Does the grade really matter?

[conditionfreak]

I've just started collecting Signature Series books and it seems to me that it is all about the signatures, and not about the grade. At least to me it is.

 

Wouldn't it be better to keep the really pristine books unsigned, and instead get adequate books (9.0 or thereabouts) autographed?

 

I understand that it is all about personal choice, but do most of you want a signature series with five or ten signatures on it, in a 9.6 or higher, or you won't keep it in your collection?

 

Wouldn't an 8.5 be just as good?

 

Doesn't the signature/s really destroy the grade anyway, regardless of what CGC states on the label?

 

Does CGC take into consideration the placement of the signature, or the type and color of ink used for the signature? In other words, would an AF #15 signed by Stan Lee on Spideys crotch, be of a lesser quality, than one signed in an "open" area of the book, as far as CGC and YOU are concerned?

 

Can't anyone control or give a hint to Stan Lee? Maybe a SS witness or two?

[Par2ch]

To answer your questions

 

Does the grade matter?

Yes, the higher the grade of the book the better, but that does not mean that books that are graded below 9.8 are worthless. They just would be MORE valuable in a higher grade. I have some SS books in my collection that are below 9.8/9.6 and are valuable due to the signature on the book, but if that book was in 9.8/9.6 the book would be worth much more

 

Does the signature distroy the grade?

No. Although persoanlly I avoid getting signatures on some very high grade silver and older books I would not get SS just because I dont think that a signature will add that much to the book. But for lower grade keys as well as Bronze-Moderns signatures only make the books more appealing.

 

Does CGC take into consideration the placement of sigs, ink used etc?

No, this does not come into grading EXCEPT if the ink of the signature gets transferred to another book due to signature still being wet, then that other book will get bumped down a bit due to the transfer of ink to the back cover.

 

Location of Signature?

When I get a book signed I politely point to specific area of a book that I would like to artist to sign and most of the time they agree. I also supply them with my own pen and pen color so that I know that the silver sharpie is not dead.

 

 

 

[seanfingh]

 

I like to get the best grade that I can without spending too much for the book. As a result, for moderns I get mostly 9.8s some 9.6s and do get the ocassional 9.4 and below. (For example many of my rarer Goon SS books are 9.4 (Avatar #1, Best Cellars #1 etc). I bought the finest raw copy I could find. I wasn't going to pay $300 for a 9.8 and then crack it to get it signed. That's not how I roll. But some people do, and that is cool.

 

I also will do high grade Silver and Bronze books, but I try to evaluate them to make sure they are not too high grade. However, this year I did get two 9.8 Plops from 1975 and an Our Fighting Forces from 1976 in 9.8. If I knew they were 9.8 I probably wouldn't have had them done, but now that they are done they are super sweet. Most of my Silver are 8.0-9.2. I think a good balance between grade and value is warranted, but everyone is different.

[akaSteveRogers]

Well I probably have a small collection compared to most of the boardies here (all CGC, 35-42 books).

 

Since about 1/3 of my books are CGC SS, I can say that Im not one that finds 3 or 4 sigs on a book that appealing. I actually wouldn't get my books signed unless its a legendary artist/writer to me. I think I only have one artist where I have more than one of his signatures in my collection. That would be Zeck (and Isabella..which I sold to you I believe). My quest is more like Par2ch's WISH LIST...get a sig and cross it off.

 

My only minimum standard is that its at least a 9.4-9.8... depending on the era, availability and price.

 

And no, I don't get sigs on hard-to-find or pricey ultra high grade books. Id rather keep those pristine as is and not take the chance. There's something to be said for a 9.8 white-paged, perfectly-centered key book.

 

 

 

 

[THE_BEYONDER]

Does the grade really matter?

 

Not to me. I'd rather have a nice 9.2 with a clean signature....than a 9.8 with a bunch of scribbles all over it. Signature placement & the quality of the signature are the most important factors for me.

[bghkoyama]

Does the grade really matter?

 

Not to me. I'd rather have a nice 9.2 with a clean signature....than a 9.8 with a bunch of scribbles all over it. Signature placement & the quality of the signature are the most important factors for me.

 

I agree. I hate seeing Stan Lee sign in black sharpie in the blackest area of the comic. I buy the clean sig and what the cover looks like (don't care about the story line or anything else since it's slabbed, it will be for display purposes only).

My CGC SS collection is microscopic compared to the previous posters..

 

Brian

[NYComics]

 

Does the grade matter?

To Me grade matters. I will only keep 9.8 SS Books that are moderns if they are just signed. I make an exceptions for a sketch that is on like a 9.4-9.6 SI or FS or WTC issue if the sketch is good enough. For Marvel and DC silver age I am willing to accept anything above an 8.0. I am working on ASM Romita covers double signed and a few other keys here and there.

 

Does the signature distroy the grade?

No. Not at all so long as you handle your books properlly.

 

Does CGC take into consideration the placement of sigs, ink used etc?

Nah

 

Location of Signature?

