your comment is right on the money---I changed it to my personal experience to show that it doesn't matter how long you've been doing it, there are always times when you need some friendly advice.

And as good as they are, at some point every grader at CGC has asked another grader for their opinion...

On 3/16/2024 at 6:20 AM, Darthvader23 said:

Is this the spot your refering @The Lions Den? comic was dead mint,( Encapsulation must have caused that damage in the top corner. ) when it left my hands. Kind of scared to send my second newstand edition of this comic. 

Not a big deal, but with this and the corner wear, enough to keep it out of 9.8...  

On 3/15/2024 at 11:43 PM, Darthvader23 said:

So, nobody can see what CGC are talking about?

I see what they're talking about; it looks like a small area of very light color loss below Batgirl's cape. But to be honest, that bit of corner wear on the back cover actually bothers me more...

It presents well in the holder, but I've found very few CGC graded books that were actually graded too harshly...

On 3/15/2024 at 10:37 AM, MadGenius said:

That's the real question, isn't it? Are they saying the book was nearly a 9.9 but for that flaw or are they saying it's essentially a 9.7 (strong 9.6 / weak 9.8)? I look at it as the latter since grader notes on 9.8s are not the norm.

To quote the honorable Frank Zappa (may God bless his mischievous soul): "I figure the odds be 50/50..."  

I've seen numerous examples of 9.8 graded books having notes. I'm actually appreciative when CGC enters grading notes for books like this, because they're basically saying without this flaw it may have graded at a 9.9 or 10... 

On 3/15/2024 at 12:48 AM, Delfloria said:

I can understand how this can happen regarding how people describe the condition of their comics. The comics in question are actually in better shape than the one you posted. They don't have any wear and tear except for the date stamps, which why I thought I would ask about it. I really appreciate the feedback and when I get a chance to get to my safe bank deposit box I will post photos.

Please bear in mind that date stamps can affect the grade depending upon how large they are, the placement of them and other various factors. However, if they're small and neat they likely wouldn't affect the grade at all. Moreover, some stamps are associated with books from pedigree collections (such as the Bethlehem collection) which can actually add value to the books. 

Either way, it sounds like you have some real treasures and I'm sure many folks here would love to see them... 

On 3/14/2024 at 9:39 PM, aj_curated said:

Thank you Jack - I was hoping it was a miss-cut! 
 

I would still be happy to hear what grade people think it is or if they have a different opinion. 

I'm thinking it would fall somewhere in the VG range...

On 3/14/2024 at 11:24 AM, Robot Man said:

Most things from the past just haven’t been improved enough for my liking. 

I hope you don't mind this slight alteration...   

On 3/13/2024 at 12:25 AM, grendelbo said:

I'll put it this way: A 9.6 is the average new book that you'll see---a 9.8 should be better than that.  

On 3/12/2024 at 5:10 PM, JK2022 said:

How about the difference between a 9.6 and a 9.8? I defy anyone to tell the difference, I know modern books are rarely "Grails" (which shouldn't matter anyway and how do you even have the balls to grade a paper comic book a 10!) but come-on! from 9.0 to 10 they are all over the place....

tell me I'm wrong.

If you profess to be the industry leader have some standards, (ISO 9000 for comics?) as of now it's a shoot on what will be returned regardless on what is sent in.

shame

 

Trust me, there is a difference...but very few people know what it is. 

On 3/12/2024 at 9:27 AM, Randall Dowling said:

I think you're correct about traditional pulp collectors.  But isn't part of the point of grading to bring in new collectors?  My guess is that many of them will turn their nose up at any restoration.  Experienced collectors of a given art form will know and understand the reality of work to restore pieces but the new money always seems to be more skittish about such things (understandably).

Now that CGC is involved, this entire genre will change, hopefully for the better.  

And I'd like to add that a "small amount of glue on cover" notation would likely be glue that was added to the book in an attempt to seal a tear or a similar flaw, which is often located along the spine.

Welcome to the future...   

On 3/3/2024 at 2:05 PM, Darwination said:

Happy to see they are catching missing pages.

My buddy knows his stuff!  

I'd be right on the edge of Qualified with this one...3.5 or so...