Fellow Copper Age collectors, is MIRACLEMAN a good investment?

[Mr 9.8]

For the past two years I have been collecting cgc 9.8 (and hording many HIGH QUALTIY copies ) of Miracleman. But with the recent news of Marvel publishing reprints and new stories of Miarc,(I mean MARVELman ) How will this effect the value of Miracleman back issue's? Will prices come down, or will they go up? Is this even a good title to invest in the long term? Thanks.

[chrisco37]

Here are my thoughts on the title....

 

It has always been my contention that reprinting the series would actually be good for back issues. It would introduce a whole new generation to the story/mythos.

 

As it is right now, if you wanted to read the story (apart from online bootleg), you have 2 options:

 

1. Buy the series in back issue format. And, for sake of arguement, lets say you're looking for decent copies (VF and up); you can probably get the Moore books (up to Olympus) on the cheap, $5-10 per issue. Once you get to Olympus, you're looking at $15-20 per issue for 11-14 and 16, and another $50-100 for 15. The Gaiman books 17-22 will run you $10/ea and 23 & 24 $25-30/ea. Pretty expensive to read a story.

 

2. Buy the trades. These will get you thru the Moore run....at $100 a pop minimum. Then you've still got the Gaiman books to buy.

 

So, with the two current scenarios, you knock out a good portion of folks just due to cost.

 

 

If the series were reprinted at say $19.95/arc, you could read the entire run for about $100. More people would read it and, hopefully, want to collect it. The prices would either increase or, at least, maintain current value.

 

There's a school of thought that says reprinting it would bring back issue values down as the material is readily available on the cheap. I disagree. I really got into the series when a buddy of mine loaned me his set to read. Once I read it, I had to have the issues. I'm not a "hoarder", but I've owned 2 full runs of the Moore books since I read it (sold one of the runs a few years back).

 

 

Now, back to reality.....as exciting as the SDCC announcement was, I'm not sure how this will pan out. As I understand it, Marvel got the rights to the Mik Anglo stuff, not the Moore stuff (still tied up with McSpidey). Mik Anglo's MM was basically a second-rate Captain Marvel (who was, himself, a second-rate Supes). While Moore may have based "his" MM on that character, they're not the same. Unitl Marvel secures the McSpidey rights (if they ever do), all Marvel has is an expensive name with no substance.

 

I may get crushed for saying this, but, it's similar to Swamp Thing. Collectors are all enamored with Bernie Wrightson's Swamp Thing. That character was nothing before Moore got ahold of it. Swamp Thing is popular because of what Alan Moore did with the character, not because of what came before. Same thing with MM. MM is great because of Moore. If Marvel doesn't secure those rights, this whole MM thing is a giant bust for them. What will they do if they don't get those rights? Reprint the Anglo stuff, I suppose. Not really going to make back the money they dropped to get the rights in the first place. And thouse books won't do anything, good or bad, to "Miracleman".

 

Kinda went off topic there....so, back to original question, I think Moore's MM is a very solid title/investment. I don't think that Marvel's acquisition of the rights will hurt the title (either way). It could only help.

 

But, if you're looking for the book to skyrocket, I wouldn't hold my breath. Increased interest? I think so. And the market would reflect that. Guide values doubling? Probably not.

 

 

[mschmidt]

I may get crushed for saying this, but, it's similar to Swamp Thing. Collectors are all enamored with Bernie Wrightson's Swamp Thing. That character was nothing before Moore got ahold of it. Swamp Thing is popular because of what Alan Moore did with the character, not because of what came before. Same thing with MM. MM is great because of Moore. If Marvel doesn't secure those rights, this whole MM thing is a giant bust for them. What will they do if they don't get those rights? Reprint the Anglo stuff, I suppose. Not really going to make back the money they dropped to get the rights in the first place. And thouse books won't do anything, good or bad, to "Miracleman".

 

Well put - I totally agree.

 

S.M: It's always good to meet another Miracleman fan, and you've certainly shown your enthusiasm for the series, but how about "re-using" one of your old Miracleman threads and not create a new one every single time you have a MM question? You've only been on the boards for a couple of months, and have still managed to start up 10-15 different MM/Alan Moore threads (you did 4 different MM threads just last week) ... it's getting to be kinda spammy ...

[abracadabra]

It depends on your definition of "good investment". If you want to see a healthy return, then probably not. There are definitely better investments. But if you want to have fun putting your money into something you obviously love, then there could be a lot worse. Prices always fluctuate from issue to issue and time to time, but on average, Miracleman prices are close to what they were 5 years ago. That's a better investment then most stocks have been. And as far as money goes, a much better investment then spending it on beer, dvd rentals, strippers, drugs, etc... (unless you are actually in those businesses).

 

You are probably not going to get rich collecting Miracleman comics, but at least you are passionate about them and you won't go broke!