You can cut a window over the area you want the signature in your bag and board. Or politley point like Dan said.

 

 

So honestly to me

Modern Just Sigs - Grade matters a TON

Sketches- Grades dont matter, sketch matters.

Silver Age- Depends on book, but refuse to keep below 8.0 on signature series that I have. (There are still A LOT of keys that I am missing so I could see myself possibly keeping some lower grade keys if I can't find high grade copies.)

 

my 2 cents

 

[Pirate]

it's all in the eye of the beholder. If you like it then that's what matters. If you don't like it, someone out there will.

[akaSteveRogers]

 

Modern Just Sigs - Grade matters a TON

 

I would even go as far as some copper books that are easily attainable/affordable. But I'm uh,...well...er,...

 

[conditionfreak]

I forget who it was on this forum, but someone stated something to the effect "if someone, ANYONE, scribbles on one of my books, there is going to be trouble".

 

That statement would have been true in my case for many a year. Now however, I can see getting some modern (easily replaced usually) books signed and SS slabbed. But I could not see having any of my Silver and Golden age books signed unless it was by a legendary creator and was a lower grade, easily replaced issue.

 

No way would I get an ASM #1 signed by Stan Lee, if it graded out 6.0 or higher. No way would I get a FF #5 signed by anyone, (except by Dr. Doom himself) if it graded out a 6.0 or higher. No way in heck would I get a signature on a Flash #104 or 105, if they graded out 6.0 or higher, by anyone.

 

Yes, I plan on getting some Stan Lee signatures on some lower grade Silver Age books. Some Neal Adams signatures on some Bronze and Copper age books, and some (if I can swing it) Alan Moore signatures on anything.

 

But to have someone scribble on a truly HG sought after book (say DD #7 or GL #76, grading 8.0 or higher), well, it ain't happening by me.

 

I like signatures, but I like covers more.

 

As has been said. To each his own. I want the best of both worlds. SS and unscribbled on books.

 

I have many books signed on the interiors by the likes of John Byrne, Stan Lee, Ron Lim and others. But, dang nab it, CGC was not around at the time. I could have obtained my signatures on the covers but I did not. It was unthinkable at the time, and is only now, ponderable.

 

P.S. If any of you SS Witnesses are going to be where Stan Lee, Neal Adams or Alan Moore (dream on) is going to be signing, please contact me with the particulars and I will send you a batch of books to be signed. They most likely will be lower grade books though. That's the way I roll.

 

Looking forward to the book Par2ch. I got some from Pirate previously and enjoy them immensly. Thanks gentlemen.

[Kevin Boyd]

Above all, Signature Series is about personal choice.

 

For many people, at shows, it's a "memento of the moment", something to commemorate their meeting one of their favourite creators.

 

For others, those who are less fortunate, who cannot afford to attend shows or signings where these creators attend --- such as those fans who don't live in North America --- this is a chance to have something more personal to connect with their favourite creators. They send their books far and wide to Witnesses to get them signed, and they send them in a variety of conditions --- ultimately, they make the choice of what to submit --- and our Witnesses take the utmost care with the books. For a lot of these collectors/fans it isn't about the book being a 9.8 or a 9.6, but about the fact that their comic was signed by the creator.

 

Witnesses have even gone out of their way to connect with creators who don't make public appearances, such as Frank Frazetta and Mike Zeck.

 

There are, of course, SS collectors who seek only high grade books. As such, they understand that these often do command premium prices when they buy them on the secondary market instead of submitting books to a Witness. If Signature placement is a buying concern for them, then they have the choice not to buy a book on the secondary market and patiently wait for another example in the condition they desire with a better signature placement to surface.

 

Every so often, this discussion of "doesn't this destroy the grade" comes up again.

 

If you are interested in autographed collectibles then Signature Series is the only authentic, verified signed comic collectible. Yes, it's a qualified condition grade -- it is a comic book with writing on the cover. Writing made by someone associated with the book. If you don't care about that, if that has no meaning to you, then I don't see why you would have any interest in Signature Series. Autographed collectibles do have meaning to people, and therefore meaning often equates to collectibility or "value" in their eyes. For many people, that writing on the cover makes the book more important to them, more valuable than the equivalent unsigned book in the same unqualified condition.

 

As a Signature Series Witness, I love all SS books. I reserve the right not to comment on what I like or don't like for my collection because I believe that what the customer wants is first priority.

 

What I like doesn't matter --- what you like does.

 

Placement of signature is the choice of the creator. You can guide them by using window bags or pointing to a spot. But the creator makes the choice. While there are times when I might think "great signature placement" I generally cannot be judging while working on behalf of the customer and relating with the creators individually. In my experience with Stan Lee - he takes the pen and goes. He does what he wants.

[seanfingh]

 

Kevin,

 

There are creators that really look for the optimum place to sign that come to mind - Joe Kubert and Ayers jump out at me.

[Kevin Boyd]

I agree Sean, some really do care and spend time looking for the best spot to sign. Some even have specific spots on certain books that they always sign on. John Romita is another guy who takes time to find a good spot. Chris Claremont always prefers to sign on the X-Men logo.

