Fantastic Four #48 - STILL a major key book?!?!

[Bronty]

Uh-uh. Not in the same category.

 

When talking Mega-key spideys I think it ends at 1,14,and 50, with honorable mentions to 3,121,122,129. 96-98 and 100 do not rate.

[Guest]

Yes, most definitely, Bronty. Throw the 28 in the honorable mention crowd. Throw the price guide, the Wizard guide, the market indicators OUT on a #28 in 9.4 or better. A #28 in 9.4 or better on Ebay or Heritage would start a "feeding frenzy" of frantic bidding!

[Guest]

I'm not saying any of those things (ebay or heritage being a price guide, etc.) Why you read it that way is beyond me.

 

I was more picking on your small universe of books "to buy" and the reason that you chose them. To me, looking away from the obvious choices is where the really interesting returns are. Especially with the run-up that the usual suspects have had over the past few years. I also hate the way that you turn your nose up at anything that doesn't guide for 2k. I mean, it's a lot easier to catch 20 copies of a book that will move from $50 to $200 (or $400 to $1000) than it is to get a book to make the jump from $2k to 10K...

 

Now, if you're buying collections and your "buy-in" price is low, then by all means pour every dollar you can into the big books. I just don't see the wisdom of pouring money into books at record prices, in the middle of the hottest market ever.

[Guest]

MB, Blue chip is blue chip! Undoubtedly, there are STILL hundreds of investors sitting on case upon case of 1984 and 1985 wax, rack and vending cases, that they went for their "lungs" on, when Mattingly, Strawberry, and Gooden were "hot prospects" that drove the rookie market up and onward for the first following years after 1984, the cards and case prices escalating dramatically. Anyone that held too long, missed the boat and now has mulch in their attic instead of gold had it been cashed in at the right time. Collecting BLUE CHIPS, takes the guesswork OUT of 'when and if' it is the correct time to liquidate! If all those folks hoarding cases of ballplayers that had cards enjoy a price runup, only to nose-dive later on, had been buying VALUE, the "Blue Chips", Mantle, Dimaggio, Ruth, Cobb, Mathewson, etc. cards, or even split up their investment $$$$ proportinatley between the "penny stocks" and the blue chips, they would have done all right instead of losing untold thousands of dollars, by NOT striking while the iron was at its hottest. As long as there is a hobby, the comic Blue chips will thrive. These are the surest and safest hobby investment in all grades, the mitigating factor delineating what a good investment piece may be, only in consideration of the leverage of your "in" price when you're speaking of these "top 21" Silver age Marvels I listed above.

[lighthouse]

I can't remember the last time I agreed with you so strongly, Meth. Maybe you should take a day off to gather you thoughts more often.

 

I completely agree with your list of 20 keys, with the exception of the Spidey 122 which I don't think is in the same league as the other books you mention. I think the next weakest book is the FF25, but every book there is a solid blue-chip key.

 

As far as the ASM 28 goes, the reason for huge potential sales on high grade copies is that there are just no high grade copies available. You did not indicate it was a key, and rightfully so. The blue-chip keys sell well in ANY grade. I can find a buyer for the other books you listed in any grade at any time. ASM 28 has money waiting for prime copies, but little demand at the lower end, entirely a supply issue not a demand one.

 

One test of whether a book is a blue-chip key: If fifty copies in 9.4 suddenly became available would the book drop in price? On the other books you list buyers would happily upgrade, and there would be ready money to buy the books that were upgraded from... and so on... and so on... Fifty new copies might generate 500 sales. And there would still be people waiting in line.

 

Books like ASM 96-98, JIM 109, TOS 49, and even TTA 27 are all great books, but a sudden influx of high-grade specimens would not release pent-up demand for low to mid-grade copies in the same way. I have perhaps the worst completely readable Hulk 1 in existence, and I have twenty buyers at every show making me offers on it. That's a blue-chip key....

[FlyingDonut]

Yikes! I agree with Meth as well! What the hell is happening here?!?

 

I'd add ASM 42 and FF 4, and drop JIM 112 and ASM 122, but besides that its a great list!

 

 

 

 

 

[lighthouse]

I have a much easier time selling lower-grade copies of JIM 112 than I do of ASM 42, but I don't think we're far off here...

 

Whaddya think? Should we see if we can get Meth to take a day off every week?

[Guest]

I don't disagree with you for the most part. The only thing I disagree with is valuation. If you equate paying record prices on these books that have doubled, triple, whatevered in price over the past three years with value investing then you've lost me. To me all of these books are pure growth plays right now. They're "hot stocks." Coctail party stocks... At the right (wholesale) price point I love them. At PGCMINT or COMICLINK "retail" I don't have the stomach for it.

 

Also, even with that miserly approach it's not like I'm in comics for the stability of my investment dollars. The stuff I buy and sell within 6 months is run like any business- buy low, sell high. The "buy and hold" potion of my collection (the "investment books") are all attempts to hit home runs and even then I try to keep costs down.

