PROBATION DISCUSSIONS 21 21

[RockMyAmadeus]

I like this sentiment.

 

Some accountability is nice. This notion in child rearring nowadays is that there is no wrong answer, everyone is equal, there should be no winners or losers in games, etc. It fosters a sense of entitlement with all these kids. Many of them will grow to be the losers that they foreshadow in their youth. I'm actually not a fan of this pay your debt and be forgiven. If you act like an azzhole more than once, chances are you are azzhole.

 

 

 

 

No one, at any time, suggested, implied, or even hinted that forgiveness has anything whatsoever...in any conceivable way, by any possible measure...to do with anything you've just stated.

 

In fact...if you bother to actually comprehend what is written, you will notice that complete accountability and restitution is required before even a consideration of forgiveness would be given.

 

Forgiveness has absolutely nothing....let me repeat that....nothing...to do with concepts like "there is no wrong answer", "everyone is equal", "there should be no losers."

 

I sure hope you don't ever need forgiveness for anything in life.

[divad]

Why don't all parties just agree to revist this discussion when a HOS member returns to make a concerted and humble effort to rectify their past behavior?

 

I will commence with the breath-holdng now.

[RockMyAmadeus]

Why should we bend over backwards to allow someone forgiveness who has never shown even the slightest inkling or desire to do the right thing, make amends or even ask for a way back in?

 

Oh for crying out loud.

 

 

No one suggested this. No one even implied this.

 

There is a MASSIVE, MASSIVE difference between the POSSIBILITY of forgiveness, and your statement.

 

MASSIVE difference.

 

 

As stated quite clearly before, the entire weight of proving oneself would rest on the guilty party, and would have to be so compelling, so convincing, so far above and beyond what they did to land on the list, over such a consistent period of time, as to convince even the most unforgiving board member.

 

This is NOT "bending over backwards."

[divad]

Both RMA and October are right (sometimes) - it's not written in stone, but it does take a sincere act of redemption to be forgiven. And forgive we shall, given the right circumstances . . . well, except for maybe whatshisname, whose transgressions are countless

[Prince Namor]

Both RMA and October are right (sometimes) - it's not written in stone, but it does take a sincere act of redemption to be forgiven. And forgive we shall, given the right circumstances . . . well, except for maybe whatshisname, whose transgressions are countless

 

+100

Of course, given the right circumstances, why would we NOT, as human beings, who have all made mistakes, give someone an opportunity to try again?

Will those right circumstances ever be attempted by the people on that HOS list?

Probably not.

But if any one of those people have the balls to come back here and make restitution, PLUS whatever is deemed necessary, AND get a vote of approval (so to speak) from the people we trust to monitor and update this list, then that's a heck of a hurdle.

It will probably never happen.

But I prefer to think of the one self-governing portion of this board as having the humanity and wisdom to properly handle it if it does.

[thehumantorch]

The Probation List and HOS are here to warn people. It isn't a life sentence and

it doesn't ban them from participating on the boards. It doesn't even prevent

them from buying or selling.

 

Frankly, if TFL or Cap Freak came back here and apologized and did their best

to rectify their mistakes and truly turned the honest corner I could see moving

them from the HOS to the Probation List or perhaps a new list of paroled members

trying to expunge their past.

 

There are far more books for sale here than I can afford so my #1 criteria

when buying is the quality of the seller.

 

Does he contribute other than for sale threads?

Have I had friendly transactions with him in the past?

What is my take on his overall board personna?

Can he grade?

 

To be perfectly blunt. If he has ever been on the Probo List it is unlikely

that I would even click on his sales thread. If he is new I probably won't

give him a chance unless it is a cheap item and I like his posting style.

If I ever thought he was rude and totally out of line I once again wouldn't

click on his sales thread.

[mikenyc]

I like this sentiment.

 

Some accountability is nice. This notion in child rearring nowadays is that there is no wrong answer, everyone is equal, there should be no winners or losers in games, etc. It fosters a sense of entitlement with all these kids. Many of them will grow to be the losers that they foreshadow in their youth. I'm actually not a fan of this pay your debt and be forgiven. If you act like an azzhole more than once, chances are you are azzhole.

 

 

 

 

No one, at any time, suggested, implied, or even hinted that forgiveness has anything whatsoever...in any conceivable way, by any possible measure...to do with anything you've just stated.

 

In fact...if you bother to actually comprehend what is written, you will notice that complete accountability and restitution is required before even a consideration of forgiveness would be given.

