Condensation on the interior of a CGC case.

[comicwiz]

I almost didn't want to post this because I am really bummed out about it, but I had some $1400 in comics destroyed this weekend, which included high grade copies of ASM 129 and HFH 1.

 

The barex inner well melted right onto the covers.

 

Granted, we experienced a heat wave, and they were exposed for several hours as I was working an annual outdoor market, and I have to say that I am obviously disappointed, but also surprised that the barex would not be heat stable enough to withstand from melting. I had books in mylar in the exact same spot for two entire days and they weren't damaged.

 

A few of the books which didn't happen to get cooked had a little bit of warping to them at the top outer edge. I imagine that this would be no different for books sitting at a sorting facility, in a truck, and exposed to extreme heat during the hot summer months.

[CKB]

I almost didn't want to post this because I am really bummed out about it, but I had some $1400 in comics destroyed this weekend, which included high grade copies of ASM 129 and HFH 1.

 

The barex inner well melted right onto the covers.

 

Granted, we experienced a heat wave, and they were exposed for several hours as I was working an annual outdoor market, and I have to say that I am obviously disappointed, but also surprised that the barex would not be heat stable enough to withstand from melting. I had books in mylar in the exact same spot for two entire days and they weren't damaged.

 

A few of the books which didn't happen to get cooked had a little bit of warping to them at the top outer edge. I imagine that this would be no different for books sitting at a sorting facility, in a truck, and exposed to extreme heat during the hot summer months.

 

Are you serious? Were they in direct sunlight under a reflector or something?

[comicwiz]

Not all the books that were effected were in direct sunlight. That was the craziest part of the whole situation. I could understand the HFH because it was a black cover, but the ASM 129 wasn't in direct sunlight. I would say they were in the spot for 3-4 hours. When I noticed them, I pulled all the books aside and looked them over, and half of them were fine, but the other half weren't. When I got home later that evening, I cracked out the ASM 129 and it along with all the effected books look like bad lamination jobs. While this is bad in and of itself, the way the barex melted reminded me of the bubbling you see on a bad tint job on a car window. I also noticed that all the top and bottom edges look like they were soaked. Waviness/warping that I'm guessing happened from the extreme heat, and some form of exposure to condensation. And with it, some spots sweating and fogging similar to the kind you get when you leave a plastic bottle of water in the car on a hot day.

[CKB]

This site lists the melting point of Barex at 317 degrees C.

 

http://www.lookchem.com/cas-250/25014-41-9.html

 

[BrianR]

Not all the books that were effected were in direct sunlight. That was the craziest part of the whole situation. I could understand the HFH because it was a black cover, but the ASM 129 wasn't in direct sunlight. I would say they were in the spot for 3-4 hours. When I noticed them, I pulled all the books aside and looked them over, and half of them were fine, but the other half weren't. I cracked out the ASM 129 and it along with all the effected books look like bad lamination jobs. While this is bad in and of itself reminds me of a bad tint job on a car, I noticed that all the top and bottom edges look like they were soaked. Wavy/warping that I'm guessing happened from the extreme heat, and some form of exposure to condensation. And with it, some spots sweating and fogging similar to the kind you get when you leave a plastic bottle of water in the car on a hot day.

 

What was the humidity like that day?

 

Living in Arizona we get to temps over 110 degrees during which time I haven't had this happen, luckily. I ask because our levels of humidity are lower than most places except during monsoon season.

[comicwiz]

This site lists the melting point of Barex at 317 degrees C.

 

http://www.lookchem.com/cas-250/25014-41-9.html

 

Are you able to look-up Mylar on the same site?

[DiceX]

Damn, Joseph. That's horrible!

 

 

[BrianR]

Here are the properties of mylar.

mylar

[fantastic_four]

Not all the books that were effected were in direct sunlight. That was the craziest part of the whole situation.

 

The whole thing is crazy...I would expect people to keel over and die of heat exhaustion long before almost any type of comic bag melted, whether it be mylar, polypropylene, or barex....this is just bizarre.

 

Sorry for your loss!

[comicwiz]

Not all the books that were effected were in direct sunlight. That was the craziest part of the whole situation.

 

The whole thing is crazy...I would expect people to keel over and die of heat exhaustion long before almost any type of comic bag melted, whether it be mylar, polypropylene, or barex....this is just bizarre.

 

Sorry for your loss!

