OK, you mugs, gimme the lowdown on Pre-Code Crime 2 2

[MisterX]

I'm thinking of dipping into the Atom Age, Pre-Code Horror and maybe Crime as well.

 

I recently finished the EC Archive of Crime Suspenstories, and really enjoyed it. Plus, there's some cool Alex Toth reprints from Crime and Punishment in the Toth Reader V2 published by Pure Imagination.

 

Is Shock Suspenstories considered Pre-Code Crime? Cuz I like those, too.

 

But that's all the Pre-Code crime I've read. Don't know much else about it. Well, except in every OPG the advisors repeatedly state Crime is a "slow seller"...

 

So, what titles/ covers / artists / issues would you all recommend? And is the market as dead as the advisors claim?

 

Thoughts and scans, please!

[Scrooge]

Crime is pretty slow moving I would say.

 

What you have to realize is that Crime had a burst of ebullience in the market circa 1951 - 1953 and publishers, as they are wont to do, flooded the market with titles upon titles and there is an awful amount of tripe in there. Many Crime books have hum-hum stories. For example, I love Atlas books but Goodman, IMO, didn't put a single good Crime book so avoid Atlas Pre-Code Crime. Some of the better ones were put out by second-tier outfit, esp. (again IMO) by Avon / Realistic and Trojan. I would give those a look.

 

Word of warning: some publishers ran the old bait-and-switch by having really gory covers but rather tame interiors. This is not true for Horror but I find it more so for Crime. For example, titles like Fight Against Crime or The Perfect Crime have great covers but so-so interiors.

 

My 2¢ until others come and correct me.

[Forbush-Man]

Crime is pretty slow moving I would say.

 

What you have to realize is that Crime had a burst of ebullience in the market circa 1951 - 1953 and publishers, as they are wont to do, flooded the market with titles upon titles and there is an awful amount of tripe in there. Many Crime books have hum-hum stories. For example, I love Atlas books but Goodman, IMO, didn't put a single good Crime book so avoid Atlas Pre-Code Crime. Some of the better ones were put out by second-tier outfit, esp. (again IMO) by Avon / Realistic and Trojan. I would give those a look.

 

Word of warning: some publishers ran the old bait-and-switch by having really gory covers but rather tame interiors. This is not true for Horror but I find it more so for Crime. For example, titles like Fight Against Crime or The Perfect Crime have great covers but so-so interiors.

 

My 2¢ until others come and correct me.

 

You are a scholar. (thumbs u

[catrick339]

You get some decent stories in the granddaddy of them all, Crime Does Not Pay, especially the early issues, and I have a warm glow for most issues of Authentic Police Cases.

 

But Scrooge is right, a lot of the 50's crime books are humdrum.

[Cimm]

Yeah, Scrooge pretty much nailed it. Pre-Code Crime is very hit-and-miss, and has more cool covers than cool stories, and Avon-Realistic, of the books I've managed to acquire, are the real standouts.

 

Avon's "The Unknown Man", "It Rhymes With Lust", "The Hooded Menace", and "Underworld Story" are all very cool, and definitely worth tracking down...

 

 

Also, St-John's "Authentic Police Cases" is a cool title with some worthy interiors...

 

[Duffman_Comics]

Great books, Cimm.

 

I like pre-code crime and will pick it up when I can find it. I'll contribute one of my favourite books that doesn't show up all that often.

 

It's "Crime Does Not Pay" #22 and #24 with a new cover, circa 1944:

 

[adamstrange]

You get some decent stories in the granddaddy of them all, Crime Does Not Pay, especially the early issues

Definitely good material in CDNP!

 

Fight Against Crime past issue 10 or so is considered a horror book with particularly gruesome stories. Not that that's a bad thing.

[BB-Gun]

Great books, Cimm.

 

I like pre-code crime and will pick it up when I can find it. I'll contribute one of my favourite books that doesn't show up all that often.

 

It's "Crime Does Not Pay" #22 and #24 with a new cover, circa 1944:

 

 

I like the early CDNP covers!

[PreHero]

Best time to buy is when prices and demand are low!

 

You can't miss with ECs, esp. Crime Suspenstories - just great stuff. Not sure Shock Suspenstories is straight crime, but well worth the search. You might consider pre-trend books like Crime Patrol and War Against Crime -maybe not as polished as the later stuff, but same group of creators. Also, the New Trend magazines like Crime Illustrated and Shock Illustrated, have great EC artists in B&W.

 

Crime Does Not Pay is another classic title. Early issues tends to be rare and pricey, but later issues are cheap. Don't have any, but others should be able to give you some tips. Lev Gleason also later put out a magazine called Tops with a little crime stuff. Very cool, but rare.