 

Forgiveness has absolutely nothing....let me repeat that....nothing...to do with concepts like "there is no wrong answer", "everyone is equal", "there should be no losers."

 

I sure hope you don't ever need forgiveness for anything in life.

 

I missed you <3

[mikenyc]

I like this sentiment.

 

Some accountability is nice. This notion in child rearring nowadays is that there is no wrong answer, everyone is equal, there should be no winners or losers in games, etc. It fosters a sense of entitlement with all these kids. Many of them will grow to be the losers that they foreshadow in their youth. I'm actually not a fan of this pay your debt and be forgiven. If you act like an azzhole more than once, chances are you are azzhole.

 

 

 

 

No one, at any time, suggested, implied, or even hinted that forgiveness has anything whatsoever...in any conceivable way, by any possible measure...to do with anything you've just stated.

 

In fact...if you bother to actually comprehend what is written, you will notice that complete accountability and restitution is required before even a consideration of forgiveness would be given.

 

Forgiveness has absolutely nothing....let me repeat that....nothing...to do with concepts like "there is no wrong answer", "everyone is equal", "there should be no losers."

 

I sure hope you don't ever need forgiveness for anything in life.

 

I know it's difficult to comprehend but every post on these boards is not about you.

 

The pious soap box that you preach upon does not behoove you. (thumbs u From saving Paypal Personal to removing the Sword of Damacles hanging above the head of a troubled boy on the HOS, you have the uncanny ability of being obnoxious.

 

Before calling my comprehension skills into question, chiggity check yourself. Yes you made a post that took the conversation in a different direction but every comment made thereafter does not require a response from you. I was referring to the post that Comix made about placing some responsibility on a minor and making the completely logical connection that many, but not all, minors who act out in a criminal manner continue that behavior into adulthood.

 

My response, not to you, was that the behaviors instilled in children nowadays seems to foster a sense of entitlement that I believe adds to the occurrence of negative actions which are completely self fulfilling to the detriment of others.

 

I apologize for not quoting your comment and responding directly but I felt Comix did a superb job, which is why I was responding to his post.

 

 

[Speedy-D]

Where's criminal manor? Is it near Wayne Manor?

[Snake Eyes]

I like this sentiment.

 

Some accountability is nice. This notion in child rearring nowadays is that there is no wrong answer, everyone is equal, there should be no winners or losers in games, etc. It fosters a sense of entitlement with all these kids. Many of them will grow to be the losers that they foreshadow in their youth. I'm actually not a fan of this pay your debt and be forgiven. If you act like an azzhole more than once, chances are you are azzhole.

 

 

 

 

No one, at any time, suggested, implied, or even hinted that forgiveness has anything whatsoever...in any conceivable way, by any possible measure...to do with anything you've just stated.

 

In fact...if you bother to actually comprehend what is written, you will notice that complete accountability and restitution is required before even a consideration of forgiveness would be given.

 

Forgiveness has absolutely nothing....let me repeat that....nothing...to do with concepts like "there is no wrong answer", "everyone is equal", "there should be no losers."

 

I sure hope you don't ever need forgiveness for anything in life.

 

I know it's difficult to comprehend but every post on these boards is not about you.

 

The pious soap box that you preach upon does not behoove you. (thumbs u From saving Paypal Personal to removing the Sword of Damacles hanging above the head of a troubled boy on the HOS, you have the uncanny ability of being obnoxious.

 

Before calling my comprehension skills into question, chiggity check yourself. Yes you made a post that took the conversation in a different direction but every comment made thereafter does not require a response from you. I was referring to the post that Comix made about placing some responsibility on a minor and making the completely logical connection that many, but not all, minors who act out in a criminal manor continue that behavior into adulthood.

 

My response, not to you, was that the behaviors instilled in children nowadays seems to foster a sense of entitlement that I believe adds to the occurrence of negative actions which are compleyely self fulfilling to the detriment of others.

 

I apologize for not quoting your comment and responding directly but I felt Comix did a superb job, which is why I was responding to his post.

 

 

My goodness Mike A serious post??? No mention of monkeys in cowboy costumes, mekrab, or inappropriate uses for Batman's utility belt. I stand in complete and utter

 

 

Seriously though, you make an excellent point above about the evolution/entrenchment of such behavioral patterns

[mikenyc]

Where's criminal manor? Is it near Wayne Manor?

 

::

 

ing autocorrect!