 

As Joe Kubert is a guy known for his love of the medium and it's fans, that doesn't surprise me. Actually, I'm currently about half way through his biography "Man of Rock" and so far it has been a fascinating read. I highly recommend it.

[Skynwalker]

I forget who it was on this forum, but someone stated something to the effect "if someone, ANYONE, scribbles on one of my books, there is going to be trouble".

 

That statement would have been true in my case for many a year. Now however, I can see getting some modern (easily replaced usually) books signed and SS slabbed. But I could not see having any of my Silver and Golden age books signed unless it was by a legendary creator and was a lower grade, easily replaced issue.

 

No way would I get an ASM #1 signed by Stan Lee, if it graded out 6.0 or higher. No way would I get a FF #5 signed by anyone, (except by Dr. Doom himself) if it graded out a 6.0 or higher. No way in heck would I get a signature on a Flash #104 or 105, if they graded out 6.0 or higher, by anyone.

 

Yes, I plan on getting some Stan Lee signatures on some lower grade Silver Age books. Some Neal Adams signatures on some Bronze and Copper age books, and some (if I can swing it) Alan Moore signatures on anything.

 

But to have someone scribble on a truly HG sought after book (say DD #7 or GL #76, grading 8.0 or higher), well, it ain't happening by me.

 

I like signatures, but I like covers more.

 

As has been said. To each his own. I want the best of both worlds. SS and unscribbled on books.

 

I have many books signed on the interiors by the likes of John Byrne, Stan Lee, Ron Lim and others. But, dang nab it, CGC was not around at the time. I could have obtained my signatures on the covers but I did not. It was unthinkable at the time, and is only now, ponderable.

 

P.S. If any of you SS Witnesses are going to be where Stan Lee, Neal Adams or Alan Moore (dream on) is going to be signing, please contact me with the particulars and I will send you a batch of books to be signed. They most likely will be lower grade books though. That's the way I roll.

 

Looking forward to the book Par2ch. I got some from Pirate previously and enjoy them immensly. Thanks gentlemen.

Trust me, once you get started with sigs, it's seriously addictive. And this is coming from a guy who didn't care one way or another about sigs a year or two ago.

 

On second thought...don't do it!!! Turn back now while you still can!!!

[conditionfreak]

 

"On second thought...don't do it!!! Turn back now while you still can!!!"

 

 

 

[Mac Man]

I've just started collecting Signature Series books and it seems to me that it is all about the signatures, and not about the grade. At least to me it is.

Sounds like you and I are in the same boat--love the comics and siggies!

 

Wouldn't it be better to keep the really pristine books unsigned, and instead get adequate books (9.0 or thereabouts) autographed?

Well, if you're really just concerned about the signatures and not the grades, then this is a non-issue. For me, if I'm going to get a book signed, the grade doesn't get factored in, but instead, is this an example of that creator's best work (i.e. AF 15 for Stan Lee, ASM 300 for McFarlane, etc)

 

I understand that it is all about personal choice, but do most of you want a signature series with five or ten signatures on it, in a 9.6 or higher, or you won't keep it in your collection? Wouldn't an 8.5 be just as good?

I don't collect slabbed books, but again, I don't care that much about the grade. If it's a good bargain on a book I want, I'm happy with it. If I'm able to further enhance the book through getting it signed, all the better.

 

Doesn't the signature/s really destroy the grade anyway, regardless of what CGC states on the label?

Not if it signed by someone who contributed to the issue/title. Makes it far more valuable if you want my

 

Does CGC take into consideration the placement of the signature, or the type and color of ink used for the signature? In other words, would an AF #15 signed by Stan Lee on Spideys crotch, be of a lesser quality, than one signed in an "open" area of the book, as far as CGC and YOU are concerned? Can't anyone control or give a hint to Stan Lee? Maybe a SS witness or two?

CGC doesn't, but I do know some buyers will certainly take these factors into consideration. Further, I know many artists are pretty agreeable to signing books with your markers/pens if you provide them (to get the color you want) as well as placement requests. For my Stan Lee signed ASM 50, I simply cut out a hole in the mylar where I wanted him to sign it. Problem solved!

 

 

[Mac Man]

...Chris Claremont always prefers to sign on the X-Men logo.

 

Really? Most of the signatures for Chris that I've seen have been on the bottom edge of the splash page right below the credits. Even Jim Lee commented on this when I presented him with my X-Men #1 vo.l. 2. As soon as I opened it, he said "Ah, Chris already signed this, huh?"

 

SUCH a cool collecting moment.

[Kevin Boyd]

Okay... when he signs on the covers, he prefers to sign on the X-Men logo.... and if Jim Lee has already signed an X-Men 1 on the logo he signs over Jim's signature.

[alwaysbronze]

[MutantKeys]

It's true... you should see what he did to my book at the National . It still looks fine, but I had a good laugh when Kevin told me the reason he did it...