 

True Crimes is another great title with lots of Jack Cole in the first few issues - can't top Cole for story and art.

 

Justice Traps the Guilty and Real Clue Crime with lots of Simon and Kirby art and a few Krigstein pieces thrown in might be worth a gamble.

 

Finally, for a more hero/crime crossover, you might try Shadow Comics (yes, a stretch) with Powell art in later issues, and Clue Comics, which changed to crime with #10 (and later Real Clue). Heck, I'll even toss in Police Comics with Plastic Man (more Cole) and The Spirit ("the" classic crimefighter ) - contents changes to crime with #103.

 

And some scans...

[rjpb]

Fair warning - nothing else will compare to EC for consistently top-notch crime stories and art, but there is some other great stuff out there. A few things come to mind - and with a little search you should be able to locate the dormant Pre-code Crime thread in the GA section, with lots of great covers and nuggets of info.

 

True Crime #1 and #2 show Jack Cole at his best, and are classics of the genre.

 

Dynamite #3 - #9 feature Pete Morisi's Johnny Dynamite, the best tough guy private eye of pre-code era, in stories featuring dope, prostitution and large portions of cynicism.

 

Wanted #52 has the classic "Cult of Killers' by Harry Anderson.

 

Who is Next is a solid read all the way through.

 

Underworld #1- #3 (D.S. publishing) contain some of the most brutal crime stories published. (especially #3)

 

The early issues of Crime Does Not Pay can be hit or miss as to individual stories, but have their share of solid offerings.

 

I think Simon & Kirby's best work was their Crime stuff, and the early issues of Crime Does Not Pay and Justice traps the Guilty are good reads.

 

Law-Crime #1 and #3 not only have great L.B. Cole covers, but excellent stories by him as well.

 

"The Giggling Killer" story in Exposed #2 is worth getting for the splash page alone.

 

 

For the most part Crime comics from the 1940s are more graphic than from the 50s ( EC books aside).

 

 

 

[Scrooge]

For the most part Crime comics from the 1940s are more graphic than from the 50s ( EC books aside).

 

That is a great comment and a very helpful guideline when collecting Crime books.

 

I have written in the past about Crime books. Here are a couple of old posts of mine here for your consideration:

 

This is a good time to try to implement a new Crime Organization. Following J. Fred MacDonald's ideas from "Don't Touch that Dial; Radio Programming in American Life from 1920 to 1950," we can attempt to categorize Crime comic books.

 

According to MacDonald, “[…] There are three strategic criteria which appeared in all detective shows: 1) the attitude of the program toward crime and its solution; 2) the function of the central character’s personality; and 3) the view of life and society presented in the story – and depending upon the emphasis within each series, radio detective programs can be divided into three distinctive types: Realistic Detective, Glamorous Detective, and Neo-Realistic Detective.”

 

Here's a summary of each of these genres:

 

1) Realistic Detective programs are traditional, conservative, and ploddingly rational in their approach to solving crimes. The stress of the series is upon the logical process by which crime is solved. In these programs crime is an undesirable dimension of social reality. Everything in such programs, from the personality of the detective to the perspective it presented on life and society, is peripheral and without strategic value to the more realistic goal of finding the villain and thereby carrying out justice.”

 

Shows such as: The Eno Crime Club which aired Tuesdays with the clues and on Wednesdays the final act acting out the solution was aired, The Adventures of Ellery Queen, The Adventures of Sherlock Holmes, True Detective Mysteries, 20,000 Years in Sing-Sing, Homicide Squad, Calling All Cars, Tales of the Oklahoma Highway Patrol, Gangbusters, G-Men, Counterspy, Mr. District Attorney, Policewoman, Treasury Agent, Special Investigator, Dr. Standish: Medical Examiner, …

 

2) In Glamorous Detective programs, the embellishment of characters with irrelevant or peripheral traits was as much a part of the program as the story line. Here, listeners found their traditional “whodunit” augmented with the likes of trivial conversations between the hero and the people he encountered, loquacious descriptions, comedic relationships between the hero and his partner, and even sexual tensions between male and female characters. The process of investigation and apprehension was not insignificant in these programs, and neither was the general image of the society they projected. Often, however, such matters seemed more a concession to logic than a deliberate emphasis of the program. Instead, the Glamorous Detective series presented listeners with a personalized, attractive, and familiar recurring character that an audience could like for his charm and wit, even more than for his investigatory brilliance.”