 

Take care,

William

[Mr 9.8]

I may get crushed for saying this, but, it's similar to Swamp Thing. Collectors are all enamored with Bernie Wrightson's Swamp Thing. That character was nothing before Moore got ahold of it. Swamp Thing is popular because of what Alan Moore did with the character, not because of what came before. Same thing with MM. MM is great because of Moore. If Marvel doesn't secure those rights, this whole MM thing is a giant bust for them. What will they do if they don't get those rights? Reprint the Anglo stuff, I suppose. Not really going to make back the money they dropped to get the rights in the first place. And thouse books won't do anything, good or bad, to "Miracleman".

 

Well put - I totally agree.

 

S.M: It's always good to meet another Miracleman fan, and you've certainly shown your enthusiasm for the series, but how about "re-using" one of your old Miracleman threads and not create a new one every single time you have a MM question? You've only been on the boards for a couple of months, and have still managed to start up 10-15 different MM/Alan Moore threads (you did 4 different MM threads just last week) ... it's getting to be kinda spammy ...

Good point!

[EwanUK]

I never view any comics as a good investment other than those I buy which I know I can sell for MORE immediately - this is actually the way I fund my comics collecting.

 

Have I made money on Miracleman? Yes and No.

 

Yes, because I've sold the following over the years....

 

1-24 run in NM fo £220 (bought in a huge collection costing £200 - made about £500 profit overall). This was 2005, I reckon it would've sold for £400 now.

 

A 1-16 low grade VG run for £95 recently. This had 50 watchers!

 

My first CGC run 1-24 went for £1,400 (bought for about £1,000 in 2007)

 

Various no.15s that I've found have gone for £50

 

All 3 TPBs for about £200 - which I bought for £30 off an ebay BIN!

 

No, because I've spent over £3,000 on my existing no.2 registry set. CGC copies have subsequently dropped hugely in value... apart from no.23 and no.24.

 

Still, it's all good fun and I do think once the new stuff comes out all kinds of MM stuff even the Miller Marvelman's will get a kick in value.

 

 

BTW, I offered £600 for the only known 2D and was turned down... again... The owner (a very nice chap) now clearly knows the full rarity and value! (He has a phenonemal MM original art collection - plus virtually all the Marvelman issues).

 

Chris, can you recall, was the MSU copy of 2D signed by Cat Yronwode?

[chrisco37]

Chris, can you recall, was the MSU copy of 2D signed by Cat Yronwode?

 

I don't remember. My emails to Cat regarding the book went unanswered, and I can't recall all the details in my emails with Beau Smith.

 

However, I did (just this weekend) come across the xerox copies that MSU sent to me. I hadn't read this thread at that point. Now that I know where that stuff is, I'll check it out tonight to see if there are any sigs, or if I kept copies of the emails to Beau. I think my emails to MSU are there too.

[Zonker]

I may get crushed for saying this, but, it's similar to Swamp Thing. Collectors are all enamored with Bernie Wrightson's Swamp Thing. That character was nothing before Moore got ahold of it. Swamp Thing is popular because of what Alan Moore did with the character, not because of what came before.

 

 

That's overstating it just a bit... sure, Swamp Thing's popularity over the last 30 years has been driven by the Alan Moore treatment, but the Wrightson issues were extremely well-regarded even prior to Moore's arrival. It was only the post Swamp Thing #10 issues that were "nothing."

 

Without Moore, I believe Swamp Thing would have been one of those "if only" comic series, as in "if only Kaluta had stayed on the Shadow..." "if only Kirby had been allowed to finish his New Gods series"... "if only Wrightson hadn't left Swamp Thing after 10 issues..."

[RockMyAmadeus]

"Is Miracleman a good investment?"

 

No.

[Mr 9.8]

"Is Miracleman a good investment?"

 

No.

That's what I like about you, BLUNT & to the POINT!

[chrisco37]

OK...I checked it out last night.

 

Unfortunately, I did not save any of my MSU or Beau Smith emails.

 

The xerox copies of the MM3D-2D that MSU sent me do not have any sigs on them at all. Now, they only sent me copies of the cover, the interior cover/indicia, and the first 2 pages of the book.

 

No sigs anywhere. It looks exactly the same as as the regualr 3D version, just the panel pages do not have the 3D effect.

 

The interior cover is exactly the same as the 3D version, even the indicia (as noted in OS). It even has the house ad for the 2D version.

[50 Cent #II (1st)]

I wouldn't be surprised if it slowly rose in value with the rights to it now situated, with all the successful movie adaptations of comic books, this could be the next big one? (Think R rated movie, what Watchmen could have been?)

[RockMyAmadeus]

OK...I checked it out last night.

 

Unfortunately, I did not save any of my MSU or Beau Smith emails.

 

The xerox copies of the MM3D-2D that MSU sent me do not have any sigs on them at all. Now, they only sent me copies of the cover, the interior cover/indicia, and the first 2 pages of the book.

 

No sigs anywhere. It looks exactly the same as as the regualr 3D version, just the panel pages do not have the 3D effect.