[Bio-Rupp]

I like this sentiment.

 

Some accountability is nice. This notion in child rearring nowadays is that there is no wrong answer, everyone is equal, there should be no winners or losers in games, etc. It fosters a sense of entitlement with all these kids. Many of them will grow to be the losers that they foreshadow in their youth. I'm actually not a fan of this pay your debt and be forgiven. If you act like an azzhole more than once, chances are you are azzhole.

 

 

 

 

No one, at any time, suggested, implied, or even hinted that forgiveness has anything whatsoever...in any conceivable way, by any possible measure...to do with anything you've just stated.

 

In fact...if you bother to actually comprehend what is written, you will notice that complete accountability and restitution is required before even a consideration of forgiveness would be given.

 

Forgiveness has absolutely nothing....let me repeat that....nothing...to do with concepts like "there is no wrong answer", "everyone is equal", "there should be no losers."

 

I sure hope you don't ever need forgiveness for anything in life.

 

I know it's difficult to comprehend but every post on these boards is not about you.

 

The pious soap box that you preach upon does not behoove you. (thumbs u From saving Paypal Personal to removing the Sword of Damacles hanging above the head of a troubled boy on the HOS, you have the uncanny ability of being obnoxious.

 

Before calling my comprehension skills into question, chiggity check yourself. Yes you made a post that took the conversation in a different direction but every comment made thereafter does not require a response from you. I was referring to the post that Comix made about placing some responsibility on a minor and making the completely logical connection that many, but not all, minors who act out in a criminal manor continue that behavior into adulthood.

 

My response, not to you, was that the behaviors instilled in children nowadays seems to foster a sense of entitlement that I believe adds to the occurrence of negative actions which are compleyely self fulfilling to the detriment of others.

 

I apologize for not quoting your comment and responding directly but I felt Comix did a superb job, which is why I was responding to his post.

 

 

My goodness Mike A serious post??? No mention of monkeys in cowboy costumes, mekrab, or inappropriate uses for Batman's utility belt. I stand in complete and utter

 

 

Seriously though, you make an excellent point above about the evolution/entrenchment of such behavioral patterns

 

" chiggity check yourself "

 

Whilst young Mikenyc88 may not be as versed in the cool tune-age of the mid 80's... I can see by the above that the late 80's - early 90's gangsta might be his forte. I'm sure he owns multiple AK's... probably purchased from Detroit Mike

 

A damn fine genre of music I might add.

 

Oh...and a lot of good points here, sir.

[Bosco685]

Is this the new Comics General?

 

 

[seanfingh]

PS...from my experience, people start acting like Knobs at about age 8, and you can predict where their personality is going from there with alarming accuracy. A Old Knob starts out as a Young Knob, pretty much every time.

 

I agree with this 100% My point is that there are positive ways to move the young knob off the path to knobdom. They may take them and they may not. CapFreak did not.

 

I know your background and I know that you have seen more than your share of bad eggs, that no amount of work was going to make them good eggs. I have been fortunate to be a part of a couple different programs that have taken recidivist delinquents and helped them turn themselves around.

 

It doesn't always work, by any stretch of the imagination, but it does sometimes. I know that this discussion cropped up around CapFreak. To me, it is not about CapFreak, it is about all the other CapFreaks out there who may be painted with the broad brush that he (perhaps rightfully) has been painted.

 

It is one of my real hot buttons, and I appreciate the indulgence.

[mikenyc]

 

 

 

" chiggity check yourself "

 

Whilst young Mikenyc88 may not be as versed in the cool tune-age of the mid 80's... I can see by the above that the late 80's - early 90's gangsta might be his forte. I'm sure he owns multiple AK's... probably purchased from Detroit Mike

 

A damn fine genre of music I might add.

 

Oh...and a lot of good points here, sir.

 

I was 11 around '91 when the Cross Color phase began. I would throw on some Das Fx and my purple jeans and rock that out! It was pretty horrific. ::

[october]

 

 

 

" chiggity check yourself "

 

Whilst young Mikenyc88 may not be as versed in the cool tune-age of the mid 80's... I can see by the above that the late 80's - early 90's gangsta might be his forte. I'm sure he owns multiple AK's... probably purchased from Detroit Mike

 

A damn fine genre of music I might add.

 

Oh...and a lot of good points here, sir.

