PROBATION DISCUSSIONS 20 20

[Dr. Balls]

This seems like one of those situations where the more discussion it entails the worse everyone will end up looking.

 

That's why I'm in this thread!

 

On a side note - In my experience a small bit of tape still can keep a book in the VG range, and I'd go so far to say that even if it goes unmentioned - it's still consistent with the flaws in the VG grade.

 

VG/FN? I'm not sure.

[Iceman399]

My :

 

If I was Gambit I would say hey I guess it had tape and didn't disclose it sure send back for a full refund on that book only. I can see why you wouldn't want to do that but makes you look like a class act seller and will benefit you down the road.

 

If I was Jsilver I wouldn't BUY Things I can't afford. You look like a person_who_is_obnoxiously_self-impressed trying to back out and then finding a reason to push more down the road. Chalk it up to a learning experience and ask more questions next time. So suck it up and say I have learned from this experience.

Edited August 14, 2013 by iceman399

[Boboset]

I'm no expert on tape (I don't think CGC has it figured out correctly either) but I have to say that easily looks VG/F to me.

[Dr. Balls]

As per cgc tape doesn't affect the grade anymore just viewed as being there so suck it up and say I have learned from this experience.

 

Tape does affect the grade now, with the new standards implemented on May 1 - I'm thinking that is going to cause some grading problems for awhile until we see how much it affects the low grade books.

[Ryan.]

Iceman just about hit this one on the nose with a boxing glove arrow.

 

And the book looks like a legit 5.0 candidate to these eyes.

[GAMBIT]

 

Let me ask you this: why did you want out of the deal before receiving the books? I suspect I know the answer but perhaps there is more to it than what I assume.

 

I spent too much for them. I travel for work and have to pay my expenses up front. I had purchased other books that same week before I had received my assignment to head to Philly. Of the 4 transactions I made, that was the one that seemed less desirable. Plus 2 of the 4 had already told me they had received payment and were in process of shipping. Just trying to have money for work. When Gambit said no, I went ahead and sold a few of my books that I was going to move eventually and that's how I paid for my trip.

 

You wanted out of the deal because " I fell into the hype" is the exact words you said to me via PM

 

I know said I don't want to go back and forth and I'm not, but I have to make this clear. He is trying to switch things around and make it seem like something it's not. his intentions to get out if this deal where obvious all along.

[jsilverjanet]

tape does affect in my opinion as that books resale value is not the same as a book without it but i see the groups point.

 

 

[Ryan.]

This seems like one of those situations where the more discussion it entails the worse everyone will end up looking.

 

That's why I'm in this thread!

 

 

I think you're getting your wish.

[mschmidt]

You sell a book, don't disclose the tape, buyer is unhappy, you take it back for a full refund.

 

End of story.

[skypinkblu]

I've never dealt with Gambit, but I have dealt with Hector and I found him easy to work with.

 

I'm reading this thread and thinking of a commercial that my husband always makes fun of ...something about "stop stop you are both right!"

 

I'd be reluctant to take a return because some kind of hype was over. I understand that problem.

 

however, I have a problem with people selling without pictures/scans or descriptions. It leads to misunderstandings and strife. I just can't figure out why people do it, and if they do...why people buy those items? What is the rush?

 

For sellers...

 

Unless you are stranded somewhere with no money and need an immediate cash influx to get to a job interview...wait and post the threads when you get the pictures...

 

and if you are a buyer...count to 100...and wait for the pictures.

 

We all make mistakes, Giving a book a grade without mentioning tape...not a great idea, especially because there is another kind of hype going on here, CGC's mysterious new grading stance on tape. Now we know that they say they will grade the book as if the tape is not there, but I don't know that anyone is so completely sure yet of what that would be.

 

I can understand someone being uncomfortable about receiving a book with undisclosed tape. Of course that could have just been an error on the seller's part and if I were the seller, I'd offer some compensation or a return on that book only....but that's me.

 

As for one book balancing the other out...I see people advertise about how great they are at grading, that they undergrade. That's nice...however, if it's HOW you grade, you shouldn't expect any kind of price bump...if you do, just assign the book the grade you really think it is.