 

The interior cover is exactly the same as the 3D version, even the indicia (as noted in OS). It even has the house ad for the 2D version.

 

For reference, my Laser Eraser & Pressbutton 2D-3D IS signed and numbered by cat.

[EwanUK]

OK...I checked it out last night.

 

Unfortunately, I did not save any of my MSU or Beau Smith emails.

 

The xerox copies of the MM3D-2D that MSU sent me do not have any sigs on them at all. Now, they only sent me copies of the cover, the interior cover/indicia, and the first 2 pages of the book.

 

No sigs anywhere. It looks exactly the same as as the regualr 3D version, just the panel pages do not have the 3D effect.

 

The interior cover is exactly the same as the 3D version, even the indicia (as noted in OS). It even has the house ad for the 2D version.

 

For reference, my Laser Eraser & Pressbutton 2D-3D IS signed and numbered by cat.

 

Exactly - and the copy held in the UK also is also signed & numbered by Yronwode. One ad page is different too.

 

There are therefore quite likely to be 2 kinds of the 2D. A mail-away signed version and a vanilla 2D version.

 

I wonder if Al Stoltz's copy is signed?

[Mr 9.8]

I wouldn't be surprised if it slowly rose in value with the rights to it now situated, with all the successful movie adaptations of comic books, this could be the next big one? (Think R rated movie, what Watchmen could have been?)

It's a MARVEL comics product now. Awhile back marvel said they would no longer produce R rated movies (I think Punisher : War Zone , was the straw that snapped the cammels back)

[chrisco37]

OK...I checked it out last night.

 

Unfortunately, I did not save any of my MSU or Beau Smith emails.

 

The xerox copies of the MM3D-2D that MSU sent me do not have any sigs on them at all. Now, they only sent me copies of the cover, the interior cover/indicia, and the first 2 pages of the book.

 

No sigs anywhere. It looks exactly the same as as the regualr 3D version, just the panel pages do not have the 3D effect.

 

The interior cover is exactly the same as the 3D version, even the indicia (as noted in OS). It even has the house ad for the 2D version.

 

For reference, my Laser Eraser & Pressbutton 2D-3D IS signed and numbered by cat.

 

Exactly - and the copy held in the UK also is also signed & numbered by Yronwode. One ad page is different too.

 

There are therefore quite likely to be 2 kinds of the 2D. A mail-away signed version and a vanilla 2D version.

 

I wonder if Al Stoltz's copy is signed?

 

Where is the sig on the issue? Is it on the inside cover or first page? As I said, the copies that MSU sent were only a few, and not the entire issue.

 

I'll try and get scans of what I have and get them posted here.

 

RMA - can we see scans of your copy?

[RockMyAmadeus]

OK...I checked it out last night.

 

Unfortunately, I did not save any of my MSU or Beau Smith emails.

 

The xerox copies of the MM3D-2D that MSU sent me do not have any sigs on them at all. Now, they only sent me copies of the cover, the interior cover/indicia, and the first 2 pages of the book.

 

No sigs anywhere. It looks exactly the same as as the regualr 3D version, just the panel pages do not have the 3D effect.

 

The interior cover is exactly the same as the 3D version, even the indicia (as noted in OS). It even has the house ad for the 2D version.

 

For reference, my Laser Eraser & Pressbutton 2D-3D IS signed and numbered by cat.

 

Exactly - and the copy held in the UK also is also signed & numbered by Yronwode. One ad page is different too.

 

There are therefore quite likely to be 2 kinds of the 2D. A mail-away signed version and a vanilla 2D version.

 

I wonder if Al Stoltz's copy is signed?

 

Where is the sig on the issue? Is it on the inside cover or first page? As I said, the copies that MSU sent were only a few, and not the entire issue.

 

I'll try and get scans of what I have and get them posted here.

 

RMA - can we see scans of your copy?

 

Absolutely, as soon as I find it again. It's currently lost in a box somewhere.

[RockMyAmadeus]

My LE&P sig is on the inside front cover, at the bottom, below the indicia.

[DarkKnightReturns]

"Is Miracleman a good investment?"

 

No.

 

I second that. Outside of core collectors no one knows who he is or gives a poop.

[RockMyAmadeus]

The reason I say no is because MM is, with no exception, already the most valuable SERIES in all of Copper Age.

 

Yes, Turtles has #1 and Albedo has #2...but MM has multiple big money keys, and the trades? Forget it!

 

The books have already achieved their potential as breakout hits, and very, very few people are going to be able to find these for "cover price"...to obtain just a reading set of these 24 books, you'd have to pay a minimum of $200. Name any other series post Bronze where you'd have to do that? And that's just reading copies. Forget high grade.

 

So, as icons of the Copper Age that were ignored for nearly a decade and a half? Totally.

 

As investment vehicles? Stick to lower high grade Silver and Gold.

 

(thumbs u