Batman#1 - "glue at staple" - help!!

[fishbone]

If you just entered the hobby and are in the market for a Batman #1, unrestored, & are considering one with a Metro price tag, to keep & not resell, maybe to slab but maybe not, does that make you a hobbyist, collector, speculator or investor?

 

Quick clarification -- I "re-entered" the hobby as an adult with some disposable income about 2.5 years ago -- did everything I could SA wise and moved to GA about 1 - 1.5 years ago. Thus the description of myself as a "relative" newbie - especially compared to most of you guys on these threads. Batman #1 is certainly not my first key GA book -- far from the truth as some on this thread know already, but it would be my biggest key acquisition to date.

 

FISH

[fishbone]

To me, the phrasing of "Someone has put glue at the staple. Otherwise, it is unrestored." sounds more ambiguous than necessary. Why not just say "its been slightly restored due to some glue at the staple"?

 

Personally, when I first started on eBay I purchased a raw book described as "slight dot of color touch, otherwise unrestored" and when I purchased it I was expecting a blue label back (with label notes) from CGC. There are blue label CGC books out there that say slight amount of color touch, or very small amount of glue and it can be very confusing for someone who's new to the hobby.

 

Obviously at the end of the day it is the buyer's responsibility to do his homework and know what he is buying (as was done in this case), but surely after decades as the self-proclaimed biggest dealer in the hobby, Metropolis could come up with a less ambiguous way of saying the book is restored? (Maybe come up with a description for a restored book that doesn't actually use the word "unrestored" to describe the book?) (This is all based on the assumption that this book would garner a purple label from CGC if sent in, which is the impression I got after reading Fishler's response? If this would be a blue label book with notes, obviously it was described correctly.)

 

As far as whether this was simply a poor choice of wording or written that way intentionally or what, I'm certainly in no position to say. As 1koko suggested, the price the book was offered to the buyer at might provide some insight here.

 

Was the book offered to the buyer at around what a restored VG Bat 1 would sell for? ($6000ish) or was it offered for more like what an unrestored Bat 1 VG would sell for? $12kish)?

 

If you have an unrestored Batman 1 in VG(with nice pages) for 12kish............

 

Would an unrestored Batman #1 in VG with nice pages really go for 12K??? Isn't that pretty much Guide ?? (don't have an Overstreet here at work, but seems pretty low for a key book like that, no?? Wouldn't one be looking at close to 2X Guide??)

 

FISH

[fishbone]

This has become a really great thread, hasn't it??!!

I hope this doesn't end it, because lots of good discussion here and LOTS for the newer collector to learn, but I want to tell you that I am going for it ---- not like it was a secret, because original price was listed on Metro's site --- my deal is for 10K. In summary, Batman #1 VG-, OW to OW/White pages, some glue @ bottom staple....May see about glue removal afterwards.........Wish me luck.............

 

Fishbone

[ciorac]

This has become a really great thread, hasn't it??!!

I hope this doesn't end it, because lots of good discussion here and LOTS for the newer collector to learn, but I want to tell you that I am going for it ---- not like it was a secret, because original price was listed on Metro's site --- my deal is for 10K. In summary, Batman #1 VG-, OW to OW/White pages, some glue @ bottom staple....May see about glue removal afterwards.........Wish me luck.............

 

Fishbone

 

Sounds like a fine purchase Fishbone!

[ciorac]

To me, the phrasing of "Someone has put glue at the staple. Otherwise, it is unrestored." sounds more ambiguous than necessary. Why not just say "its been slightly restored due to some glue at the staple"?

 

Personally, when I first started on eBay I purchased a raw book described as "slight dot of color touch, otherwise unrestored" and when I purchased it I was expecting a blue label back (with label notes) from CGC. There are blue label CGC books out there that say slight amount of color touch, or very small amount of glue and it can be very confusing for someone who's new to the hobby.

 

Obviously at the end of the day it is the buyer's responsibility to do his homework and know what he is buying (as was done in this case), but surely after decades as the self-proclaimed biggest dealer in the hobby, Metropolis could come up with a less ambiguous way of saying the book is restored? (Maybe come up with a description for a restored book that doesn't actually use the word "unrestored" to describe the book?) (This is all based on the assumption that this book would garner a purple label from CGC if sent in, which is the impression I got after reading Fishler's response? If this would be a blue label book with notes, obviously it was described correctly.)

 

As far as whether this was simply a poor choice of wording or written that way intentionally or what, I'm certainly in no position to say. As 1koko suggested, the price the book was offered to the buyer at might provide some insight here.