 

I was 11 around '91 when the Cross Color phase began. I would throw on some Das Fx and my purple jeans and rock that out! It was pretty horrific. ::

 

I was 11 as well. I remember Cross Colors, I also remember people wearing their jeans backwards because the daddy mack did, in fact, make us jump, jump.

 

 

[comix4fun]

PS...from my experience, people start acting like Knobs at about age 8, and you can predict where their personality is going from there with alarming accuracy. A Old Knob starts out as a Young Knob, pretty much every time.

 

I agree with this 100% My point is that there are positive ways to move the young knob off the path to knobdom. They may take them and they may not. CapFreak did not.

 

I know your background and I know that you have seen more than your share of bad eggs, that no amount of work was going to make them good eggs. I have been fortunate to be a part of a couple different programs that have taken recidivist delinquents and helped them turn themselves around.

 

It doesn't always work, by any stretch of the imagination, but it does sometimes. I know that this discussion cropped up around CapFreak. To me, it is not about CapFreak, it is about all the other CapFreaks out there who may be painted with the broad brush that he (perhaps rightfully) has been painted.

 

It is one of my real hot buttons, and I appreciate the indulgence.

 

 

That makes perfect sense, and I respect it. It's good work you have done, and for the kids that really want to make a change and get onto the right path they probably would not be able to do it without programs like you describe. I am just glad there are kids who want to make that change.

 

It is also why I donate heavily to the SCFFWHS every year.

 

The Super Cuts Fund For Wayward Hair Styles.

 

The statistics are damning and show an almost 90% correlation between questionable hair styles and questionable actions. The next 8% go on to become douchenozzles, sadly.

 

The last 2% are harmless but immediately recognizable, AKA ROY.

[mikenyc]

PS...from my experience, people start acting like Knobs at about age 8, and you can predict where their personality is going from there with alarming accuracy. A Old Knob starts out as a Young Knob, pretty much every time.

 

I agree with this 100% My point is that there are positive ways to move the young knob off the path to knobdom. They may take them and they may not. CapFreak did not.

 

I know your background and I know that you have seen more than your share of bad eggs, that no amount of work was going to make them good eggs. I have been fortunate to be a part of a couple different programs that have taken recidivist delinquents and helped them turn themselves around.

 

It doesn't always work, by any stretch of the imagination, but it does sometimes. I know that this discussion cropped up around CapFreak. To me, it is not about CapFreak, it is about all the other CapFreaks out there who may be painted with the broad brush that he (perhaps rightfully) has been painted.

 

It is one of my real hot buttons, and I appreciate the indulgence.

 

I definitely agree. I think that what separates most minors with criminal histories and the rest of us without, is they got caught. When I reflect back on all the stupid things I did when I was younger, many I'm not proud of, some not so legal, most dangerous, I thank God that I was one of the fortunate ones.

 

The actions of someone who cannot comprehend the consequences of said actions should not have to have the rest of their lives overshadowed by childhood mistakes. I believe that is why they seal juvenile offenses and eventually allow for them to be expunged, if certain criteria is met.

 

The caveat is those who believe that redemption is possible for all. Sometimes records can't be erased, sometimes the actions will follow you and you will wear those mistakes on your chest like a certain hussy! The broad brushstrokes are necessary in many cases and I'm glad they are used.

 

Monkey anus with a side of Bavarian duck sauce. (thumbs u

[Bio-Rupp]

 

 

 

" chiggity check yourself "

 

Whilst young Mikenyc88 may not be as versed in the cool tune-age of the mid 80's... I can see by the above that the late 80's - early 90's gangsta might be his forte. I'm sure he owns multiple AK's... probably purchased from Detroit Mike

 

A damn fine genre of music I might add.

 

Oh...and a lot of good points here, sir.

 

I was 11 around '91 when the Cross Color phase began. I would throw on some Das Fx and my purple jeans and rock that out! It was pretty horrific. ::

 

I was 11 as well. I remember Cross Colors, I also remember people wearing their jeans backwards because the daddy mack did, in fact, make us jump, jump.

 

 

I'm sure we all went through our Oakland Raiders hoodie wearin', KRS-1 & Tribe Called Quest days with The Cactus Album by 3rd Bass thrown in for some lyrical white-rap, wisdom checkin', yo yo.

 

Now... stop yakin' and get back to the more important, pressing matters of the probation discussion board. A lot of good points being passed about here today.

[JazzMan]

 

I'm getting a little bored. Can we get down to the matter at hand and nail down the original intent of this discussion and set the ground rules?