Sale of the Year - New Mutants #98 CGC 9.9 for $12,250 5 5

[DrWatson]

When you put a $10,000 1 carat diamond against a $500 1 carat diamond, you can SEE a substantial difference, in clarity, in color, in (lack of) flaws...it's fairly obvious.

 

But if you were to crack this book out and lay it side by side with 10 also-cracked strong 9.8s, who would be able to find the 9.9? Where's the $12,000 difference in quality?

 

And here's the pièce de résistance...that book could go back through CGC and easily get a 9.8...or it could get a 10.

 

So what has the buyer bought? What value for his money has he obtained?

 

And please don't say "yeah, well, he could go spend $10,000,000 on a Honda Civic, so there!"...he COULD...and I doubt the lot owner would turn him down...but he wouldn't have to. Same example here. Prior to CGC, this never would have happened. If CGC didn't exist, this never would have happened. It is only because of what the label says....and not any actual, quantifiable difference in quality of the item inside the case....that garnered the difference.

 

And should we really be encouraging the idea that it's the label that is important, and not the book inside....?

 

I'm going to feel dirty in the morning, but...

 

 

 

Oh, but it's SUCH a delicious kind of dirty.....

 

 

No it's not.

 

It's a 'waking up with Rammstein playing in your head, your wallet empty and a lady-boy lying next to you' kind of dirty.

Mein Gott, now that's dirty.

[Sal]

seriously. i mean, Rammstein?

 

at least it's not Gabber

[short_box-migration]

Peds need to be purchased straight off the newsstand so if he's buying books from other people it'll never be a Ped.

 

Ha...learned something new. That makes the whole ped thing more interesting and impressive.

 

It would not get a pedigree designation because the person did not buy them off the stands. It could get a "From the Collection of ___________________" designation, though.

 

 

That would work as well, so instead of being a ped he gets recognized for this amazing collection and all the books get a bump because of the way he collected over a period of time. what kind of numbers are we talking about? How many 9.9's make an amazing collection?

 

Oh and a side note did the seller get his check yet?

 

Danny

"From the Collection of ___________________" designations are not given. They are paid for.

 

That's pathetic.

 

That's CGC.

[Guardian Comics]

 

Because it's an important discussion worth hashing out, regardless of where one stands. The particular details of this sale serve merely as the springboard for a much more important discussion. We could be discussing the Spidey #5, it's the same topic.

 

That's why.

 

He feels it's important; who is anyone else to try and peer pressure him into silence?

 

But you are not having a discussion. You're arguing the same points over and over, which is changing neithers mind and has resulted in a tired, circlejerk.

 

If no one is listening then dialogue is useless.

 

Jim

 

 

[bostoncorbett]

I have a few questions for our board appointed economics professors (I play one at the local University in real life, by the way). What is the comic worth if...

 

1. There was at least one other person willing to pay $12,350 on the eve of the auction? ANSWER: $12,350 (to that other person, at least on that particular day). That's not including the other bidders who dropped out before reaching this number. And, interestingly, the buyer (me) already had offers from colleagues who collect high grade books for a significant "return" on my "investment." Go figure.

 

2. What is it worth to people who find ZERO intrinsic value in this particular issue in this particular grade? ANSWER: $0 Thus, I will likely not attempt to sell any of my high grade comics to members of this board. For instance, G.I. Joe issue #21, even if a 9.9 pops up, is still worth crapola, and I will never ever own a copy. Why? It has absolutley ZERO intrinsic value for me (and G.I. Joe really really does suck donkey ballz).

 

3. In the comic book industry, can someone please intelligently explain the theory of "Exponential Value Theory"? HINT: The difference in value between .5 and 1.5 is less than 1.5 and 1.8... The difference in value between a 9.6 and a 9.4 is greater than a 9.4 and a 9.2. For an example, just look at the price of Tales of Suspense #39 in 9.0 and 9.2... and then look at the prices between 9.2 and 9.4. Other examples...

 

EXAMPLE A: Luke Cage: Hero for Hire CGC 7.0 sells for $69. There is no significant increase in value until you hit the 9.4 range when it's worth a few hundred bucks. However, Luke Cage: Hero for Hire CGC 9.6 sells for $3,000. And the single 9.8? Well, it sells for whatever ungodly amount of money the winner can afford to grab the book when (if) it ever comes up for sale (I won't be selling it any time soon).

 

EXAMPLE B: Everyone on the board seems to be aware of Incredible Hulk #181. A CGC 9.4 sells for $3,000, a 9.6 sells for $5,000, a 9.8 for $15,000 ($25,000 on a good good day), and a 9.9, again, for whatever ungodly amount of money the winner can afford to grab the book for when (if) it ever comes up for sale.