 

But I'm not depending on any of this to fund my retirement. Even counting in rotating stock my comics outlay (cash spent, not "value") doesn't equal more than 10% of my portfolio and just the "buy and hold" books aren't more than 5%. In other words, it could all flame out in nastiness worse than even Gene imagines and it wouldn't kill me.

[lighthouse]

I dunno man.... Gene can imagine some pretty nasty stuff...

[Guest]

that's true, but I still think I can handle even his worst visions...

 

How about DD 7 for that list? Demand in all grades and ultra-demand in high grades. Plus, as far as I'm concerned it really is a value play. Pretty much Daredevil 1b.

[lighthouse]

*slaps forehead*

 

I can't believe I missed DD 7 when I went through the list. It absolutely belongs there. Very comparable to X-Men 12 IMHO.

[murph0]

If you include any of the ASM 121, 122, or 129. Then it's pretty hard to argue why ASM 100 shouldn't be included. It's ALWAYS been highly sought after, and has a classic cover..which is basically one of the reasons why ASM 50 is on the list..most people never really realized the first appearance of Kingpin..

 

Brian

[lighthouse]

I'm of the camp that none of those books qualify... all great books.. but I don't see the interest in lower grade copies that separates a key from a book that sells in high grade. I've got multiple copies of each of those books, and in mid-grade they sell about as fast as mid-grade Avengers 93... They just don't seem to have the "WOW" factor that attracts attention like the other books listed. People gape open-mouthed at my POS Hulk 1, they just don't do that with a $30 ASM 100.

[murph0]

It's beginning to be that way for just about any ASM book post-#18, seems everyone has this stuff. :\

 

Brian

[Guest]

Murph,

122 is the closure of countless conflicts with Spiderman's arch nemesis. Everything that happened in the preceeding 109 issues, culminated in the one panel where GG was impaled by his own vehicle. The next most important Spidey vs. Goblin issue AFTER #14...Marvel's main character's, main villain's death. A GREAT story, gruesome fitting death befit a villain who just aced the hero's girl, etc..

96-98, 100, 121, 129....just not in the same class. Almost every Spiderman want list I have of key issue completists, not title completists, has a 122 on it in NM or better. True, it won't sell in VF and below, unlike the ones I mentioned which will sell well in every grade across the board, not for any substantial amount, but it's a great COMIC book nonetheless and not altogether simple to find without the usual mechanical flaws (off-centeredness, lots of back cover showing around to the front before the appearance of the black spine line, etc.). The thing to remember is that not only are the books I mentioned HISTORIC keys, but great comic books with incredible art, concept, and story as well. Collectors AND investors as well "love" those issues, and rightfully so. If this were just about investing, just about buying plastic encased books and never even considering what the page content may be, you're missing 95% of the reason for collecting comics in the first place. If comics mean absolutely nothing to you other than slabbed or unslabbed, the grade, the page color, and the price...you might as well be investing in bushels of wheat and hoping for famine.

[Kevin76]

FInally!! someone "gets" what i was trying to tell everyone. Kevin

[awe4one]

Yep, there is a guy in Philly that has high grades ASM from 95-up in the dozens (or had, he has sold some and not sure what his current supply is). Recently bought a high grade (95% strict NM/In fact, if I was going to submit any to CGC, some of these would be the first) run of 97-150 from him. The comics were straight from the distributor to his hands. The comics never made it to the store and were unread/never opened. Absolutely beautiful copies.

 

My point is.....I'm sure he's not the only one hoarding HG ASMs.

 

 

Jim

[Guest]

Certain books, the MEGA-staples of the hobby...the true CLASSICS...these are the books that appear to stand the greatest immunity against depreciation

 

I'm going to have to disagree with you on a few of your picks...sure, most of them are important first appearances, but some of the books are there because of their scarcity in high grade (such as ASM 28). It's hard for me to justify putting the word "key" on a book just because it's a black cover book from the 60s and tough to find in 9.4 or better. I think the much-maligned on this thread ASM 122 (and even more so, 121 and 129) are more appropriately called keys. Sure they're not hard to find in high grade and don't care a 4-figure price tag except in 9.6 or better, but they're important books of Marvel's flagship title and have events in them which have now been immortalized on the silver screen and which a lot of people have strong passions about.

 

However, whether people will still care as much about these 3 books, or indeed all the of the books on your list Meth, in 20 years remains very much up to debate (at least to those of us who do not share Shuley's in-the-box, consensus, linearly-extrapolated view of the world).

 

Gene

[delekkerste]

Damn, I keep forgetting to log in before I post! That was my post before.

 

Gene

[ubiquiti]

I think I've figured this out...Shuley and gman are the same guy.

gman is Dr. Jeckle - pretty nice, polite, Shuley is Mr Hyde abbrasive, violent and irrational.

 

Whew!

Thats a load off my mind.