 

To misquote my husband again..."there ain't no crying undergrading in baseball comics".Just give the book the grade you believe to be true.

 

If the seller thought it was a VG/F and then realized he missed some tape, it would most probably not be a VG/F to him now.

 

The PGM forum is great, but it's really easier to grade the book in person.

[comix4fun]

This seems like one of those situations where the more discussion it entails the worse everyone will end up looking.

 

That's why I'm in this thread!

 

On a side note - In my experience a small bit of tape still can keep a book in the VG range, and I'd go so far to say that even if it goes unmentioned - it's still consistent with the flaws in the VG grade.

 

VG/FN? I'm not sure.

 

 

It's not above a vg/fn for sure, but given the books I just had graded it looks like a 4.5-5.0 pretty easily. Throw in that the other book was a 5.5-6.0 and the buyer is ahead on average.

 

That's an extremely minor piece of tape.

[Point Five]

My -- jsilverjanet didn't act in a stellar manner throughout, but IMO the tape should have been disclosed, even if the book falls within the grade range either way. I'd be disappointed to open the cover and find it in there.

 

I do understand why the seller is reluctant to pursue the transaction any further with the buyer, but perhaps at least a token effort should be made to see if there's a way to satisfy them.

 

(BTW -- what is up with the bottom staple area pictured?)

 

 

[comix4fun]

You sell a book, don't disclose the tape, buyer is unhappy, you take it back for a full refund.

 

End of story.

 

 

Buyer commits to a book sight unseen willingly, tape is consistent with the grade (and extremely small), buyer never mentions that his :take it: is contingent on personal tape pet peeve, you turn down 4 other buyers because buyer took them sight unseen, you also sell buyer a book under-graded by 1/2 to full point grade in the same deal....do you still take it back even though it fits the grade, buyer willingly took it without contingency, and is getting the better end of the grading on the other book?

 

 

[jsilverjanet]

 

Let me ask you this: why did you want out of the deal before receiving the books? I suspect I know the answer but perhaps there is more to it than what I assume.

 

I spent too much for them. I travel for work and have to pay my expenses up front. I had purchased other books that same week before I had received my assignment to head to Philly. Of the 4 transactions I made, that was the one that seemed less desirable. Plus 2 of the 4 had already told me they had received payment and were in process of shipping. Just trying to have money for work. When Gambit said no, I went ahead and sold a few of my books that I was going to move eventually and that's how I paid for my trip.

 

You wanted out of the deal because " I fell into the hype" is the exact words you said to me via PM

 

I know said I don't want to go back and forth and I'm not, but I have to make this clear. He is trying to switch things around and make it seem like something it's not. his intentions to get out if this deal where obvious all along.

 

True I did say that. Just because I didn't disclose the rest of my financial situation to you doesn't mean what I said above isn't true. I can show you the 3 other deals I made along with yours. And as you recall I was out of town for work when I made the deal with you, I didn't know I was traveling the following week, and again the week after that.

 

Not trying to turn things around despite what you may think. I've acknowledge here that I may be wrong. I publicly stated as much and I'm willing to apologize. I am wise enough to know that I don't know everything and what I do know is very little.

 

You should try to maintain a little bit of that moving forward. You may not always be 100 percent right, you keep thinking that way frustration will not end with my transaction. At some point you have to acknowledge that I may be telling the truth and I just am unhappy with a book with tape. However I see that my process along the way has clouded that thought process and I take full responsibility.

 

 

[comix4fun]

My -- jsilverjanet didn't act in a stellar manner throughout, but IMO the tape should have been disclosed, even if the book falls within the grade range either way. I'd be disappointed to open the cover and find it in there.

 

I do understand why the seller is reluctant to pursue the transaction any further with the buyer, but perhaps at least a token effort should be made to see if there's a way to satisfy them.

 

(BTW -- what is up with the bottom staple area pictured?)

 

 

 

I think the speed the buyer acted in, in taking the books without scans, and then having buyers remorse, is making that tape seem like a much bigger deal than it would have been if, for example, the market for these spiked another 50% in the last 2 weeks.