 

EXAMPLE C: NEW MUTANTS 87 in 9.8 sells for $125 to $150. 9.9 Sold for $3,500 (i.e., an ungodly amount of money that the winner happened to be able to afford when he stumbled across the auction).

 

EXAMPLE D: Iron First #14 sells for $500 in 9.4, $800 in 9.6, and $2500 in 9.8 (I was lucky and snagged a copy at $2,100 -- am I lucky for getting it on the cheap, $400 below FMV, or stupid for not donating the money to poor starving children in Africa? It would pay for 200+ manual laborers in Kenya, by the way). If a 9.9 ever pops up, Good Lord, you'd better be Pablo Escobar to have a prayer of owning the book -- you need to be rich and willing to kill to get it.

 

EXAMPLE E: New Mutants 98. 9.6 sells for the same price as your garden variety "Charmin," 9.8 sells for $200 to $250, and 9.9? Yes, whatever ungodly amount of money, blah, blah, blah.

 

THIS is the lesson that should be discussed. Comics are worth more (significantly more) as their condition increases. How much a book increases in value depends on: individual taste x popularity/demand for a particular issue x scarcity of the issue x popularity of the character x key "event" in an issue x CGC grade (PGX and other company's -- because of their lack of discipline -- doesn't count, unfortunately) x scarcity of CGC grade x luck (knowing of the auction, being in the country to bid for the auction, when other people are NOT aware of the auction, etc.) x [insert whatever variable I'm missing here, please]. Good luck figuring the math out. Please email me when you have.

 

The idea of "pressing," getting screwed, spending too much, etc. is irrelevant. The "possibilities" of how/why this book is no different from 9.8s is moot. Indeed, outside of the case, it's worthless and I would be a complete fool for cracking it open. For starters, I'd instantly be out $12,500. But, thankfully it's still in the case and graded by CGC. CGC, while not perfect, is perfectly objective. At some point, on some day, three CGC employees agreed this book deserves a 9.9 and they assiged this particular book the grade 9.9, and they did not give this grade to any of the previous 9.8s. Yes, the "label" makes the value and not the book itself. Why? Because it's not me, Moose, Tommy Boy, Ricky, The Sperminator, or any other "board" member assigning the grade after we've "pressed" the out of the book. It's CGC, the industry bible. Is the grade a mistake? Maybe. Fluke? Perhaps. Will other high grade books "come forward?" Probably. But even with others -- or even a perfect 10 -- the odds of landing this issue, in this objectively graded condition by industry experts who are presently recognized as "The Authority" on comic book condition, is astronomically remote. The only difference would be that now someone else would have another extremely rare -- and valuable -- high grade comic.

 

The lessons for the high grade collector? 1) Exponential Value Theory means that the price of the "one grade below" has NOTHING to do with the price of the book "one grade above." 2) Valuing a comic is a complicated process that consists of many many variables and you'd better be aware of them before you buy (or sell). 3) ANYONE spending more than cover price on a comic is spending more money than the average Kenyan earns in a day. And 4) if you find a super high grade "popular" book with few others listed on the CGC census, act immediately, or lose the book (and be prepared to give your left nut for the book you want -- I, by the way, am now sans ballz).

 

Thus endeth the lesson.

 

FYI... Pedigree cashed the check today.

[FlyingDonut]

No it's not.

 

It's a 'waking up with Rammstein playing in your head, your wallet empty and a lady-boy lying next to you' kind of dirty.

 

Can't resist, sorry....this video is 100% made of awesome win.

 

[Nexus]

I have a few questions for our board appointed economics professors (I play one at the local University in real life, by the way). What is the comic worth if...

 

You've just become every high-grade comic dealer's best friend. That post will be the opening page of many a dealer website.

 

I traded my slabs in years ago for art, but had to come back here to check out what all the fuss was about. Wow.

 

Anyhow, welcome to the boards, look forward to more posts. (thumbs u

[FlyingDonut]

I have a few questions for our board appointed economics professors (I play one at the local University in real life, by the way). What is the comic worth if...

 

1. There was at least one other person willing to pay $12,350 on the eve of the auction? ANSWER: $12,350 (to that other person, at least on that particular day). That's not including the other bidders who dropped out before reaching this number. And, interestingly, the buyer (me) already had offers from colleagues who collect high grade books for a significant "return" on my "investment." Go figure.

 

2. What is it worth to people who find ZERO intrinsic value in this particular issue in this particular grade? ANSWER: $0 Thus, I will likely not attempt to sell any of my high grade comics to members of this board. For instance, G.I. Joe issue #21, even if a 9.9 pops up, is still worth crapola, and I will never ever own a copy. Why? It has absolutley ZERO intrinsic value for me (and G.I. Joe really really does suck donkey ballz).