 

Was the book offered to the buyer at around what a restored VG Bat 1 would sell for? ($6000ish) or was it offered for more like what an unrestored Bat 1 VG would sell for? $12kish)?

 

If you have an unrestored Batman 1 in VG(with nice pages) for 12kish............

 

Would an unrestored Batman #1 in VG with nice pages really go for 12K??? Isn't that pretty much Guide ?? (don't have an Overstreet here at work, but seems pretty low for a key book like that, no?? Wouldn't one be looking at close to 2X Guide??)

 

FISH

 

GPA shows a couple selling for that price 3 - 4 years ago, but I would think they would be more than that now. GPA also shows a 5.0 selling a year ago for $27,000.

 

I don't track sales of these books the way Filter and Gator do, but 12k for a TRUE VG with white pages sounds like a bargain to me.

[Dad&Son-migration]

This has become a really great thread, hasn't it??!!

I hope this doesn't end it, because lots of good discussion here and LOTS for the newer collector to learn, but I want to tell you that I am going for it ---- not like it was a secret, because original price was listed on Metro's site --- my deal is for 10K. In summary, Batman #1 VG-, OW to OW/White pages, some glue @ bottom staple....May see about glue removal afterwards.........Wish me luck.............

 

Fishbone

 

Well done !!! and I concur that it's a fine choice you've made....the boys at Metro are good...despite the beating that some lay on them ...and I believe removal will be achieved if you want it down the road... but you've got a beautiful piece of comic Americana pop culture if the deal is sealed.

[sacentaur]

Here's a recent example of a raw book purchased from Metro with "separated siamese pages".

 

 

 

These are just sample pages; there are more. Metro graded this a 9.2, btw.

 

Have we already forgotten Primetime's experience with a Bats 1 that had archival tape/sealed tears that Metro graded "unrestored" 2.0 (later came back PLOD 1.0 from CGC)?

 

Best of luck to you fishbone; you're going to need it.

 

 

 

 

[JiveTurkeyMoFo]

This has become a really great thread, hasn't it??!!

I hope this doesn't end it, because lots of good discussion here and LOTS for the newer collector to learn, but I want to tell you that I am going for it ---- not like it was a secret, because original price was listed on Metro's site --- my deal is for 10K. In summary, Batman #1 VG-, OW to OW/White pages, some glue @ bottom staple....May see about glue removal afterwards.........Wish me luck.............

 

Fishbone

 

Sounds like a fine purchase Fishbone!

 

I agree. Considering a 3.0 with Extensive Professional Resto and a trimmed cover sold last year for $6,900, I don't see that big of a downside here.

 

 

[Dad&Son-migration]

Here's a recent example of a raw book purchased from Metro with "separated siamese pages".

 

 

 

These are just sample pages; there are more. Metro graded this a 9.2, btw.

 

Have we already forgotten Primetime's experience with a Bats 1 that had archival tape/sealed tears that Metro graded "unrestored" 2.0 (later came back PLOD 1.0 from CGC)?

 

Best of luck to you fishbone; you're going to need it.

 

 

 

 

Ouch !!! sacentaur...but without fabricating any facts..did you address the situation to Metro and was it dealt with accordingly ?? I'm not bashing... I've recieved a few books myself from higly regarded selling boardies and not said a thing because it didn't warrant being addressed... but I don't think page ears missing would be unaddressed by them... I know you don't like each other...but just keep it civil... they are human...how did they respond when approached with it ??

[Filter81]

 

Would an unrestored Batman #1 in VG with nice pages really go for 12K??? Isn't that pretty much Guide ?? (don't have an Overstreet here at work, but seems pretty low for a key book like that, no?? Wouldn't one be looking at close to 2X Guide??)

 

FISH

 

Hey Fish,

 

I was just going off of GPA. I haven't sold a Bat 1 4.0 myself in years. So $12k could be off. (Bill is the Batman king, he'd know better than me!)

 

Metro offers a return policy, correct? If you do decide to buy the book it may be worth rushing it over to CGC, seeing what they say, and returning the book if the news is bad? (There are definitely enough unrestored Bat 1s out there. You don't want to wind up paying an unrestored price for a book that turns out to be restored.)

 

 

[sacentaur]

I don't think page ears missing would be unaddressed by them

 

You think wrong - the first I learned of the chunks being out was when I opened the package.

 

did you address the situation to Metro

 

A pre-emptive strike PM was sent to me before I even rec'd the book.