[Ryan.]

My -- jsilverjanet didn't act in a stellar manner throughout, but IMO the tape should have been disclosed, even if the book falls within the grade range either way. I'd be disappointed to open the cover and find it in there.

 

I do understand why the seller is reluctant to pursue the transaction any further with the buyer, but perhaps at least a token effort should be made to see if there's a way to satisfy them.

 

(BTW -- what is up with the bottom staple area pictured?)

 

 

 

I think the speed the buyer acted in, in taking the books without scans, and then having buyers remorse, is making that tape seem like a much bigger deal than it would have been if, for example, the market for these spiked another 50% in the last 2 weeks.

 

We wouldn't be talking about this tape if the hype kept inflating.

[jsilverjanet]

My -- jsilverjanet didn't act in a stellar manner throughout, but IMO the tape should have been disclosed, even if the book falls within the grade range either way. I'd be disappointed to open the cover and find it in there.

 

I do understand why the seller is reluctant to pursue the transaction any further with the buyer, but perhaps at least a token effort should be made to see if there's a way to satisfy them.

 

(BTW -- what is up with the bottom staple area pictured?)

 

 

that's a tear on the cover by the bottom staple, cover is attached

[skypinkblu]

You sell a book, don't disclose the tape, buyer is unhappy, you take it back for a full refund.

 

End of story.

 

 

Buyer commits to a book sight unseen willingly, tape is consistent with the grade (and extremely small), buyer never mentions that his :take it: is contingent on personal tape pet peeve, you turn down 4 other buyers because buyer took them sight unseen, you also sell buyer a book under-graded by 1/2 to full point grade in the same deal....do you still take it back even though it fits the grade, buyer willingly took it without contingency, and is getting the better end of the grading on the other book?

 

 

Given the recent controversy about tape, I don't think this is a minor problem any longer...and this is coming from someone who willing purchased (and still loves) books with minor amounts of tape. But I bought them, knowing there was tape and probably at a lower price point.

Edited August 14, 2013 by skypinkblu

[Point Five]

My -- jsilverjanet didn't act in a stellar manner throughout, but IMO the tape should have been disclosed, even if the book falls within the grade range either way. I'd be disappointed to open the cover and find it in there.

 

I do understand why the seller is reluctant to pursue the transaction any further with the buyer, but perhaps at least a token effort should be made to see if there's a way to satisfy them.

 

(BTW -- what is up with the bottom staple area pictured?)

 

 

 

I think the speed the buyer acted in, in taking the books without scans, and then having buyers remorse, is making that tape seem like a much bigger deal than it would have been if, for example, the market for these spiked another 50% in the last 2 weeks.

 

We wouldn't be talking about this tape if the hype kept inflating.

Fair points.

If I were the seller, I'd nevertheless honor the return and chalk it up to 'my bad, next time I'll be sure to catch & mention any tape', but the ball is in Gambit's court.

 

Also agree that selling and buying with scans is unwise on the part of both parties, and substantially increases the risk of problems.

 

 

[comix4fun]

You sell a book, don't disclose the tape, buyer is unhappy, you take it back for a full refund.

 

End of story.

 

 

Buyer commits to a book sight unseen willingly, tape is consistent with the grade (and extremely small), buyer never mentions that his :take it: is contingent on personal tape pet peeve, you turn down 4 other buyers because buyer took them sight unseen, you also sell buyer a book under-graded by 1/2 to full point grade in the same deal....do you still take it back even though it fits the grade, buyer willingly took it without contingency, and is getting the better end of the grading on the other book?

 

 

Given the recent controversy about tape, I don't think this is a minor problem any longer...and this is coming from someone who willing purchased (and still loves) books with minor amounts of tape. But I bought them, knowing there was tape and probably at a lower price point.

 

 

I've read what CGC wrote and their stance on tape, and they are now grading the book as if the tape wasn't there. If the tape INCREASED the grade by reattaching a cover (for example) they would grade the book as if the tape wasn't there thus reducing the grade.

 

If this tape was there or not there it doesn't do anything to this book. That's a less than 1/2 inch back cover tear on a book in the vg range.