 

3. In the comic book industry, can someone please intelligently explain the theory of "Exponential Value Theory"? HINT: The difference in value between .5 and 1.5 is less than 1.5 and 1.8... The difference in value between a 9.6 and a 9.4 is greater than a 9.4 and a 9.2. For an example, just look at the price of Tales of Suspense #39 in 9.0 and 9.2... and then look at the prices between 9.2 and 9.4. Other examples...

 

EXAMPLE A: Luke Cage: Hero for Hire CGC 7.0 sells for $69. There is no significant increase in value until you hit the 9.4 range when it's worth a few hundred bucks. However, Luke Cage: Hero for Hire CGC 9.6 sells for $3,000. And the single 9.8? Well, it sells for whatever ungodly amount of money the winner can afford to grab the book when (if) it ever comes up for sale (I won't be selling it any time soon).

 

EXAMPLE B: Everyone on the board seems to be aware of Incredible Hulk #181. A CGC 9.4 sells for $3,000, a 9.6 sells for $5,000, a 9.8 for $15,000 ($25,000 on a good good day), and a 9.9, again, for whatever ungodly amount of money the winner can afford to grab the book for when (if) it ever comes up for sale.

 

EXAMPLE C: NEW MUTANTS 87 in 9.8 sells for $125 to $150. 9.9 Sold for $3,500 (i.e., an ungodly amount of money that the winner happened to be able to afford when he stumbled across the auction).

 

EXAMPLE D: Iron First #14 sells for $500 in 9.4, $800 in 9.6, and $2500 in 9.8 (I was lucky and snagged a copy at $2,100 -- am I lucky for getting it on the cheap, $400 below FMV, or stupid for not donating the money to poor starving children in Africa? It would pay for 200+ manual laborers in Kenya, by the way). If a 9.9 ever pops up, Good Lord, you'd better be Pablo Escobar to have a prayer of owning the book -- you need to be rich and willing to kill to get it.

 

EXAMPLE E: New Mutants 98. 9.6 sells for the same price as your garden variety "Charmin," 9.8 sells for $200 to $250, and 9.9? Yes, whatever ungodly amount of money, blah, blah, blah.

 

THIS is the lesson that should be discussed. Comics are worth more (significantly more) as their condition increases. How much a book increases in value depends on: individual taste x popularity/demand for a particular issue x scarcity of the issue x popularity of the character x key "event" in an issue x CGC grade (PGX and other company's -- because of their lack of discipline -- doesn't count, unfortunately) x scarcity of CGC grade x luck (knowing of the auction, being in the country to bid for the auction, when other people are NOT aware of the auction, etc.) x [insert whatever variable I'm missing here, please]. Good luck figuring the math out. Please email me when you have.

 

The idea of "pressing," getting screwed, spending too much, etc. is irrelevant. The "possibilities" of how/why this book is no different from 9.8s is moot. Indeed, outside of the case, it's worthless and I would be a complete fool for cracking it open. For starters, I'd instantly be out $12,500. But, thankfully it's still in the case and graded by CGC. CGC, while not perfect, is perfectly objective. At some point, on some day, three CGC employees agreed this book deserves a 9.9 and they assiged this particular book the grade 9.9, and they did not give this grade to any of the previous 9.8s. Yes, the "label" makes the value and not the book itself. Why? Because it's not me, Moose, Tommy Boy, Ricky, The Sperminator, or any other "board" member assigning the grade after we've "pressed" the out of the book. It's CGC, the industry bible. Is the grade a mistake? Maybe. Fluke? Perhaps. Will other high grade books "come forward?" Probably. But even with others -- or even a perfect 10 -- the odds of landing this issue, in this objectively graded condition by industry experts who are presently recognized as "The Authority" on comic book condition, is astronomically remote. The only difference would be that now someone else would have another extremely rare -- and valuable -- high grade comic.

 

The lessons for the high grade collector? 1) Exponential Value Theory means that the price of the "one grade below" has NOTHING to do with the price of the book "one grade above." 2) Valuing a comic is a complicated process that consists of many many variables and you'd better be aware of them before you buy (or sell). 3) ANYONE spending more than cover price on a comic is spending more money than the average Kenyan earns in a day. And 4) if you find a super high grade "popular" book with few others listed on the CGC census, act immediately, or lose the book (and be prepared to give your left nut for the book you want -- I, by the way, am now sans ballz).

 

Thus endeth the lesson.

 

FYI... Pedigree cashed the check today.

 

Now that, my droogies, is a

[Sal]

i'm thinking fifty pages for this one. of course, that's with my settings, which are 50 posts per page

[FlyingDonut]

i'm thinking fifty pages for this one. of course, that's with my settings, which are 50 posts per page

 

What, just on the rant? 2500 posts is way low.

[MrBedrock]

Thus endeth the lesson.