 

Shows such as: The Fat Man, The Thin Man, The Adventures of Chick Carter, The Adventures of Leonidas Witheral, Mr. and Mrs. North; Yours Truly, Johnny Dollar; The Shadow, The Green Hornet, Murder and Mr. Malone; Casey, Crime Photographer; The Adventures of Father Brown; Blackstone, the Magic Detective; The Case Book of Gregory Hood, Mr. Mercury, The Saint; Richard Diamond, Private Detective; Boston Blackie, The New Adventures of Mike Shayne, The Falcon, Charlie Chan, Philo Vance, Let George Do It, Nero Wolfe, …

 

3) The hallmark of the Neo-Realistic format was its emphasis upon crime as a symptom of deeper social sickness. The likable personalities that dominated the Glamorous series now gave way to a group of disillusioned, embittered men who reluctantly went about their professions. These characters usually expressed an abusive tone when dealing with others – be they clients, criminals, police, or bystanders. They also articulated a general disdain for most of the positive symbols of civilization and social order. Instead of stressing the rational process of crime detection found prominently in the Realistic pattern, these programs emphasized ugly crimes investigated by brutalized detectives existing within a depressingly grim environment.

 

Shows such as: Twenty-First Precinct, Pat Novak for hire, Broadway Is My Beat, The Line Up, The Man from Homicide; Jeff Regan, Investigator; Dyke Easter, Detective; Johnny Madero, Pier 23; Dragnet, …"

 

Consequently, I have tried to organize the Crime comic books from March 1952 into these three categories and find that there are:

 

1) 17 Realistic series - All True Crime Cases, Amazing Detective Cases, Big Town, Crime and Justice, Crime Can't Win, Crime Cases, Crime Detective Comics, Crime Exposed, Crime Must Lose!, Ellery Queen, Fugitives from Justice, Gang Busters, Headline Comics, Justice Comics, Justice Traps the Guilty, Mr. District Attorney, Real Clue Crime Stories.

 

2) 9 Glamorous series - Crime Clinic, Crime Smashers, Ken Shannon, Kerry Drake Detective Cases, Mike Barnett, Man against Crime, Police Comics, Rocky Jorden, Private Eye, Spirit, T-Man

 

3) 14 Neo-Realistic series - All-Famous Crime, Crime and Punishment, Crime Does Not Pay, Crime Fighting Detective, Crime Must Pay the Penalty, Crime Suspenstories, Down with Crime, Famous Gangsters (Lucky Luciano), Gangsters and Gun Molls, Murderous Gangsters, Perfect Crime, Police Lineup, Thrilling Crime Cases, Wanted Comics.

 

I welcome any comment / discussion on my assigning books to any particular category.

 

Pick a genre and stick with it I'd say. From my first post in the new thread, you can see I tend to prefer the Neo-Realistic series myself: more graphic and gritty in tone.

 

Elsewhere I re-posted information from another website but that should be useful to you as well:

 

The Crime Boss website is well ahead of me and offers this analysis about Crime comic tenure:

 

"How many anthology crime comics--that is, those not devoted to a primary character, such as Tracy or Mr. District Attorney--ran as many as 25 issues?

 

Crime Does Not Pay from Lev Gleason, which had the anthology crime comic genre to itself from 1942-46, had the longest run from #22 in 1942 through #147 in 1955. Gleason’s other crime title, Crime and Punishment, ran 74 issues from 1948-55.

 

Prize/Crestwood published the second-longest running title, Justice Traps the Guilty, with #1-92 from 1947-58. The company also published a companion crime title, Headline Comics, #23-77.

 

The other long-running crime titles were: Marvel’s All-True Crime (Official True Crime for its first two issues) #24-52 and Justice Comics (Tales of Justice for the last 16 issues) #7-67.

 

Hillman’s Real Clue Crime Stories and Crime Detective, which ran 72 and 32 issues, respectively, in volume numbers.

 

Our Publishing’s Wanted Comics #9-53; St. John’s Authentic Police Cases #1-38; Ace’s Crime Must Pay the Penalty (just Penalty for its last two issues) #33 and #2-48.

 

DC’s Detective Comics (26 issues before Batman) and Gang Busters #1-67.

 

EC’s 27 issues of Crime SuspenStories.

 

Quality’s Police Comics #103-127 (following the abandonment of Plastic Man and other heroes).

 

Cross’s Perfect Crime #1-33.

 

No single comic book publisher ever really succeeded with more than two crime titles!

 

To be sure, there were many short-lived crime comics. The only major reference work on the subject, Benton’s Crime Comics from Taylor Publishing, lists some 115 anthology titles published from 1947-59. But their combined output was less than 700 issues! In other words, most crime comics were dismal financial failures.

 

As far as crime comics devoted to a single character, they were generally a flop. Benton lists some 44 of these through the 1950s, the vast majority of them based on characters first introduced in other media including the comic strips.