 

I'll respond with more details once Stephen replies - I'd like to get all the cards on the table, but god forbid I wouldn't want to be accused of "piling on" or "bashing" poor Metro before they get a chance to respond.

[comicdonna]

A pre-emptive strike PM was sent to me before I even rec'd the book.

Could you explain what this means?

[Dad&Son-migration]

I don't think page ears missing would be unaddressed by them

 

You think wrong - the first I learned of the chunks being out was when I opened the package.

 

did you address the situation to Metro

 

A pre-emptive strike PM was sent to me before I even rec'd the book.

 

I'll respond with more details once Stephen replies - I'd like to get all the cards on the table, but god forbid I wouldn't want to be accused of "piling on" or "bashing" poor Metro before they get a chance to respond.

 

Interesting dilemma .... I can't imagine the circumstances involved because these guys aren't "fly by night" and don't usually balk at a sale indifference with the seller from experience...

of course.. I haven''t dropped the same amount on a book as you have yet... but I probably will soon...

 

I think it becomes due diligence at this stage when spending 4 figures... ask what a seller will or won't accept..and let them know what you will or won't accept... once the ground rules are layed out.. then close the deal if you're both happy...

[DrWatson]

A pre-emptive strike PM was sent to me before I even rec'd the book.

Could you explain what this means?

He received a message detailing the condition of the pages after he purchased the book, but before he physically received it. Right?

[TupennyConan]

Continues to be an excellent thread...

[DrWatson]

To me, the phrasing of "Someone has put glue at the staple. Otherwise, it is unrestored." sounds more ambiguous than necessary. Why not just say "its been slightly restored due to some glue at the staple"?

 

Personally, when I first started on eBay I purchased a raw book described as "slight dot of color touch, otherwise unrestored" and when I purchased it I was expecting a blue label back (with label notes) from CGC. There are blue label CGC books out there that say slight amount of color touch, or very small amount of glue and it can be very confusing for someone who's new to the hobby.

 

Obviously at the end of the day it is the buyer's responsibility to do his homework and know what he is buying (as was done in this case), but surely after decades as the self-proclaimed biggest dealer in the hobby, Metropolis could come up with a less ambiguous way of saying the book is restored? (Maybe come up with a description for a restored book that doesn't actually use the word "unrestored" to describe the book?) (This is all based on the assumption that this book would garner a purple label from CGC if sent in, which is the impression I got after reading Fishler's response? If this would be a blue label book with notes, obviously it was described correctly.)

 

As far as whether this was simply a poor choice of wording or written that way intentionally or what, I'm certainly in no position to say.

I agree with Adam. My thoughts would be either the book is restored or it isn't, but the Metro description is ambiguous to say the least. No, I am not a metro basher. I have purchased several books from them in the past but never raw.

[fishbone]

 

Would an unrestored Batman #1 in VG with nice pages really go for 12K??? Isn't that pretty much Guide ?? (don't have an Overstreet here at work, but seems pretty low for a key book like that, no?? Wouldn't one be looking at close to 2X Guide??)

 

FISH

 

Hey Fish,

 

I was just going off of GPA. I haven't sold a Bat 1 4.0 myself in years. So $12k could be off. (Bill is the Batman king, he'd know better than me!)

 

Metro offers a return policy, correct? If you do decide to buy the book it may be worth rushing it over to CGC, seeing what they say, and returning the book if the news is bad? (There are definitely enough unrestored Bat 1s out there. You don't want to wind up paying an unrestored price for a book that turns out to be restored.)

 

 

Already a considered option, for sure..........Thanks.The other thing I have to consider, obviously, is the rest of the facts quoted by Metro being true (VG- ??, no other "suprises"). I have had no problem with Metro in the past, but 10 frickin'' K is 10 frickin' K !!!!! It better not be like a 1.0 or 2.0!

 

FISH

 

[comicdonna]

A pre-emptive strike PM was sent to me before I even rec'd the book.

Could you explain what this means?

He received a message detailing the condition of the pages after he purchased the book, but before he physically received it. Right?

If that's the case, I wonder why this wasn't brought up to him before he purchased it. Maybe they didn't notice it until they were packaging it.

[The Black Hand ®]

A pre-emptive strike PM was sent to me before I even rec'd the book.

Could you explain what this means?

He received a message detailing the condition of the pages after he purchased the book, but before he physically received it. Right?

If that's the case, I wonder why this wasn't brought up to him before he purchased it. Maybe they didn't notice it until they were packaging it.

 

If that's the case they could have picked up the phone.