 

Welcome to the boards.

You are instantly my new favorite poster. (thumbs u

[Sal]

i'm thinking fifty pages for this one. of course, that's with my settings, which are 50 posts per page

 

What, just on the rant? 2500 posts is way low.

 

 

i see what you did there.

[delekkerste]

It's a perfectly rational explanation, but, unfortunately it is still rendered completely meaningless by the fact that OMFG, DUDE, YOU PAID $12,250 FOR A FREAKIN' NEW MUTANTS #98.

 

I mean, I get your faith in CGC and your exponential valuation explanation, but this is still New Mutants #98 we're talking about and paying $12,250 for it is just , no matter what the # is on the label, how many copies of that grade are in the Census and/or how wealthy someone is. If multiple people are willing to pay at/near that price, far from justifying it, it just means you're all just totally bonkers. People can make any argument they like ("what I collect..." is my favorite bit of relativistic nonsense (thumbs u ), but this is just prima facie nuts and anyone who's honest with themself knows it.

 

And just who are these "colleagues" of yours who have offered you a "significant" return on your "investment" already? People are queuing up to pay you, what, $15K+ for this book before it's even in your hands? If that's true, please forward me their names and contact info because I have a giant Ponzi scheme great investment opportunity to sell them.

 

You say you are an economics professor who is now "sans ballz" having shot your wad, so to speak, on this book? Are you telling us that you are not the second coming of Roman Abramovich who can light his cigars with $12,250 checks?? If so, you are clinically insane braver than I thought.

[bostoncorbett]

My name is not Roman Abramovich. It's Gordon Gekko. My colleagues are Owen Morrisey, Dennis Levine, Ivan Boesky, Carl Icahn, Asher Edelman, and Michael Ovitz. Love your posts! -- Brian (AKA Boston Corbett)

[RockMyAmadeus]

 

Because it's an important discussion worth hashing out, regardless of where one stands. The particular details of this sale serve merely as the springboard for a much more important discussion. We could be discussing the Spidey #5, it's the same topic.

 

That's why.

 

He feels it's important; who is anyone else to try and peer pressure him into silence?

 

But you are not having a discussion. You're arguing the same points over and over, which is changing neithers mind and has resulted in a tired, circlejerk.

 

If no one is listening then dialogue is useless.

 

Jim

 

 

 

We are, in fact, having a very serious discussion. You think people haven't argued "the same points over and over again" throughout history?

 

That's your opinion, and while you're certainly free to have it, no one is putting a gun to your head and forcing you to read this "tired, circlejerk." It should also be clear that I do not share your opinion, and I imagine neither does Roy.

 

I agree with you...if no one is listening, then dialogue is useless. But you have no clue...and neither do I, and neither does anyone...who is and who is not "listening" to the conversation, and who may gain something from it.

 

What is a "circlejerk" to you may be very productive to others.

 

 

[delekkerste]

My name is not Roman Abramovich. It's Gordon Gekko. My colleagues are Owen Morrisey, Dennis Levine, Ivan Boesky, Carl Icahn, Asher Edelman, and Michael Ovitz. Love your posts! -- Brian (AKA Boston Corbett)

 

 

I'm sure if we met each other in person, we'd get along great. And I'd still tell you that you're crazy to your face. (thumbs u

 

Just so we're clear, I'm all for people doing/buying whatever makes them happy as long as they are being fiscally, ethically, legally and morally responsible about it. I've certainly made some crazy purchases in the past when it comes to comics myself, and if someone wants to give me stick on the Boards for having done so, that just goes with the territory.

 

By the way, this is well on its way to being the greatest thread ever and would make a great Mastercard commercial:

 

The first New Mutants #98 CGC 9.9: $12,250.

 

10 sessions with a psychiatrist: $3,500

The notoriety gained from making the most ridiculous comic purchase ever: Priceless

[RockMyAmadeus]

Thus endeth the lesson.

 

Welcome to the boards.

You are instantly my new favorite poster. (thumbs u

 

You have terribly low standards....

 

[MrBedrock]

Thus endeth the lesson.

 

Welcome to the boards.

You are instantly my new favorite poster. (thumbs u

 

You have terribly low standards....

 

I've just never been one to think that my opinion of how someone else spends their money matters one bit.

And for him to come on here and say, "Yeah, I bought it. I like it. Screw all of you."

...well, frankly that is priceless!

[greggy]

Thus endeth the lesson.

 

Welcome to the boards.

You are instantly my new favorite poster. (thumbs u

 

You have terribly low standards....

 

I've just never been one to think that my opinion of how someone else spends their money matters one bit.

And for him to come on here and say, "Yeah, I bought it. I like it. Screw all of you."

...well, frankly that is priceless!

RICHARD

[MrBedrock]

RICHARD

My Man GREG