 

The only long-running single-character crime comic in history was Tracy, which ran #1-145 from Dell (#1-24) and Harvey (#25 on) from 1948-61, following several earlier one-shot appearances. [...] I wouldn’t be surprised if Tracy might have been one of those comic books read as often by adults as by children.

 

Ironically, DC Comics (then known as National Comics) published the No. 2 and 3 longest-running characters, both of them based on radio and television shows: Mr. District Attorney #1-67 from 1948-59 and Big Town #1-50 from 1950-58.

 

DC’s crime comics rarely departed from good taste, although a few of the early issues of Gang Busters were pretty gamy by DC standards. I can’t imagine too many parents objecting to them.

 

Mr. District Attorney and Big Town (starring the adventures of Illustrated Press editor Steve Wilson) are two of the most underrated of all comics in any genre. Their plot-heavy stories were always filled with gimmicks rather than violence and are still a joy to read. They are also among the few comics from the 1950s that still seem fresh today.

 

Only one other single character, newspaper strip detective Kerry Drake from Magazine Enterprises and Harvey, ran as many as 33 issues--unless you want to count that wonderful plague of spies and saboteurs in T-Man from Quality Comics.

 

The T-Man, Pete Trask, starred in 38 issues of his own title, running from 1950 until Quality folded at the end of 1956. He also starred in Police Comics. He was one of the characters not picked up by DC when it bought the rights to Quality, with his time apparently having passed with the diminished feeling about the Red Scare in the United States.

 

T-Man was the longest-running series based on an entirely original comic book character. Another such outstanding character from Quality, Ken Shannon, ran in Police Comics #103-127 and in 10 issues of his own title."

 

You should check out The Crime Boss website if it's still running.

 

Hope this helps.

[Point Five]

Great commentary!

 

... wonderful plague of spies and saboteurs in T-Man from Quality Comics.

 

The T-Man, Pete Trask, starred in 38 issues of his own title, running from 1950 until Quality folded at the end of 1956. He also starred in Police Comics. He was one of the characters not picked up by DC when it bought the rights to Quality, with his time apparently having passed with the diminished feeling about the Red Scare in the United States.

 

T-Man was the longest-running series based on an entirely original comic book character. Another such outstanding character from Quality, Ken Shannon, ran in Police Comics #103-127 and in 10 issues of his own title."

I've always flirted with these two runs -- love the Reed Crandall covers.

 

 

[TheWatcher]

Go here, download one of the comic viewers and read to your heart's content. See which titles tickle your fancy, as people's tastes are different. They only have books in the public domain, but it'll give you an idea in regards to content of various pre-code crime/horror titles

[Ze-man]

I love threads like this. Good advice paired with even better covers.

 

Which I unfortunately have neither of.

 

[bronzilla]

Ok I really think Pulps should be thrown into this mix, due to the amazing stories and relevance to the era when pre-code crime was in its heyday. Plus the covers are awesome!!

 

THE SHADOW

 

BLACK MASK

 

ACE-HIGH DETECTIVE

 

NICKEL DETECTIVE

 

DETECTIVE STORY MAGAZINE

 

THE SPIDER

 

PRISON STORIES ( easily the rarest)

 

There are many many more, and many of these can still be had for prettty cheap.

Sorry to intrude boys, just wanted to throw this out there! (thumbs u

[Cimm]

Ok I really think Pulps should be thrown into this mix, due to the amazing stories and relevance to the era when pre-code crime was in its heyday. Plus the covers are awesome!!

 

THE SHADOW

 

BLACK MASK

 

ACE-HIGH DETECTIVE

 

NICKEL DETECTIVE

 

DETECTIVE STORY MAGAZINE

 

THE SPIDER

 

PRISON STORIES ( easily the rarest)

 

 

 

There are many many more, and many of these can still be had for prettty cheap.

Sorry to intrude boys, just wanted to throw this out there! (thumbs u

 

Totally agree.

 

 

 

 

[bronzilla]

Nice stuff!!

 

Cimm, have you ever seen a Prison Stories pulp come up for sale?

[Cimm]

Nice stuff!!

 

Cimm, have you ever seen a Prison Stories pulp come up for sale?

 

Once... I was the underbidder

[bronzilla]

Bummer.

 

If you dont allready have a copy of this you should snag one. Pretty much the only way to read these classic stories:

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/CITY-NUMBERED-MEN-BEST-PRISON-STORIES-1st-ed-/370334154259?pt=US_Fiction_Books&hash=item5639a2be13

[Doohickamabob]

"The Giggling Killer" story in Exposed #2 is worth getting for the splash page alone.

 

Seconded! This is the nastiest crime story I've ever seen. Completely brutal.