 

Thanks Dice and James - I'm counting my blessings because there were other CGC books in the exact same spot that had absolutely no damage whatsoever. There were a few books in Mylar that were unaffected as well. In fact, once I noticed that the Mylar books were fine, I added a few others and they were out for the remainder of the weekend.

 

Again, I am thankful because as I was talking to a customer, I noticed that the top of the inner well (near the label) was in a shriveled state. I cut our conversation short and when I took a closer, I noticed it had traveled down toward the book. Had I not noticed, I might have been out ten times that amount. I pulled them all out and put them in a cool spot but didn't have a chance to look at them until I arrived home.

 

Anyhow, I thought I'd let you guys know in case you ever decide to leave your books in a car on a warm day.

[Mark 1]

I am sorry to hear that. Now it certainly has me looking at my slabs that I bought looking for melting or rippling. I know a few of my slabs have a slight wave to the inner plastic but nothing that looks melted.

 

I can't imagine this happening and I think CGC should be notified.

[comicwiz]

The only thing I can think of is that the outer plastic encasement can act a bit like a magnifying glass (yeah I was one of those kids hunting down ants on sunny days), and maybe if there are other books in the same area, perhaps the cases can even reflect sunlight and heat. The sonically sealed inner well makes it impossible for any air exchange, and perhaps that is why the Mylar fared better. I can't explain how or why, and I can't speculate either because I didn't have a temperate reader, but I know it was a moderately humid day with some wind relief because it was situated right by the lakefront. As far as blame goes, I am more embarrassed about the whole thing than anything else, and I really should have known better. An expensive lesson, but certainly one that will make me be a little more careful about what I expose my books to, as well as those I purchase from abroad.

[comicdonna]

I recieved a book from another forumite today and noticed what can best be described as condensation in between the outer and inner shells of the slabbed book. Has this occured to anyone else? Will it eventually evaporate or should I consider reslabbibg it. Its a 6.0 JIM 82, so its neither a HG book nor a book you come across everyday boook.

Any help will be most appreciated.

 

 

This is an occasional effect produced by the inner and outer cases being in direct contact with one another. The visual effect is similar to oil on a water puddle because of the two plastics. If you gently seperate the two pieces or insert a piece of paper in the side of the case, this should remove this effect. Ultimately it is not anything that is in direct contact with your comic, nor will it affect the comic's condition over time.

I saw this once on a modern 9.8. The "oil" would move if you gently squeezed the slab. It kinda freaked me out at first.

[Turtle]

The only thing I can think of is that the outer plastic encasement can act a bit like a magnifying glass

 

This was my first thought when you posted it.

[seanfingh]

I'm no scientist, but there almost had to be something more in play than just heat/sunlight. A sealed up car can get up to 160-170 degrees in a Midwestern summer. Polyethylene melts at 250 F, which appears to be much lower than Barex and I have left polybagged comics in hot cars many times with no melting.

 

Could the slab be causing some kind of convection or other reaction?

 

 

Edit: Or it could be acting like a magnifying glass which makes waaaay more sense than convection. See, I said i was no scientist.

[comicdonna]

I almost didn't want to post this because I am really bummed out about it, but I had some $1400 in comics destroyed this weekend, which included high grade copies of ASM 129 and HFH 1.

 

The barex inner well melted right onto the covers.

 

Granted, we experienced a heat wave, and they were exposed for several hours as I was working an annual outdoor market, and I have to say that I am obviously disappointed, but also surprised that the barex would not be heat stable enough to withstand from melting. I had books in mylar in the exact same spot for two entire days and they weren't damaged.

 

A few of the books which didn't happen to get cooked had a little bit of warping to them at the top outer edge. I imagine that this would be no different for books sitting at a sorting facility, in a truck, and exposed to extreme heat during the hot summer months.

Wow, this is horrible Joseph.

[comicwiz]

Here are the properties of mylar.

mylar

 

If I'm reading this correctly, it says that the melting point is 254 degrees C - that's lower than barex, and yet the Mylar (even the Mylites with flaps that seal) stood up.

[comicwiz]

Edit: Or it could be acting like a magnifying glass which makes waaaay more sense than convection. See, I said i was no scientist.

 

Good points - maybe both?

[DarkKnightReturns]

Post some pics

[comicwiz]

Post some pics

 

 

And with this request, I just had a flashback of that picture someone posted from an SDCC report with the kid who was holding a sign with a hole in it asking to poke a pen through his eye